Dáil debates

Wednesday, 13 July 2016

Ceisteanna - Questions

Taoiseach's Meetings and Engagements

1:25 pm

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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1. To ask the Taoiseach if he had bilateral discussions or meetings with any EU leaders regarding when Article 50 of the Lisbon treaty should be activated; and his response in this regard. [19356/16]

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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2. To ask the Taoiseach to report on any issues he raised and any bilateral meetings he attended at the European Council meeting. [19428/16]

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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3. To ask the Taoiseach the European leaders he has talked to or met since the result of the UK exit referendum. [19429/16]

Photo of Mick BarryMick Barry (Cork North Central, Anti-Austerity Alliance)
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4. To ask the Taoiseach to report on the meetings he had with other EU leaders in Brussels during the recent two-day summit on Brexit. [19474/16]

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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5. To ask the Taoiseach the detail of any bilateral meetings he had at the European Council meetings on 28 and 29 June 2016; and the items discussed at them. [19831/16]

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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6. To ask the Taoiseach if he met directly or spoke to the British Prime Minister, Mr. David Cameron, before, around or after the European Council meeting on 28 and 29 June 2016; the items that were discussed; and if free movement, free trade and borders were mentioned. [19832/16]

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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7. To ask the Taoiseach to report on discussions he had with European leaders on the margins of the European Council meeting of 28 and 29 June 2016 and has had since then. [20700/16]

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I propose to take Questions Nos. 1 to 7, inclusive, together.

I had a short telephone call with Prime Minister Cameron on Friday, 24 June last. I indicated my regret at the outcome of the UK referendum and my respect for the democratic decision of the UK electorate. I expressed my appreciation for the close working relationship we shared over a period of unprecedented warmth in relations between our two countries. He echoed these sentiments and agreed that the bilateral relationship will remain a joint priority for both Governments, with a special focus on Northern Ireland. Obviously, Mr. Cameron is leaving office today. In this regard, on Monday, 27 June last, I spoke to First Minister Foster and Deputy First Minister McGuinness to underline that issues likely to affect Northern Ireland and the North-South relationship will be top priorities for the Government in future negotiations. I also spoke to First Minister Sturgeon of Scotland.

While I did not have any formal bilateral meetings with other European leaders at the European Council on 28 June or at the informal meeting of 27 member states the following day, I spoke specifically to Prime Minister Cameron about the common travel area, the peace process and the open Border situation. I had short exchanges with a number of other leaders, including Chancellor Merkel, President Hollande, President Tusk and President Juncker. The issues we discussed were mostly those addressed in the 29 June statement, about which I addressed the House on 5 July in my report on the European Council meeting.

I took every opportunity at the European Council and in the other discussions, to underline our unique relationship with the UK and our concerns regarding Northern Ireland, North-South relations, the common travel area and trade between the UK and Ireland. At the European Council and since then, Prime Minister Cameron has spoken along exactly the same lines. We have been emphasising these points to our EU partners for some time. They are widely understood and appreciated. I reiterated these concerns when I travelled to Berlin yesterday to meet Chancellor Merkel. She fully acknowledges and is understanding of our perspective. She has assured me that we share the objective of constructive negotiations towards a close future relationship between the EU and the UK. I also took the opportunity to highlight Ireland's strong commitment to EU membership, as I have in my discussions with all our counterparts. We agreed that we must use the period of reflection before Article 50 of the EU treaties is triggered to address how the difficulties facing the EU can be overcome and the confidence of citizens can be increased.

President Hollande is planning to visit Ireland on 21 July next for a Somme commemorative event and a bilateral meeting. I am sure the EU-UK question will be the major issue for discussion at our meeting. With regard to events in the UK over recent days, I hope to have an early opportunity to speak to David Cameron's successor as Prime Minister, Theresa May, once the formalities of her appointment are confirmed.

