Séamus Kirk (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Acting Chairman for the opportunity to raise this matter and the Ceann Comhairle for selecting it as one of the items for discussion.

This is an important issue. It concerns a constituent of mine who agreed to rear and support the children of a family friend and his wife, both of whom died when they were very young. A guardianship arrangement was put in place. The couple who were the guardians do not have a family of their own. None the less, they looked after the children exceptionally well and supported them through primary and second level education. The first girl, a teenager, is going on to third level education. After making a grant application to SUSI, they discovered that the incomes of both guardians are factored in when considering eligibility for same. The teenager is the first of a number of children who will hopefully go on to third level, and the same issue will arise again. Given that the incomes of both parents are factored into the means test, they may not be eligible for a college grant.

The reality is that the couple involved did not anticipate this problem. Apparently under a guardianship arrangement the teenager ceases to be in guardianship after the age of 18 years. They looked also at the issue of children in foster care. Apparently children in foster care are fortunate in being able to go on to third level, as the income of the carers - the parents or the husband and wife looking after the children - is not factored in. Clearly, there is a dichotomy in the application of the grants scheme by SUSI. Obviously, it operates under the regulations set down by the Department of Education and Skills, but it is an area that needs to be examined.

Guardianship is an invaluable service for HSE and State bodies that would otherwise have the responsibility of looking after children who, when their parents die, are unable to look after themselves. There is a need to have the guardianship outlet available to them as well as foster care. It is an aspect we need to protect. There is a need to ensure it is not made less attractive for the honourable and commendable parents who are prepared to provide care in such a situation.

I am pleased that the Minister of State is from the north east. This is a north east problem. I am prepared, on a confidential basis, to provide him with more details of the case. I implore him to consider the case sympathetically. It is a genuine case. There is nothing political about it. I am being up front. I am providing limited details in my contribution in the Chamber as we are restricted in what we can say about individual cases. I appeal to the Minister to go back to the Department and examine the regulations with a view to seeing what can be done to help.

Damien English (Meath West, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Deputy for raising this important matter. As the Minister, Deputy Jan O'Sullivan, cannot be present, I am taking the debate on her behalf. I am not familiar with the case but I accept that it is a genuine case.

For student grant purposes, students are categorised according to their circumstances, whether as students dependent on parents or a legal guardian, or as independent mature students. A student may be assessed as an independent mature student if he or she has attained the age of 23 on 1 January of the year of first entry to an approved course, or of re-entry following a break in studies of at least three years, and is not ordinarily resident with his or her parents from the previous October. Otherwise he or she continues to be assessed on the basis of the parents' or guardians' income.

An objective of the Department's statutory-based student grant scheme is to provide additional assistance to dependent students where the parents' or guardians' income is below a certain threshold and warrants additional assistance by way of a grant. Only in exceptional circumstances where compelling evidence of estrangement from parents or guardians is provided can applicants who are under 23 years of age be assessed without reference to their parents' or guardians' income or address. The difficulty is that parents are regarded as being under the scheme. The Student Support Act 2011 defines a parent as including a guardian appointed under the Guardianship of Children Acts 1964 to 1997. This definition also provides that a person who has adopted a child under the Adoption Act 2010 or outside the State is considered a parent for grant purposes. I understand the predicament and I can see that this can act as a deterrent for people who are considering becoming guardians. It is not an issue I have dealt with before. I will certainly take a look at the case to see whether in general the regulations are unfair to this particular category. Those are the rules at present. I appreciate that the Deputy is asking if we can have another look at them. I will certainly look at the case and will speak to the Minister, Deputy Jan O'Sullivan, about it to ascertain whether this is an area we need to examine in terms of the rules.

The Deputy raised the issue of foster parents. In the case of a fostered applicant, it is the State that is offering the protection and care in circumstances in which the parents have not been able or are unlikely to provide the care the child needs, so students may be assessed as dependent students by reference to their own income where they satisfy the conditions of article 21.3 of the student grant scheme, which refers to irreconcilable estrangement. It is a little bit different because the State is the person in charge, unlike in the case of guardianship. What the Deputy is saying in general is that this is a deterrent. We will examine the issue to see whether there are similar cases.

I am sorry I cannot give the Deputy a better answer or say that we can fix it, but I will certainly take up the case and look at the rules. I understand the point the Deputy is making.

The guardians did not realise all the consequences and costs involved. The Deputy did the right thing on behalf of the young family. I will examine that but I am afraid the rules as they stand do recognise a guardian and a parent as the same thing.

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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I am somewhat disappointed. I am sure it is not the Minister of State’s fault. I am sure the briefing note comes from the section. He quite rightly identifies the fact that guardians are treated in the same way as biological parents. That seems quite unfair to me. I am sure the circumstances will vary from one case to another but there is a great need for a spirit of generosity and humanity and consideration for one’s neighbour to provide the family support that guardianship requires for children whose biological parents have departed this world. The guardians are prepared to step in, support and look after them right up to third level education. There is a problem. I would be more than happy to sit down with the Minister of State, go through the individual case and provide more evidence. The Minister of State understands all the circumstances I have outlined so I implore him to do that and perhaps we can arrange afterwards to meet.

Damien English (Meath West, Fine Gael)
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I will meet the Deputy on that issue.