Dáil debates

Wednesday, 19 November 2014

11:50 am

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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Last Monday night, the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Paschal Donohoe signed the commencement order to the State Airports Act giving power to the trustees of the pension scheme of workers in Dublin Airport, Aer Lingus and SR Technics very significantly to slash the pensions of the members of the scheme, divided between retired, deferred and active. It is the first time in the history of the State that a Government has legislated to change a private pension scheme and to effect such draconian cuts to people’s pensions. Some 5,000 retired workers from Aer Lingus, Dublin Airport, SR Technics and other companies will lose the equivalent of six weeks’ pay per annum in addition to the 2.5% they will lose as a result of the Government’s pension levy, and it will be in perpetuity. In some cases the loss will be as high as €250 per month. The most savage cuts of all have been reserved for the deferred members of the scheme, who were told it was compulsory that they sign up and pay pension contributions and whose pensions will be cut by 50% or more. I do not know how anybody could justify it. A woman who will be 65 next year and who is expecting €30,000 will receive €15,000.

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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It is a disgrace.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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The active members have been bullied into an inferior pension scheme under the new order. The Tánaiste indicated to interested parties and stakeholders that she was working with them to bring about a fairer resolution to the scheme. Did the Minister, Deputy Donohoe, consult with the Tánaiste or did she know he was about to sign the commencement order on Monday night? My colleague, Senator Darragh O’Brien has been fighting this for a long time and had, with others, tabled amendments to the Social Welfare Bill that could have rectified the situation. It seems to be a choreographed operation by the Government. On the following day, the EGM was scheduled for December, when shareholders will be asked to vote through these cuts to the pensions. Will the Government use its 25% shareholding in Aer Lingus to vote through the cuts? Is it fair to the pensioners and deferred pensioners concerned? It is not too late to intervene. The Taoiseach could revoke the commencement order and work with the stakeholders to ensure a fairer outcome to the situation than the extraordinary and very draconian cuts that have been imposed on pensions to which, up to recently, people felt they were entitled. What is the Taoiseach’s position on it? What will the Government do at the AGM? Will it move between now and January to revoke the situation and work towards a better solution?

Photo of Finian McGrathFinian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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It is injustice.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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This has dragged on for years and has been of great concern to those involved. The deficit is €769 million. We established an expert panel that considered all the combinations and possibilities involved and was able to bring forward a further €20 million. Scheme membership comprises 5,000 active members, 5,000 deferred members and 5,000 pensioners. There is widespread agreement within the Irish Airlines Superannuation Scheme, IASS, that the scheme is unsustainable. The employers are putting in moneys to cushion a move from a defined benefit to a defined contribution scheme. The report of the expert panel recommended that additional moneys be paid to the deferred pensioners, and the employers have agreed to this. Legally, the employers' role is voluntary and there is no legal requirement that they sustain the scheme. The only other option, in the event of current negotiations being unsuccessful, is for the Pensions Authority to wind up the scheme. Legal action by deferred members could undermine the current proposals, which are very finely balanced, and derail the proposals. Yesterday, it was announced that a ballot of members resulted in a 70% vote in favour of the pension deal.

This has gone on for years with no solution. The expert panel that was established made recommendations that further moneys be made available, of which €20 million came forward. The scheme is a multi-employer scheme and its membership comprises employees from Aer Lingus, 69%, the Dublin Airport Authority, 27% and SR Technics, 4%. It carries a deficit of €769 million. The negotiations have gone on for years and have failed to resolve the difficulties with the scheme. There have been intense efforts in recent months to try to resolve the difficulties with the introduction of the legislation and the establishment of the expert panel to report on these matters. The members of the scheme who are unhappy with the situation have sought a meeting and I have had some correspondence from them, to which I intend to respond. At a meeting on 2 October, and in recent representations, deferred scheme members outlined a number of concerns. The situation has been unresolvable for years. The alternative is that the Pensions Authority wind up the scheme completely. It is a very difficult situation with which to have to deal.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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The alternative the Taoiseach has put forward is not the only alternative. How would the Taoiseach like it if somebody arbitrarily decided to halve his pension entitlements?

Photo of Brendan HowlinBrendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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I did. I cut them by 35%.

Photo of Timmy DooleyTimmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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Deputy Howlin is not so great at the sums; 35% is not half.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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Nobody represented the deferred pensioners in any of the negotiations or discussions, and they have taken the biggest hit.

The Taoiseach can work that out for himself because it is fairly obvious what happened. The pensioners have taken a hit as well, amounting to six weeks' pay. In addition, the pension levy which was imposed three to four years ago has resulted in a 2.5% cut - forever - in their temporary pension entitlements. That levy should never have been brought in because it has significantly undermined many pension schemes.