1:35 pm

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Taoiseach for his reply. With a new Prime Minister taking office today, we should be moving forward with a greater degree of certainty in the relationship with Britain and on the Brexit question. There has been much uncertainty in the past three weeks, but matters have moved much faster than originally anticipated. Some of the coverage of yesterday's meeting in Berlin with the German Chancellor, Angela Merkel, is reading too much into what she said. Nobody could reasonably object to the idea that we need to know what the United Kingdom is seeking before we can agree a way to respond to it. There appears to be an idea developing in certain sections of the Tory Party that the timing for triggering Article 50 is to be used as a negotiating weapon. That is of no help to anybody. We cannot all be held to ransom, particularly by those who demanded Brexit, while they try to figure out what they meant and what they want. The uncertainty can cause economic harm and damage the global economic situation, particularly in Europe. Article 50 should be triggered sooner rather than later. We all had accepted the September timeline as being reasonable to give the London Government time to arrive at its basic position and then trigger Article 50. What is the Taoiseach's view? Has he made this point to the UK Government and will he make it when he meets and speaks to the new Prime Minister?

Mr. David Cameron leaves office having, unfortunately, presided over the debacle of the Brexit referendum which was poorly planned. It was poor judgment to call a referendum in the first instance. I realise the Taoiseach had a reasonably good personal relationship with Mr. Cameron, although I am not sure how that was reflected in substantial policy outcomes. Mr. Cameron neglected Northern Ireland to an excessive degree and probably indulged anti-European Union rhetoric too much. In the last while he probably took this on board to an excessive degree and I believe it had an impact on the subsequent result. The referendum result has and will continue to have an enormous impact. It was an enormous risk to take without any plan B or thought being given to what would happen if the Brexit vote was won. It is now too late to stop it. It is going to happen, but we must ensure British policy changes. The Taoiseach has indicated that he envisages speaking to the new Prime Minister shortly. Will he indicate when he expects a meeting to take place? Will he seek an early summit on Northern Ireland? Obviously, it would include a discussion on the Brexit negotiations, but it would also cover the need to restore political faith in the political process and ensure greater momentum.

The Taoiseach indicated previously to the House that officials of the State were to meet British officials for preparatory discussions on the common travel area and to prepare the ground for the Brexit talks. Have the officials met? Is there an acceptance on the British side of the need to deal with the Border issue? Are there signs of flexibility in how they envisage this unfolding? What new full-time resources have been assigned in the Taoiseach's Department to work on Brexit and have staff been delegated from other Departments to work on it?

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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Given the worrying rise of political forces in Britain who have traded on anti-immigrant sentiment which is dangerous and, frankly, racist, will the Taoiseach join me in wishing Mr. Jeremy Corbyn the best of luck in the Labour Party leadership battle? A victory for him is the best hope some politics might emerge in Britain that will move in a more progressive direction, particularly in view of his unconditional support for the rights of migrants and immigrants in Britain. He is thoroughly anti-racist and in the aftermath of the Chilcot report, anti-war, unlike the discredited Blairite rump that is now trying to stab him in the back. Perhaps the Taoiseach might respond to that brief question.

My main question relates to the European Union and the debate and controversy into which it has been thrown, particularly in the light of Brexit. When there have been questions raised and criticisms made of the European Union, it has presented itself as the benign and progressive force in European politics. Does the Taoiseach think there is a supreme irony and hypocrisy in the fact that it is the European Union which claims it supports the free movement of people which might be the obstacle in the way of the free movement of people between Britain and Ireland? It demonstrates that the European Union's commitment to the free movement of people and internationalism stops at the borders of Europe, at frontier Europe, even in so far as it may affect us and our relationship with our nearest neighbour, Britain. Does the Taoiseach agree that he must be steadfast in pointing out to the European Union that if it claims to be committed to the free movement of people, that free movement should extend beyond the borders of fortress Europe, be it between Britain and Ireland or to poor Syrian refugees who are trying to get into the European Union?

