Dáil debates

Wednesday, 4 May 2016

10:30 am

Photo of Paul KehoePaul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

It is proposed, notwithstanding anything in Standing Orders, that the following business shall be transacted today: No. 4, statements on agriculture; and No. 5, statements on climate change.

The proceedings on No. 4 shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion at 2.30 p.m. today and the following arrangements shall apply: the statement of a Minister or Minister of State and of the main spokespersons for the Fianna Fáil Party, Sinn Féin, the Labour Party, AAA-PBP, Independents 4 Change, Social Democrats, the Green Party, or a Member nominated in their stead, and a non-party Deputy, who shall be called upon in that order, shall not exceed 15 minutes in each case, and such Members may share their time; the statement of each other Member called upon shall not exceed ten minutes in each case, and such Members may share their time; and a Minister or Minister of State shall be called upon to make a statement in reply which shall not exceed five minutes. The proceedings on No. 5, statements on climate change, shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion at 6.30 p.m. today and the following arrangements shall apply: the statement of a Minister or Minister of State and of the main spokespersons for the Fine Gael Party, the Fianna Fáil Party, Sinn Féin, AAA-PBP, Independents 4 Change, Social Democrats, the Green Party, or a Member nominated in their stead, and a non-party Deputy, who shall be called upon in that order, shall not exceed ten minutes in each case, and such Members may share their time; the statement of each other Member called upon shall not exceed ten minutes in each case, and such Members may share their time; and a Minister or Minister of State shall be called upon to make a statement in reply which shall not exceed five minutes. The Dáil on its rising today shall adjourn until tomorrow at 10.30 a.m., when there shall be no Order of Business within the meaning of Standing Order 28, and accordingly the only business to be transacted shall be, by order, agreed on that day.

10:35 am

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

There are three proposals to put to the House. Is the proposal for dealing with No. 4, statements on agriculture, agreed? I call Deputy Moynihan.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I am Deputy Martin.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

It was Deputy Moynihan who was indicating.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I appreciate that.

Photo of Bobby AylwardBobby Aylward (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

He has forgotten already.

Photo of Aengus Ó SnodaighAengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Will the real Deputy Micheál Martin please stand up?

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

We beat Duhallow last night, which is Deputy Moynihan's part of the country.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Good stuff.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Given the crisis in agriculture on all fronts, many speakers in our parliamentary party are anxious to contribute to the debate. I ask, therefore, that the time be extended to facilitate a longer discussion on agriculture because there are serious issues in terms of pricing - farm gate prices and so on - and there is strong demand for people to speak.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

We can accommodate that. How long-----

Photo of Paul KehoePaul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

We agreed on 4.30 p.m.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Two hours.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

We will agree to that.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Is the proposal for dealing with statements on agriculture, with an additional two hours, agreed to? Agreed. Is the proposal for dealing with No. 5, statements on climate change, agreed to?

Photo of Paul MurphyPaul Murphy (Dublin South West, Anti-Austerity Alliance)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Would that finish at 6.30 p.m. or 8.30 p.m.?

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I presume it will have to go on for an additional period. It will involve a later sitting, so the same time but a later sitting.

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Not agreed. It is not so much that we have an issue with statements on agriculture or climate change, which are important issues, but the fact I have raised on two separate occasions the issue of violence on our streets and the killings that have happened, particularly in Dublin and the north inner city. I understood on the previous occasion I raised this issue that there was a sense of agreement as to the urgency of the issue, yet we have not had an opportunity to have statements on it. With that in mind, I had intended to stand to object to the Dáil finishing at 6.30 p.m., but now time has been added on in respect of the agricultural statements at the request of Deputy Micheál Martin. At what stage will we have statements on the issue of crime and gangland killings?

At what stage does the acting Minister intend to present herself to the Dáil to take questions and to make a statement? This Chamber has been mute on this issue and it is utterly scandalous.

I understand the pressures in the agriculture sector and I acknowledge the point that has been well made. In order of emergency and merit, however, we should be taking statements on crime and gangland killings with the Minister for Justice and Equality present. We should at least offer some reassurance to the public that we are not entirely in cloud cuckoo land and that we are in touch with what is happening on the ground. I do not know how the Ceann Comhairle is going to square this circle for me or if he will. The Ceann Comhairle has been most accommodating to Deputy Martin and I presume the Ceann Comhairle will be accommodating to my concerns and tell me when and where we will have the statements on an issue of absolute importance and urgency. At this stage we are well behind the curve in respect of addressing this matter. We should not imagine that this goes unnoticed by the people who elected us. Is it possible to reschedule the business again within the remit of today's business to allow for those statements on crime, gangland killings and Garda resourcing? The Taoiseach might enlighten us.