Two years ago, the Social Welfare Bill facilitated single insolvencies, which basically allows profitable companies to run down their pension schemes. In essence, a roadmap has been given to such companies to do just that in future. Through the signing of the commencement order, together with the Government's legislative intervention, a Trojan horse has essentially been created. We will see more of this emerging in the coming years concerning other companies and other pension schemes.

By any objective yardstick or criterion, the way this is being worked out simply is not fair. I do not see how anybody could suggest it is fair if those in a particular grouping lose 50%-plus of their pension entitlements. Will the Taoiseach say whether the Tánaiste was aware that the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Donohoe, was going to sign the commencement order on Monday evening? Discussions were going on with the members' representatives with a view to identifying potential fairer outcomes and resolutions. Is the Taoiseach simply saying he is not in a position to intervene or do anything to effect a fairer outcome to this situation?

12:00 pm

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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It is like a lot of other things that were allowed to drift, thus making the situation worse than it ever was. Just over three years ago, the deficit was €350 million; it is now €769 million.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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That happened between 2011 and 2013. Tell the truth.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Please, Deputy.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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This has gone on for years.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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On your watch.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Please, Deputy.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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As I pointed out to Deputy Martin, the situation has gone on for years. Just over three years ago, the deficit was €350 million. It is now €769 million - that is, it is getting worse.

(Interruptions).

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Will the Deputy please allow the Taoiseach to reply?

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The trustees wrote to the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport. They recommended that the course of action being pursued here following legislation and the expert panel is the best option. This was voted upon by the membership in, Aer Lingus and 70% gave their verdict in favouring it. The Department of Finance said this could rescue the situation. As I said, the deficit now is €769 million. The Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport met with the Tánaiste on Monday before he signed the commencement order.

Photo of Willie O'DeaWillie O'Dea (Limerick City, Fianna Fail)
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Will the Labour Party stand over it?

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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It is clear that the Taoiseach's incompetent Government has no intention of fulfilling the vision of the 1916 Proclamation. Indeed, everything he does is in marked contrast to this progressive, democratic declaration. We should not be surprised, therefore, that he has also no intention of properly commemorating and celebrating the 1916 Rising.

For three years the Taoiseach offered no plan, no proposal, no idea and no vision of how the State should mark the hugely significant 100th anniversary of the Rising. Last week, under mounting pressure from relatives of the 1916 leaders and growing public concern, the Government produced a glossy brochure devoid of historical substance or detail. I was in the GPO with the Sinn Féin Minister Jennifer McCann at the launch. I found it amusing and ironic that the self-serving ministerial speeches were almost drowned out by the noise of anti-water-charge rebels who had besieged the GPO.

Photo of Michael NoonanMichael Noonan (Limerick City, Fine Gael)
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Your members.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Please, Deputies.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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Can the Taoiseach explain to the Dáil why the video that launches Ireland 2016 makes no mention of the Easter Rising or the signatories of the Proclamation? Instead, we are treated to images of Facebook, Google, Bob Geldof, Bono, David Cameron and the English Queen.

Photo of Finian McGrathFinian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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Revisionism.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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Is this what the Government believes the 1916 Rising was about? Does the Taoiseach agree with me that this video and the flimsy commemorative brochure are deeply disrespectful to the men and women of 1916 and betray a cynical indifference to their sacrifice, ideals, hopes and vision?

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Feicim go bhfuil leas-cheannaire Shinn Féin ar ais sa Dáil, ach níl sí ag caint inniu. Cuirim fáilte roimh an Teachta.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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Tá go maith.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Tá súil agam go mbeidh sí béasach don Cheann Comhairle as seo amach.

The position concerning the decade of commemorations that we are now entering into is one we have discussed here on a number of occasions. I do not accept that all of the noise I heard down at the GPO was about the issue of water. Some of the personnel I saw there I have seen in other locations when it was not about water.

I remind Deputy Adams that the 1916 Proclamation declares that we should cherish all the children of the nation equally.

Photo of Bernard DurkanBernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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Hear, hear.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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Remember that.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Yes.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Please, Deputies.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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So we are not going to have a situation, in so far as we can, in which the children of the nation are not cherished equally.

Photo of Finian McGrathFinian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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There were 1,000 homeless last night.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Those who might have interfered with them will be brought before justice, as the case may be, as the Deputy has often espoused himself. I am sure the signatories to the 1916 Proclamation would not stand for a situation in which evidence or information might be known, and is known, to people but they are afraid to own up because of what they stand for.

A Deputy:

Free Staters.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The announcement made by the Minister, Deputy Heather Humphreys, is part of the ongoing consultation in respect of the very best things we can do in commemorating not just 1916 but also the decade of events whose centenaries are approaching. That is why she has already announced that the parade in 2016 will be led by relatives of the 1916 leaders. In addition, there will be a State occasion in Dublin Castle the day before to reflect on and honour those who died in 1916, as well as recognising their relatives. The Deputy is also aware of the commitment already under way for the military archives facility in McKee Barracks, the development and restoration of Kilmainham courthouse and the development of the interpretative centre within the GPO, all of which have been funded and are currently under construction. Arrangements have also been made in respect of opening up the Bank of Ireland in College Green to a far greater extent for members of the public.