Did the Taoiseach raise at the European Council the recommendations made by the Committee on Housing and Homelessness? The committee urged the Government to urgently seek flexibility from the European Commission in the application of EU fiscal rules to the financing of social housing. That is what the all-party committee established by the Dáil to deal with the social housing emergency asked the Government to raise with the European Union. Will the Union give us flexibility under these crazy fiscal rules that are preventing us from spending even our own money to provide the social housing we urgently need? Did the Taoiseach raise that issue? Will he insist on us being given such flexibility or will he only insist on what I heard the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform, Deputy Paschal Donohoe, say, that Ireland might leave the European Union if it dares to do anything about corporation tax? That appears to be a red line issue for the Government. Is it a red line issue for the Taoiseach to go to the European Council to demand flexibility under EU fiscal rules to deal with the biggest crisis facing the country in order that we can make the investment required in the provision of urgently needed council housing?

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
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I could call Deputies Mick Barry and Gerry Adams to ask more questions, but the Taoiseach would not have a chance to respond.

Photo of Mick BarryMick Barry (Cork North Central, Anti-Austerity Alliance)
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My question is short. The Foreign Ministers of the six nations that founded the European Union met separately on at least three occasions before the Brexit referendum and again afterwards. Representatives of this state were not invited to attend those meetings. That is very strange. I can only imagine what the reaction might be if Irish representatives met representatives of five other EU member states without German representatives being invited. During his visit did the Taoiseach mention this exclusive meeting to EU leaders?

In particular, did the Taoiseach raise it with Chancellor Merkel?

1:45 pm

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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I know that the new arrangements for taking Taoiseach's Questions will be reviewed, but I note that the leader of Fianna Fáil and the Taoiseach took half the time.

Photo of Mick BarryMick Barry (Cork North Central, Anti-Austerity Alliance)
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Absolutely.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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So I now have a minute and a half to speak.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I had three questions on that section and Deputy Adams had none.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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No, I had a question.

Photo of Mick BarryMick Barry (Cork North Central, Anti-Austerity Alliance)
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You take half the time when you have one down.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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The Deputy did the same to me the other day.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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Address it through the Chair.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
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Deputy Adams has one question.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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Deputy Martin is at it again. Will you ask him to please let me have my say uninterrupted?

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
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Yes, go ahead Deputy Adams.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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I really would not have expected Chancellor Merkel to say anything different from what she said yesterday, but as a number of people acknowledged, things have moved on since then. Theresa May, MP, becomes British Prime Minister today. That change in Downing Street has moved more quickly than expected. She has said she will not consider triggering Article 50 until next year.

This is vitally important, in that as Prime Minister she is equal co-guarantor of the Good Friday Agreement. That is an international Agreement. We have been advocating for some time for the Taoiseach to enlist international support for it. Mrs. May has said that she wants to scrap the Human Rights Act, which is a fundamental cornerstone of the Agreement. She has also indicated that she wants to do away with other human rights aspects of it. Did the Taoiseach raise this with Chancellor Merkel? If he did, did he make it clear that the Irish Government will not countenance or tolerate any action by the British Government if it undermines the integrity of these international Agreements?

On Brexit, I met members of the East Border Region Group last week, which covers six council areas each side of the Border. All those involved, who secured almost €50 million in the last 16 years, are very concerned about up to 19 projects that are now threatened. When I raised this with the Taoiseach last week, he said it was a stalled process.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
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I have to ask the Deputy to conclude now.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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Okay. There are scores of programmes, jobs and communities trapped by this stalled process. Did the Taoiseach raise this issue with Chancellor Merkel and encourage her to press the EU to agree quickly to honour all the projects currently under development? Will he encourage the EU to lift the real sense of fear surrounding these projects?

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
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I have to ask the Taoiseach to correspond with the Deputies on these matters because the time for the questions has elapsed.