Michelle Mulherin (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I am delighted the Ceann Comhairle chose this issue. It is a critical issue for people seeking a rural water supply and affects in particular counties such as Mayo and other rural counties.

10 o’clock

I ask that the Minister, Deputy Kelly, would, in accordance with the recent recommendation of the national rural water services committee, implement its recommendation and thus provide a special funding mechanism to grant aid new group water schemes which were in the pipeline for delivery in certain disadvantaged rural areas but which lost out upon the cessation of CLÁR funding and which, under the current funding rules, are not viable for delivery because of funding shortfalls, leaving affected households without a proper water supply and in limbo for a number of years. I thank the Minister of State, Deputy Phelan, for coming to the House. I am disappointed the Minister, Deputy Kelly, is not present but I know the Minister of State's brief and know she is pushing the rural agenda.

In the context of the legislation we voted on earlier and the issue of people paying for water, there are seven areas in my county - Massbrook, Aghaloonteen, Downpatrick Head, Carracastle, Kilmurray, Tonacrick and Fermoyle - which contain 235 houses where people cannot drink the water or bathe in the water, in many cases for years. The problem arises from ground conditions. Many people have spent a small fortune trying to drill wells and access other sources, all to no avail. Until CLÁR ceased in 2009-2010, many of these schemes were in the pipeline, with many of the people on these schemes having spent money and made contributions towards design and planning. I know of one scheme where €36,000 was spent but nothing was seen for it. If these people want to progress the scheme again, they will have to spend more money on engineers and they have no assurance they will get through under the current funding rules.

I raised this issue with the Minister's predecessor, Mr. Phil Hogan. I had a Topical Issue matter in 2013 and, at that stage, the national rural water services committee had been examining how the issue might be addressed, given CLÁR was finished. Basically, the cost of delivering these schemes per household is a lot more expensive because of the terrain and the dispersed populations. At that stage, the then Minister made some changes to the rules, which came in during 2014 and saw the amount allowable per household increased from €6,500 to €7,500. Believe it or not, of the seven schemes I have named, while we thought two of them would get through the net, each of them still has a shortfall.

It is imperative these people know they are not forgotten about. Some have been waiting 20 years for water. It is a disgrace to hear some of the Deputies on the other side of the House talk about human rights and everything else, which I would call a lot of baloney, when many people in rural Ireland are already paying for water. I was in contact with a woman tonight who told me how fearful she was when she was sick because she did not know where she was going to get water. She is out in the middle of nowhere and relying on neighbours to bring potable water in order that she could drink and be looked after. She said she had a cheque ready and would pay for the water without a problem. These people know that pipes have to go into the ground and there is a need for infrastructure and water treatment as well as ongoing costs. They are willing to pay for that but they do not have water, yet here, we have the problems of privilege. People here have water and can turn on a tap like they would flick an electricity switch on a wall. Are people in rural Ireland second-class citizens when it comes to human rights? I never heard one of the speakers raise that issue, even though they are against any sort of payment for anything, as far as I can see.

This matter has been going on for quite some time. Efforts have been made and our economic climate has changed. I believe these people in rural Ireland should be prioritised. They should have a basic right to water. It is not a question of whether they should pay for it. These people will pay. They should have water when they turn on their tap for their children, for the elderly and for everyone else.

I know the Minister of State will agree with me. Now that the rural water services committee has deliberated in conjunction with my own county council, I know the Minister, Deputy Kelly, will deliver. We have been allocated €400,000 for new group water schemes and we cannot spend one red cent of it given the way the rules stand. Something has to give or it is a complete nonsense. I ask that the same priority be given to this and that we could have a focus on these people, who do not have water, compared with the people who do have water but who do not want to pay for anything or to address problems in wastewater and water treatment.

Ann Phelan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Labour)
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I certainly understand the Deputy's frustrations, in particular when those who are willing to pay for water cannot get it while those who have water do not want to pay for it. I understand her concerns in regard to CLÁR funding and how precious CLÁR funding was for people who live in disadvantaged areas. I am taking this Topical Issue matter on behalf of the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government, Deputy Alan Kelly, but I assure the Deputy I understand exactly the type of schemes she speaks of.

Between 2000 and the end of 2014, my Department, under the rural water programme administered by the local authorities, provided almost €800 million towards the capital costs of improving existing group water schemes and the provision of new group water schemes. This is evidence of how the group water sector is valued by the State. I am glad to say this investment is continuing and that, this year, a further €14 million has been notified to local authorities by way of block grant allocations under the rural water programme for group water and group sewerage schemes.