10:40 am

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I thank Deputy McDonald. However, for the purposes of clarity I did not facilitate Deputy Martin any more than I would facilitate any other Member. It was the Taoiseach who indicated, and the House which agreed, that Deputy Martin would be facilitated with additional time. When Deputy McDonald raised this very valid and appropriate issue last week, I requested that the Whips engage to see if time could be provided. It was my understanding that this was to happen.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I acknowledge that Deputy McDonald has raised an important issue. I met with the Minister for Justice and Equality and the assistant commissioners of An Garda Síochána last week for a briefing on the up-to-date position on gangland crime, issues in city centres and the resources of time and capacity by gardaí to deal with this area. It is a very important issue. I suggest, if I may, that we discuss this in the House tomorrow and that we devote sufficient time to the matter for everybody to make their contribution and for the Minister to be able to attend to hear the contributions and to respond.

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I am working on the assumption that the acting Minister for Justice and Equality would be in attendance and would make a statement on the matter. However, if the Taoiseach is now making a concrete proposal that we would have statements on this matter tomorrow, it would resolve the issue. It is late but it is welcome that we would get to the issues.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I thank Deputy McDonald. I call Deputy Catherine Murphy.

Photo of Catherine MurphyCatherine Murphy (Kildare North, Social Democrats)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I completely accept the points that were made about the importance of the issues and I do not have a difficulty at all with statements on agriculture or climate change being debated today. However, I raised an issue last week at the Whips' meeting about the Cregan inquiry which reported to the Taoiseach on 15 April. It was published last Friday night and I understand there is an extension of time again. The Taoiseach needs to give some clarity on where this inquiry is going because it requires legislation on both privilege and confidentiality if it is to proceed. The judge could not have been clearer on what is required. The Taoiseach needs to outline what direction this inquiry is taking. Will it be something that is just constantly stretched out? Every week it continues it involves costs to do its work. It is absolutely essential that clarity is given on whether legislation will be produced in those two areas and if there a prospect of a conclusion to it. A debate on the report is also needed in the House. It is the second interim report, which pretty much reinforces the point which was made last November, that legislation is needed if the inquiry is to proceed to a conclusion for public consumption.

10:45 am

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I do not want to take away from the importance of any of the issues that have been raised to date but I would add that at the last two Whips' meetings we have asked for a debate about industrial relations issues. Luas industrial action continues and, at this stage, it appears to be a very intractable dispute. We brought Luas workers in here the week before last to meet an all-party group of Deputies. They put a very different slant on this industrial dispute, a dispute which is having an enormous impact in this city, is affecting commuters in a serious way and looks no nearer to resolution than when it began. Those workers said the real basis of the dispute is being badly misrepresented by Transdev and they were keen on having the full story heard and a proper discussion in this House so that we can try to move towards a fair resolution.

Other issues also came up including the Tesco dispute and low pay. We are all aware that, in the negotiations between Fianna Fáil, Fine Gael and Independents on the formation of a government, the question of pay, pay restoration and the financial emergency measures and legislation are being discussed. All of these things will have a serious impact, given concerns about winters of discontent and so on. It seems to me quite crazy that against this background, for the third week in a row, and despite a request that these matters be discussed in this House, we are not discussing them. Will the Taoiseach tell us whether he will allow for a debate on these extremely important and pressing issues?

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I call the Taoiseach to respond on the industrial relations matter and the Cregan inquiry.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I confirm that Deputy Boyd Barrett has raised this matter on a number of occasions at the Whips' meetings and it is just a case of having it listed. The matter is a major inconvenience to the many thousands of commuters unable to avail of the Luas service. While sectors of the Luas workers are amenable to continuing, there is a complication at the moment. I suggest to Deputy Boyd Barrett that we could accommodate his request made with the Whips' office for a discussion on industrial relations, have it listed for next week and allow that to happen.

