Dáil debates

Wednesday, 19 October 2016

Ceisteanna - Questions

Cabinet Committee Meetings

2:10 pm

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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3. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on justice reform last met. [30554/16]

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The Cabinet committee on justice reform last met on 6 July 2016. The date for its next meeting has not been scheduled but it will take place shortly.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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Am I right in saying this is October?

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Yes. Next month is November.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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This very important sub-committee has not met since July and there are ongoing controversies and allegations about a concerted campaign within An Garda Síochána to discredit a whistleblower. We have a very senior former head of the Garda press office saying there was an organised campaign in senior Garda management to destroy the reputation of one of these whistleblowers. As I understand it, he is properly admitting his role in this and also implicating other senior managers, including, apparently, the Garda Commissioner. The Garda Commissioner has denied these claims but it is claimed that Superintendent Taylor believes the text messages on his phone will prove the existence of this campaign. That is a big issue.

I know Mr. Justice O'Neill has been appointed by the Minister to review all this but are we sure the relevant information relating to this review will be made available? In particular, will there be access to Superintendent Taylor's phone? I am sure the Taoiseach accepts that this comes on the back of ongoing controversies, as many as five reports, the resignation of a Minister and, as the Taoiseach rather eloquently put it, the retirement of a former Garda Commissioner. Does the Taoiseach accept that all of this could deter other potential whistleblowers coming forward, which is not good for Garda morale or public confidence? Will the Taoiseach give us some indication around the terms of reference for Mr. Justice O'Neill and whether he will have this information? Will he give a firm commitment to the Dáil to publish this report immediately and hold a Dáil debate on it?

There is also the big issue of the impending strike by An Garda Síochána. I welcome the news that the Minister for Justice and Equality is to fast-track the process for giving the Garda access to the Workplace Relations Commission and the Labour Court. That is good but if I understand it properly, this will require new legislation. If this report is true, when will the Government publish the legislation? Will it be put in place so there is a chance of averting this strike?

I raised the following matter consistently. We took issue with the Government retaining the power to appoint the Garda Commissioner and the deputy Garda commissioner. Under the policing Act of 2015 the Policing Authority is supposed to have responsibility for the appointment of assistant commissioners, chief superintendents and superintendents, and in May the Government appointed four of the eight vacancies at assistant Garda commissioner level. In July it appointed ten chief superintendents and 18 superintendents. The chair of the Policing Authority has told the Oireachtas Committee on Justice and Equality of her disappointment at the Government's failure to hand over the powers to appoint senior officers.

When were these decisions taken and what role does the Cabinet committee on justice reform have? These are supposed to be issues of reform and yet the Government clings to these powers, contrary to all the high-sounding rhetoric we had in the past. Will the Government pass this over to the Policing Authority and, if so, when will it do so? If not, why not?

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The Cabinet sub-committee discusses a range of issues relating to the Garda, policing and crime in general, making its recommendations or dealing with requests from the Minister for Justice and Equality of the day, who is the Tánaiste in this case. As Deputy Adams is aware, under the Protected Disclosures Act 2014, a worker employed in a public body may make a protected disclosure to a Minister in the Government on whom any function relating to that public body is conferred. On 3 October this year, the Tánaiste received correspondence under the Protected Disclosures Act 2014 from two members of An Garda Síochána. Under that Act, the Tánaiste may say nothing publicly that might identify the persons making the disclosures. She cannot comment on the accuracy or otherwise of reports appearing in the media about the nature of the disclosures. It is vital that the claims of people making such disclosures are properly addressed. It is also important to ensure the rights of individuals like this to fairness and proper procedures are prepared for. Deputy Adams is aware of that.

Having consulted the Attorney General, the Tánaiste asked Mr. Justice Iarfhlaith O'Neill, a former judge of the High Court, having regard to the provisions of the Protected Disclosures Act 2014, to review the allegations of wrongdoing that were contained in the disclosures. That included making any inquiries with the persons or bodies that he considers appropriate with respect to the review; reporting to the Tánaiste within six weeks on the conclusions of the review, including any recommendations that he may consider necessary on any further action that may be appropriate and warranted arising from the allegations made; and that on the conclusion of the review, the Tánaiste will consider what further steps may be necessary. That is the process and it relates to a very specific section of a very specific Act for very good reasons. Whistleblowers perform a very important function in the public interest and they must be respected and protected when giving their disclosures. That is why the legislation is the way it is.

The Deputy mentioned the Policing Authority and referred to its powers. This brings a dedicated layer of public oversight to the administration of policing services and it also provides a new engine to drive reforms of the policing system and practices in order that the Garda Síochána can be seen to be fit to deal with emerging challenges of policing in the 21st century.