The Minister and I are well aware of the difficulties in setting up some new group water schemes where the financial viability of the scheme is questionable. The national rural water services committee, which has a role in advising the Minister in regard to policy and investment in rural water services, has been considering issues relating to the establishment of new group water schemes and the financial viability of same. Following a recommendation by the committee, an increase of €1,000 in the maximum grant per house applying to new group water schemes was announced in April 2014. My Department now funds 85% of the cost of such schemes, subject to a maximum grant per household of more than €7,000, rather than the previous limit of €6,500 to which the Deputy referred in the context of the difficulties that exist around the shortfall.

That committee also considered whether some elements of the proposed new group schemes would merit a special contribution to help address funding shortfalls, especially where such schemes incurred significant verifiable expenditure prior to the cessation of funding for group water schemes under CLÁR, on the understanding that CLÁR funding would be forthcoming. The Minister announced in May last that he had accepted the committee's recommendation and that he wanted to find a funding mechanism to facilitate the progression of proposed new group water schemes which are not viable at current grant rates. My Department has been liaising with Mayo County Council and Galway County Council in regard to examining the feasibility of the committee's recommendation for appropriate schemes in these areas on a pilot basis. Submissions from both councils are being actively considered in this regard.

Michelle Mulherin (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I believe the recommendation was that this special funding mechanism was to be set up to match the funds which CLÁR had available and to apply the rules that CLÁR had applied. Therefore, it was to be a de facto CLÁR but it would be dealing with a defined number of new schemes. These are schemes which have not just been thought about today; they have been thought about since CLÁR ceased. These people are in limbo. What is the point in allocating money for new group water schemes if the rules do not allow the funding to be spent? People do not see that as sincere, nor do I.

People see red iron oxide in the water in their houses and they must accept it as a fact of life every time they wash their whites, which means that, over a period of time, they will turn red. It is not a joke. People are at their wit's end. I would like to think, now that the rural water services committee has reported, there will be action. We all know it is question of funding. These people will pay. They have already paid in one scheme and they will be asked to be pay again. I am not talking about their yearly payment because they will be asked to pay towards the setting up of the scheme. However, I cannot advise any of the people who are in charge of the schemes to go back looking for money from their neighbours because, given the way the rules stand at the moment, nothing can be done.

Not alone have these communities spent €36,000, but they set up a company limited by guarantee as a vehicle to deliver the scheme and it must make returns to the Companies Office and pay an auditor every year. Therefore, they are constantly out of pocket, have nothing for it and have no water. Previous administrations had money and failed to deal with this issue. This is a legacy issue, but we are at a time now when where we need to deal with it and do something for people. Will the Minister act on the recommendation and will that happen in a matter of weeks as opposed to some time down the line? When the change was made in 2014, no project got across the line. It will become apparent that the project is ridiculous if it does not happen soon.

Ann Phelan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Labour)
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I assure the Deputy that I understand the position regarding this project. I understand these communities have been 20 years trying to gather funding. Every week, they pay into funds to provide water for themselves. However, their project seemed to fall off the cliff due to circumstances. I understand that and know these people need to know soon when they can expect to have their water and sewerage scheme.

County Mayo is one of the biggest beneficiaries of funding for the group water schemes. I heard what the Deputy said about the rules and about not being able to get projects across the line because of that. For 2015, Mayo has been notified of a block grant allocation, totalling €2.7 million, towards group water schemes. Nevertheless, the Minister is aware that further work needs to be done and that there is a need for continuing investment in the group water sector to allow schemes to provide water to required standards. The Deputy's comments will be kept in mind in this regard.

The Department will engage separately with Irish Water on broader issues around rural water and sewerage programmes, with a view to ensuring there is appropriate integration of the Department's rural water programme and Irish Water's capital investment programme in order to fully support rural development and address any environmental issues that may arise. Such discussions will involve the national federation of group water schemes and local authority management. The introduction of a rolling, multi-annual funding programme to provide certainty to the group water scheme sector is also being considered in this regard. Some appointments are awaited currently.

I understand the Deputy's frustration with being so close but yet so far. I accept her point regarding some Members of the Opposition. It is easy to be glib on these issues when one can turn on a tap and high quality water comes forth, but this is not the case for the people in Mayo mentioned by the Deputy. It is a question of equality. People in rural Ireland have always paid for their water. Everybody should pay a little. I accept that in times of plenty we did not pay attention to these issues and that is one of the reasons we are now in this situation. I understand the Deputy's concerns and will take them on board.