In regard to Deputy Catherine Murphy's question on the Cregan interim report, the report was cleared at Cabinet last week. Believe me, there was nothing sinister in the fact that it was published on the Friday of what happened to be a bank holiday weekend. I know that is always the story - that one is trying to ensure it is not seen. Let me put it this way. I can tell Deputy Murphy that I have looked at this and have given it a two-month extension. Mr. Justice Cregan has pointed out a number of challenges. Some of them are legal and some of them are constitutional, but there are a number of options to be considered. I would be happy to accommodate Deputy Murphy with a meeting either today or tomorrow to let her have the up-to-date, accurate range of those opinions, which include the possibility of a full-blown public inquiry. When we consider that the Moriarty tribunal ran for 13 years at a very costly sum to the taxpayer, these are options that need to be considered. I will facilitate Deputy Murphy and anyone else and bring them up to date on where it now stands arising from Mr. Justice Cregan's interim report.

Photo of Eamon RyanEamon Ryan (Dublin Bay South, Green Party)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

It is very welcome that we have debates on both agriculture and climate change today. However, I would appreciate if the Taoiseach could respond or comment on whether we will have, as requested, a debate on the Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership, TTIP, especially in view of the documents leaked to Greenpeace that show that elements on the US and European sides and the French Presidency seems to be indicating that it will not support any such trade deal. This too is an issue that we should be addressing quickly, given that elements of the package are, for the first time, in the public domain. It is a matter of huge importance to the agricultural sector in this country and is relevant in the context of both climate change and the pay issue that Deputy Boyd Barrett just mentioned. In a sense, it covers a lot of bases, and we should be looking to debate it, particularly given the leaks last week.

10:50 am

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

It is in the same category and of course it is a valid request. It has major implications for global trade, particularly between the United States and the European Union. There are many implications for Ireland along with many other European countries. I am not objecting to a discussion or debate on it here. If other matters can be concluded, the organisation of the business of the Dáil will be taken out of the hands of the Whip directly. Obviously, the Ceann Comhairle chairs that process. For now, I would be happy to list that along with the other issues that have been mentioned as worthy of discussion in the Chamber.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Is the proposal for dealing with No. 5 agreed to? Agreed. Is the proposal for dealing with the adjournment tonight agreed to?

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Can I ask the obvious question?

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Yes.

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

It is this-----

Photo of Bobby AylwardBobby Aylward (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

It is not obvious.

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

It is so obvious that it is not obvious to the Fianna Fáil benches.

Photo of Bobby AylwardBobby Aylward (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

We are slow over here.

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Can we expect a vote tomorrow to elect a Taoiseach? It is some 68 days or almost ten weeks since polling day. Will an Administration be formed or will we be left in this virtual reality or limbo Chamber for weeks and weeks to come?

Photo of Seán FlemingSeán Fleming (Laois, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Sinn Féin Deputies have been there all this time.

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

It is the obvious question-----

(Interruptions).

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Deputy McDonald has the floor, please.

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

It is the obvious question that needs to be asked and answered by An Taoiseach. We have word of an agreement, a programme for Government, perhaps, in all but name, from Fine Gael and Fianna Fáil. It would raise alarm bells for many people, certainly for anyone who is concerned with the health system or the fair administration of medical cards and so on.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Let us not get into a debate on the matter now.

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Be that as it may, can we have a moment of clarity from this Chamber to the world outside that is wondering whether we will ever have a Government-----

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

If you resume your seat, we will seek that moment of clarity.

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

-----or, perhaps, in some cases, whether we should have a Government? Can the Taoiseach please-----

A Deputy:

Maybe he could tweet the answer.

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

For the purposes of keeping every Member informed-----

Photo of Seán FlemingSeán Fleming (Laois, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Will Sinn Féin not come on board?

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

-----and in recognition of the esteem in which we are all held individually on the basis of our democratic mandate, could the Taoiseach please shed some light on when or whether there will be a vote to elect a Taoiseach and establish an Administration?

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Maybe we could have a tweet, a tweet of clarity.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

As the House and the world are aware now, an agreement was reached between the Fine Gael and Fianna Fáil parties in respect of a number of important matters. The discussions taking place with other alliances and groupings are with people who have an interest in participating in making arrangements to run the country. They are not taking place in a sense of virtual reality. I assure Deputy McDonald that these are very real discussions. I can confirm for the Deputy that they are progressing with a sense of urgency. I would like to think that this matter could be concluded this week, but obviously I am not in a position to confirm that finally. I hope today's discussions, which are under way following the discussions and agreement we have had with the Fianna Fáil Party, can be brought to a conclusion and that the matter could be signed off tonight or tomorrow morning. I hope that stage can be reached. I cannot guarantee it but the discussions are very real and they are progressing with a sense of urgency.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Is the proposal for dealing with the adjournment tonight agreed to? Agreed.