In addition, there is a division of interest between relatives in respect of how we should develop Moore Street and the area where personnel from the GPO went and where the surrender actually took place outside the Rotunda. We have been trying to work on that issue as part of the consultations that are taking place.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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Trying, yes.

A Deputy:

Do not forget James Connolly.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I do not accept Deputy Adams's references to glossy images. What is involved here is a genuine effort to have this recorded and commemorated in the very best way possible. That is why the professional historians' group has made recommendations about authenticity, inclusiveness and accuracy in respect of many of these events. I have heard lots of views about what should happen on Easter Sunday 2016. It is not just about the commemoration of a revolution; it is also about what those signatories to the Proclamation stood for, the kind of Ireland we have had in the last number of years, and where we actually want to be at the start of the next century. It is in that context that the consultations will take place, and the Deputy is welcome to participate constructively in those discussions. If it is to have the background music of the Deputy's fellow travellers - well, that is for him to decide. The Government genuinely wants this to be inclusive, comprehensive, accurate and sensitive. One cannot do that, however, without engaging in consultations with everybody. That is what we are involved in now.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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I do not accept one single word the Taoiseach has said-----

A Deputy:

Does that include cherishing the children of the nation equally?

12:10 pm

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Members should stay quiet.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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-----except nuair a chuireann tú fáilte roimh leas-Uachtarán Shinn Féin. Tá sí an-shásta bheith anseo arís. Beidh sí ag cur ceisteanna. An tseachtain seo caite, seoladh suíomh idirlín Comóradh 1916. Baineadh úsáid as Google translate chun Gaeilge a chur air. Tá sé sin scannalach.

It is very clear to anyone watching the debate that the former party leader, John Bruton, has won the argument about how the Government should proceed on this important issue.

Photo of Finian McGrathFinian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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The Redmondites.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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It is also deeply embarrassing that the Government used Google translate for the Irish language section of the 1916 website, with the result that the section was reduced to gibberish. It is shambolic and symbolic of the Government's attitude to the anniversary and, more importantly, to the proclamation and the Irish language. It seems that most of the time the Government cannot do anything right but in this case it is a Freudian reflection of the Government's attitude because it accurately conveys the Government's approach. The reason the Government will not mark the 1916 Rising appropriately is that it is opposed to the social, economic and democratic input and intent of the Proclamation of 1916.

Photo of Patrick O'DonovanPatrick O'Donovan (Limerick, Fine Gael)
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What about the children?

Photo of Bernard DurkanBernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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Rubbish.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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The Taoiseach should be conscious that the event, despite his shameful official neglect, will be celebrated across the island and among the diaspora by ordinary men and women who will pay tribute to the brave men and women of 1916.

The 1916 Relatives Association said the Government is trampling over the men and women who fought in the Rising. A spokesperson has said the Government does not know what it is doing, that it has had years to plan for this but it was put together in a blind panic. Will the Taoiseach outline how the Government plans to rectify last week's shambolic presentation and to ensure the State properly commemorates the 1916 Rising?

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Tá a fhios agam go bhfuil an Teachta McDonald anseo. Mar a dúirt mé, tá súil agam go mbeidh sí béasach as seo amach leis an gCeann Comhairle. Sílim go bhfuil an ceart ag an Teachta gur botún a bhí ann ó thaobh an chórais aistriúcháin agus nár tógadh síos ón idirlín é nuair a cuireadh amach é ar dtús. Tá súil agam go dtuigfeadh an Teachta é sin.

It is an indication of the attitude of Deputy Adams that he found it amusing to be in the General Post Office. I would like to know what his version of commemorating 1916 would be on Easter Monday 2016.

Photo of Dessie EllisDessie Ellis (Dublin North West, Sinn Fein)
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We will show the Taoiseach.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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From the questions the Deputy is asking, I presume it would be politically and socially divisive and in keeping with the Sinn Féin philosophy of causing as much trouble as it can without ever having to accept responsibility for governing.

Photo of Joe HigginsJoe Higgins (Dublin West, Socialist Party)
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The Taoiseach is responsible for the trouble over the past month.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Sinn Féin members of Cork City Council refused to put through the budget for the citizens of Cork city because they refused to accept responsibility when it is given to them. As Uachtarán of Sinn Féin, Deputy Adams has an opportunity to set out what he believes should be the commemorative qualities.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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We have put proposals.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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They should be inclusive, sensitive, comprehensive, accurate and authentic. That is why the themes developed here were of remembering, reflecting and reimagining. When looking at the entities of Facebook and Google, we are trying to look outward and forward because we can tie together the entire Irish diaspora, the descendants of the 1916 years all over the world, in commemorating the start of the decade of the centenary commemorative events. Sinn Féin now has the opportunity to put forward its view on how it should be commemorated.

