Dáil debates

Tuesday, 21 June 2016

7:45 pm

Photo of Eugene MurphyEugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Minister of State, Deputy English, for coming to the House to respond. I am sharing my time with my colleague, Deputy Fitzmaurice.

On 15 June, last Wednesday, County Roscommon experienced another incident of torrential rain, which was also experienced in parts of some adjoining counties, including County Westmeath, where I was driving at the time and had to pull over. The heavy deluge of rain caused widespread damage to a number of homes, roads and bridges, especially in areas such as Curraghroe, Scramogue, Culliagh and Doughill, which were badly affected.

Flash floods have affected many communities that are just trying to recover from the heavy rainfall of 2015 and early 2016. Late on Wednesday night I spent two hours visiting my neighbours and friends in the region. At least half a dozen houses were quite badly affected in that kitchens, back kitchens, bathrooms and materials in them were damaged. It is a nightmare situation for families and it is not the first time we have faced such difficulties in County Roscommon. I am a resident of the area and my home was affected, but thankfully we kept the water from getting in the door. It took a huge effort. Those who witnessed the rain said it was the worst they had ever seen. Reports from Met Éireann suggest it was the heaviest rainfall on record, but that has not been clarified.

In addition, water has flowed down from Sliabh Bán, where Coillte is involved in a wind farm development. Even though the wind farm got full planning permission and the go-ahead from An Bord Pleanála, local people are concerned about what might be happening there. I do not wish to take up any more time, as I wish to give time to my colleague. I call on the Minister of State to address the issue and to assure me that everything has been checked to make sure the inflow of water is not due to drainage issues on Sliabh Bán.

7:55 pm

Photo of Michael FitzmauriceMichael Fitzmaurice (Roscommon-Galway, Independent)
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As Deputy Eugene Murphy stated, a tsunami of water came down from Sliabh Bán last Thursday evening. In fairness, the council was contacted that evening but one road was taken out completely, houses were flooded, as the Deputy also has noted, and there was chaos in the area. Since then, no one from Coillte has visited the people who were affected by this event and I understand it could be another day or two before that happens. There are many questions to be answered. I walked that mountain last Sunday and while it was stated that one cannot go up the mountain or whatever, I went up through the trees and walked it. Members must read the planning that is involved and to be frank, enforcement must be considered because while the Deputy is correct to state there was a lot of rain, part of that planning refers to events that happen once every 100 years and the amount of rain that was accounted for the other evening was far from that mark. I have video footage and photographs of it and it broke the banks. It came down through the trees and went straight down the mountain. Were one to examine the planning that was meant to have been put in place, one would conclude that attenuation tanks must be placed in dangerous areas right around that mountain or people will live in fear. An 82-year-old woman is unable to enter her house, and silt has gone down through drains for approximately one mile. Farmers' meadows have been blown to the ground. Water came down the main road from up that mountain. Under health and safety and building regulations, there is a responsibility on any site to contain whatever water comes onto it and I seek the proper enforcement of this responsibility. This is the biggest building site in County Roscommon and it must be done right because the people in the area cannot lie in their beds at night in fear of a repeat of what happened the other evening.

Photo of Damien EnglishDamien English (Meath West, Fine Gael)
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I thank both Deputies for raising this important issue. I got a chance to view the footage of the flooding in County Roscommon through the RTE website and I could see the devastation caused to families and their homes, as well as to the surrounding land. There is no doubt that nothing worse can happen than being flooded, and plenty of Members present have experienced this in recent years. It certainly is devastating and the Deputies are correct that all steps needed to prevent this must be implemented across whatever Departments or county councils are involved. It is as simple as that and everything that must be done to prevent a recurrence undoubtedly must happen.

As for my involvement and that of the Minister, Deputy Coveney, through the Department, I wish to take this opportunity to outline the provisions of the planning code in respect of development in general and of Deputy Coveney's role as Minister. Proposals for wind energy developments are subject to the statutory requirements of the Planning and Development Acts 2001 to 2015, as amended, and the planning and development regulations made under the Acts in the same manner as other proposed developments. Planning applications are generally made to the relevant local planning authority with a right of appeal to An Bord Pleanála. However, in the case of wind development proposals such as this one, which meet the statutory threshold criteria for classification as strategic infrastructure developments under the Planning and Development Act, such applications are required to be submitted directly to An Bord Pleanála. There is a compulsory requirement, however, to undertake an environmental impact assessment in respect of wind farm development projects of a certain scale, that is, if they consist of five or more turbines or have a power output greater than 5 MW. This ensures that all environmental impacts, including potential hydrological impacts, of a proposed development are fully considered and assessed prior to the making of determinations on individual planning applications.