There are several important points to note here. The Policing Authority is responsible for approving a three-year strategy statement and the annual policing plan submitted by the Garda Commissioner. The authority must establish and publish within 12 months - that is, by the end of 2016 - a code of ethics that includes standards of conduct and practice for members of An Garda Síochána. The authority will hold at least quarterly meetings in public. As the Deputy knows, a fourth public meeting for 2016 took place on 29 September. The authority is enabled to request the Garda Síochána Ombudsman Commission to investigate any policing matter which gives rise to a concern that a member of the Garda may have committed an offence or behaved in a manner that would justify disciplinary proceedings. The authority may, subject to the consent of the Minister, request GSOC to investigate any behaviour of the Garda Commissioner in the context of his or her functions relating to policing matters, examine procedures or practices of the Garda in regard to policing matters in general, and request, as deemed necessary, the Garda Inspectorate to initiate an inspection or inquiry in respect of aspects of the operation or administration of the Garda.

The Policing Authority, therefore, has significant powers. It can hold the Garda to account, with senior Garda management reporting to the authority, including via public meetings. It may determine Garda priorities in respect of policing services. It may nominate persons for appointment by the Government to the posts of Garda Commissioner and deputy Garda commissioner. It will appoint persons to the ranks of Garda superintendent, chief superintendent and assistant commissioner, and may remove them for reasons related to policing services. It may appoint persons to senior positions within the Garda civilian staff. The Policing Authority takes up those responsibilities following the last appointments that were made.

The Garda Commissioner does not account to the Policing Authority on national security issues, the latter being a function of Government. Under the new oversight arrangements, the Garda Commissioner will report to the Policing Authority in respect of policing matters and to the Minister for Justice and Equality on security matters.

2:20 pm

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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I am aware of the powers of the Policing Authority. Indeed, Sinn Féin made a detailed submission to the Government at the time of the authority's establishment based on our experience of the Patten commission on police reform in the North. My question in this regard was very specific. The Taoiseach may have given me the answer in the midst of the other verbiage he delivered but, if so, I did not pick up on it. I asked about the situation whereby the Government still retains the authority to appoint senior officers to the Garda Síochána when that power should have passed to the Policing Authority. The chairperson of the authority has expressed her disappointment at the Government's failure to implement that transfer of powers.

The other question I asked, which the Taoiseach ignored, concerns media reports that the Minister for Justice and Equality is to fast-track the process for giving members of the Garda access to the Workplace Relations Commission and the Labour Court. If the reports are accurate, they are welcome. I asked when the legislation I presume is required to allow this will be published and if it will be enacted in a timely fashion so that it can be used to avert the threatened strike.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The Government's position in this matter is clear, namely, that we intend to transfer the authority to make appointments to senior positions within the Garda to the Policing Authority.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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It has not been done.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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No appointments have been made in the recent past by Government to the higher ranks of the Garda in the way that used to pertain.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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What about the appointments made in May and July?

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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As I understand it, that function has been transferred but I will clarify it for the Deputy. It is one of the critical functions of the Policing Authority to be independent of anything to do with Government.

Regarding threatened strike action by members of the Garda, I have heard claims that the John Horgan report, which is due very shortly, might not be available to the public pay commission, which Government approved yesterday, if the commission decided to have particular expertise made available to it in drafting a report in respect of, for instance, the pay and conditions of gardaí, teachers, nurses and so on. I wish to clarify that Professor Horgan's report will of course be available to the commission. We are waiting to see how the professor might set out what he considers to be the appropriate strategy to adopt to allow for the principle of access to the Workplace Relations Commission and the Labour Court for members of An Garda Síochána. If that is his recommendation and he points out how it should be done, the Minister for Justice and Equality will, I assume, act very quickly on it.

Did Deputy Adams's reference to an expression of disappointment by a chairperson refer to the chairperson of the Policing Authority or the chairperson of the Garda Síochána Ombudsman Commission?

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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I referred to the chairperson of the Policing Authority.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I have dealt with that. In respect of GSOC, I noted the view expressed by its very fine chairperson, Ms Justice Mary Ellen Ring, that some powers were lacking in the ombudsman commission. I have spoken to the Minister for Justice and Equality about this and see no reason we cannot act in this regard. If the chairperson of the commission, who is an eminent member of the Judiciary, says it needs particular powers in a certain area, there is no reason those powers should not be transferred. After all, GSOC is an independent body set up by Government for a specific purpose. As such, it should be given every opportunity to do its work.