Dáil debates

Thursday, 25 June 2015

10:30 am

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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9. To ask the Minister for Defence if he has had discussions with any of his European counterparts following the European Parliament report advocating possible military action in the Black Sea Basin, following the annexation of Crimea by Russia; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [25111/15]

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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I listened with interest to the Minister’s definition of neutrality in the context of the worsening situation in the Black Sea area. The Minister was excusing the Fine Gael MEPs' decision to vote for this motion, which backs possible North Atlantic Treaty Organisation, NATO, military build-up in the Black Sea. What is the Government’s position on the NATO military build-up and the motion calling for increased defence spending in Europe specifically to support this initiative?

Photo of Simon CoveneySimon Coveney (Cork South Central, Fine Gael)
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The Government’s decision is that it does not take part in NATO decisions or operations unless they are peace-keeping operations that have the support and approval of the United Nations, which is the case, for example, in Afghanistan at the moment.

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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The motion that was passed calls for an increase in defence spending to 2% of gross domestic product, GDP, in the specific context of calling for greater military build-up in the Black Sea area, which is becoming the epicentre of a new cold war and where there is a constant aggressive build-up by the US and NATO. The European Union is now pushing to get involved. Does the Minister not think that our job as a neutral country is to stand up and warn against this, and say we should not be doing this?

Is there a connection between this call to increase spending to 2% of GDP and the fact that the German Government is supporting a debt write-down for Ukraine but the Greek Government, which has called for a reduction in defence spending, is getting very different treatment from the German Government? Is this the sort of geopolitical manoeuvring that is going on and what is our view of it? Should we not be calling foul?

Photo of Simon CoveneySimon Coveney (Cork South Central, Fine Gael)
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I am not going to start judging other countries for what they choose to spend on defence.

Greece allocates a relatively high proportion of its expenditure to defence. That is a decision for the Greeks, just as we must make decisions on defence expenditure as part of the White Paper process.

My view is that we need to spend a little more on defence in order that we can increase our peacekeeping capacity and ensure we can replace and upgrade equipment to protect members of the Defence Forces when they are in action. Advocating an increase in defence expenditure does not mean I am somehow a warmonger; the opposite is the case. Our role is one of peacekeeping and, in some cases, peace enforcement.

Ireland has taken a position on the suggestion that a set target for defence expenditure, based on a percentage of gross domestic product or gross Government expenditure, should apply across the European Union. The Government has opposed this proposal because we do not believe governments should be tied to certain targets at European level. That is our position and Ireland will continue to make its own decisions on defence expenditure and where and when we participate in defence actions. This is what being militarily neutral is about.

10:40 am

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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Is the Minister not deeply concerned that the European Parliament has passed a motion calling for increased military expenditure across Europe, specifically to back a military build-up in the Black Sea? This has been done against a background in which the United States assistant secretary of state for eastern European affairs, Victoria Nuland, used the immortal words "Fuck the EU" in an eavesdropped communication. She was involved in manipulating----

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Deputy, do not use that language.

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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I was quoting Ms Nuland's words.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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I do not care where you quoted from. You are in Parliament and you should behave as if you are in Parliament. That is outrageous language to use in Parliament.

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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My apologies.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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You are not impressing anybody.

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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I was simply quoting the US assistant secretary of state for eastern Europe. The Minister stated he trusts the US Government, yet this is its attitude to the European Union. It was manipulating the political process in Ukraine.

Photo of Simon CoveneySimon Coveney (Cork South Central, Fine Gael)
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The point I made was that Members of the European Parliament will make decisions on the merits of reports, documents and recommendations. I have not read the document in question and I am not sure the Deputy has read it either.

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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I have read it.

Photo of Simon CoveneySimon Coveney (Cork South Central, Fine Gael)
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Has he read the whole document?

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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I have a copy of the motion here.

Photo of Simon CoveneySimon Coveney (Cork South Central, Fine Gael)
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Having had the benefit of speaking to many Ministers for foreign affairs and defence from other European Union countries, it is clear that many European countries feel threatened by Russia, which is perfectly understandable given their history with Russia. Many populations feel threatened by Russia as a result of what is happening in Ukraine. If one were to study the history of these countries, one might understand the reason people in Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia and other countries on the eastern borders of the European Union may feel threatened. That is the motivation behind motions such as the one the Deputy read.

Ireland has always advocated the position-----

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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We are over time.

Photo of Simon CoveneySimon Coveney (Cork South Central, Fine Gael)
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To finish the point, the position I have advocated is that a resolution of the current tension between the European Union and Russia will not be achieved by military interaction but by politics.

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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This document is a manifesto for a third world war.