Planning authorities, including An Bord Pleanála, are further required to have regard to relevant planning guidelines issued under section 28 of the Planning and Development Act 2000. These include the Department's wind energy development guidelines, which were published in June 2006 and which provide advice to planning authorities on catering for wind energy development through the development plan process, as well as in assessing individual wind farm development proposals and all their effects on the surrounding area. Furthermore, the planning system and planning guidelines on flood risk management published in November 2009 are designed to ensure that where relevant, flood risk is a key consideration in both the preparation of local authority development plans and local area plans and in the assessment of individual planning applications which may have a flooding risk. In this regard, it is a matter for the relevant planning authority to make the appropriate determination on a planning application or appeal having regard to relevant planning guidelines issued by the Department. These guidelines are issued for guidance purposes to assist planning authorities in the performance of their functions. Ultimately, planning authorities, be they the local planning authority or An Bord Pleanála, will make their own decision based on the specific merits or otherwise of individual planning applications.

The role of the Minister, Deputy Coveney, with regard to the planning system is primarily to provide the policy and legislative framework which comprises the Planning and Development Act, the planning and development regulations and a suite of planning guidelines to which, as I have outlined, planning authorities and An Bord Pleanála are obliged to have regard in the exercise of their statutory planning functions. The day-to-day operation of the planning system is, however, a matter for the planning authorities themselves. Furthermore, under section 30 of the Planning and Development Act 2000, the Minister is specifically precluded from exercising any power or control in respect of any particular case with which a planning authority or An Bord Pleanála is or may be concerned.

On the matter of flooding, my colleague, the Minister of State with responsibility for the Office of Public Works, OPW, and flood relief, Deputy Canney, has lead and primary responsibility for the co-ordination and implementation of Government policy on the management of flood risk. The core strategy for addressing the significant flood risks nationally is the OPW's catchment flood risk assessment and management, CFRAM, programme, which I understand is being taken forward in partnership with the local authorities at present. In this connection, I am informed that approximately 300 locations nationwide that are being assessed under the programme have been designated to be at potentially significant flood risk. This programme also has been discussed with Deputies at other stages. This involves flood mapping for each of these 300 locations, the development of preliminary flood risk management options and ultimately, the production of flood risk management plans. This programme of draft flood mapping is now in the process of being finalised following completion of the national statutory public consultation phase on 23 December 2015 and work on the options to address flood risk in these locations is under way at present. I am unsure whether the area in question is part of that process but this is a matter Deputies certainly could raise directly with the relevant Ministers and authorities.

Photo of Bernard DurkanBernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Minister of State.

Photo of Damien EnglishDamien English (Meath West, Fine Gael)
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I wish to make one further point and will cut it short. I should also point out in this regard that the priority being attached to addressing flooding generally is reflected in the Government's capital investment plan, which includes a significant increase in the levels of investment in the area of flood relief. Ministers are meeting on a cross-departmental basis to ascertain whether there is a way to fast-track and to spend this investment and the Minister of State sitting to my right, Deputy Eoghan Murphy, also has been involved in those meetings to try to free up resources where they are needed.

With regard to local flooding issues, including those in County Roscommon raised today by Deputies Eugene Murphy and Fitzmaurice, these are a matter in the first instance for each local authority to investigate and address. Local authorities are empowered to carry out flood mitigation works using their own resources where appropriate.

To conclude, the OPW also funds local authorities for small-scale flood relief studies and works up to a cost limit of €500,000 under the minor flood mitigation works scheme. All applications received under this scheme are assessed under the scheme's eligibility criteria, which include a requirement that all measures are cost-beneficial, having regard to the overall availability of funding.

Photo of Bernard DurkanBernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Minister of State. He has another minute coming up.

Photo of Damien EnglishDamien English (Meath West, Fine Gael)
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To be clear, I heard a representative from Coillte stating he was in talks with the local authority and that the site manager there was prepared to do whatever the council asked of him in respect of this work. However, it is a local issue that must be resolved locally. As representatives for the area, the Deputies themselves no doubt have been involved in discussions with the local authority and with Coillte.

Photo of Eugene MurphyEugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire Stáit as ucht an fhreagra sin. I can report that Roscommon County Council has commenced checking out the situation and I have been assured from the very top that this matter will be checked completely to make sure that every regulation in the planning is being adhered to. I also can reveal that today, and I believe yesterday, Coillte did start meeting the people on an individual basis. However Deputy Fitzmaurice is correct in his observations on what happened. I have lived in that area for all my life and certainly never have seen any such devastation in my lifetime previously. While it would be wrong and wild to make any allegations against anyone this evening, as Deputies we wish to ensure that everything that must be done under the Planning and Development Acts 2001 to 2015 is carried out. At present in County Roscommon, I am informed that 133 locations are in difficulty with flooding. The amount of money needed to deal with them is €11 million but €4.9 million has been received from the Department and then this event has taken place on top of it. My mother grew up in that area and has seen flooding down through the years. Her family has been there for generations-----

Photo of Bernard DurkanBernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Deputy.

Photo of Eugene MurphyEugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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I make the point to the Minister of State that no drains, small streams or small rivers have been cleaned for years and that is part of the problem.

Photo of Bernard DurkanBernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Deputy.

Photo of Eugene MurphyEugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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I will conclude by stating that we must ensure, if there are issues pertaining to the wind farm, that they are dealt with properly.

Photo of Michael FitzmauriceMichael Fitzmaurice (Roscommon-Galway, Independent)
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It must be remembered that submissions were made before this project went ahead. It was noted that there may be a risk of flood at T15, which is one of the places on the site. The reality is that people have been flooded in their houses, Coillte is ducking and diving at present and people do not know whether to draw down insurance. The point is that were they to draw down their insurance, they would not get insurance again. This is what is going on in the area and I will stand up and be counted because I went up that mountain the other day. I am from a construction background and will state clearly that if one takes out 40 ha or 50 ha of trees, if one puts in place 25 m roads and if one brings some of these roads to areas such as those that were earmarked in submissions as being in danger of flooding, one increases the risk.

It was put into the plan that up to 85 mm of rain needed to be accounted for in areas. We did not have that. That is guaranteed. However, it was not contained on the site and that is the bottom line. There is now silt down the drains. There is a council road completely busted out of it. Someone has to account for it. We need the council to carry out enforcement on this because what has gone on is intolerable.

8:05 pm

Photo of Damien EnglishDamien English (Meath West, Fine Gael)
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I think it is quite clear. Naturally, any planning application judge has to assess all the associated procedures to ensure that all the environmental impacts, including any potential hydrological impacts, are fully considered and assessed in the consideration of individual planning applications. I can only assume that was done. It should have been done. The regulations are there. That is why they are put in place and what the policy is there for. There is local authority planning and there is An Bord Pleanála and it is their job to follow through on procedures. I agree with the Deputy. They need to investigate whether every planning procedure and regulation was followed and whether every condition was adhered to. Deputy Fitzmaurice raised the conditions in this case. Naturally, if one is going to have any construction in an area it is going to have a knock-on effect. That has to be fully investigated. That is what planning laws are there for. That is what the Department is very proactive about.

It is a local conversation. From what I can see, if Coillte is involved in discussions, I do not know if the site affects it or not. It is alleged that there are impacts from wind farms on localised flooding in Roscommon. From what I have seen, Coillte is dealing with the local authority to see if its site is in any way involved. It will take corrective action where necessary. Deputy Fitzmaurice has specific planning details and I hope he liaises with the local authority, which is in charge of enforcement. Local authorities have a budget for enforcement. That is their job. As a Minister of State in this Department, I feel very strongly that we have to have enforcement. It is something we have to have. There is no point in having planning laws if we do not enforce them.

Ultimately, as I have outlined, it is a matter for the relevant planning authority to make the appropriate determination with regard to a planning application or appeal, having regard to relevant planning guidelines issued by the Department based on the specific merits or otherwise of individual planning applications. The Minister is specifically excluded from exercising any power or control with regard to any particular case, but it is important that all regulations are checked and enforced. On the matter raised by Deputies Murphy and Fitzmaurice regarding flooding in Roscommon, my colleague, the Minister of State with special responsibility for the OPW, Deputy Seán Canney, has lead responsibility and is working on this issue.

Much work was carried out on the CFRAM process and we discussed it on many other occasions as well. Very often, there are simple solutions. The Deputy said that most of the cases in Roscommon would cost about €11 million. Over half a billion euro has been allocated to be spent on flood relief over the next three or four years. That needs to be spent as quickly as possible and we need to work with locals on the ground to spend it and not have any delays.

We have the term "one-hundred-year flood." That is possibly going to change. We have had a lot of rainfall this year and we are well ahead of once in 100 years. I assume that all involved in flood relief prevention measures for the future are updating the technology and information in conjunction with our weather services. I imagine that is happening. I will certainly check that, because the one-hundred-year event is becoming too common.