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
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It has been done.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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It is not just about military machines on O'Connell Street but about the Irish people. It is about the Irish people and the journey they travelled before 1916 and for the 100 years since.

Photo of Aengus Ó SnodaighAengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
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You are talking shite.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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We want to reflect on a country that was left in an economic swamp a few years ago and which is now the fastest growing in Europe. Our reflections on 1916 must bear in mind the words of the Proclamation and the use of our ability to develop our country.

Deputy Adams must own up because the Proclamation-----

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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The Taoiseach needs to own up and stop the innuendo.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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----- points out that we should cherish all the children of our nation equally. That is not the case in Sinn Féin's view.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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We are over time. I call Deputy Catherine Murphy.

Photo of Brian StanleyBrian Stanley (Laois-Offaly, Sinn Fein)
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What about the 30,000 in poverty?

Photo of Catherine MurphyCatherine Murphy (Kildare North, Independent)
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When the Taoiseach set out months ago to implement water charges and to burden people with the super quango that is Irish Water, the one stated aim was to turn citizens into customers. It was not disguised and we all recall the Irish Water communications strategy, with six steps to take the person from the citizen mindset to the obedient customer. The Taoiseach has not achieved this despite the thousands of taxpayers' euros spent on PR and propaganda. The Taoiseach has not managed to brainwash Irish people and they do not accept that they will be customers of the Irish Water quango. Originally, this was passed off as a conservation exercise but the attempts to sell it as conservation can be dispensed with. The leaks coming from the Cabinet make it clear it is intended to be a flat charge for many years. How can the Taoiseach talk about a flat charge and conservation in the one sentence? At least we have clarity on that one thing. It is a revenue raising exercise.

People have not undergone the desired transformation and are not fools. They will see the backpedalling for what it is, an attempt to pacify, soothe and buy time to coerce people into submission. People can see the obvious future, with charges being raised, a dwindling State subvention and the new borrowing for which customers of Irish Water will be on the hook. The cost of Irish Water will not have changed because of the announcements today. The metering programme will still cost more than €1 billion and the consultants and experts will have been paid €80 million. The quango will still exist.

Instead of treating citizens like petulant children who need more time to accept things, will the Taoiseach hear the actual message rather than what he wants to hear? The message is not that we need more time but that we will not pay for an inflated super quango and we do not want to be Irish Water customers. We will not pay for Irish Water. Will the Taoiseach hear that message and does he accept that it is not about conservation but about raising revenue?

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Deputy Catherine Murphy always has been a realist and is well aware that we cannot continue to have raw sewage flowing into the bays and rivers of our country.

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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Last year it was about septic tanks.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Please, it is not Deputy Mattie McGrath's question.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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We cannot continue with 500 of the treatment works that supply water to businesses and people all over the country in an inferior condition. Out of general taxation, the division of them for schools, hospitals, roads and other services has never been sufficient other than to catch up with an inadequate infrastructure and an intolerable situation. Every new business and industry set up or job created adds to the requirement for more water and clean water.

I accept mistakes were made but people have said they want clarity, confidence and to understand about affordability. We cannot say what will be the cost of electricity, gas or bus fares for the next three years. However, when the Minister speaks in the House he will outline with certainty for people the affordability of the contributions they make for domestic water use, accountability in relation to the contributions they make and the changed responsibility and engagement of the people in a people's forum with Irish Water.

This is to ensure there is a direct connection and an understanding between ordinary people and the entity that is Irish Water. Those involved in Irish Water say they have a lot of work to do in trying to build the confidence of the people in them, but we cannot continue in a position where raw sewage is a problem, there are inferior treatment works and 40% of treated water leaks into the ground.

12:20 pm

Photo of Joe HigginsJoe Higgins (Dublin West, Socialist Party)
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Fix it then; tax the millionaires.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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When meters are installed, leaks can be found.

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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Bring back big Phil.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The more that are fixed, the less waste there will be and therefore the greater the saving for the taxpayer, as the cost of producing water will be reduced. It also allows for investment for the future to fix treatment works and provide new infrastructure. We cannot go on in parts of Dublin where there are pipes that are 100 years old and incapable of providing a service for consumers and customers.

Photo of Dessie EllisDessie Ellis (Dublin North West, Sinn Fein)
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Change them.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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We cannot go on with treatment works that are of grossly inferior standard or where there is no treatment at all. As this is a country that prides itself as being clean and green, that will just not work. I recognise that mistakes were made.

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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Irish Water was a mistake.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Today when the Minister outlines the conditions that will apply, there will be evidence that the Government havs listened to ordinary people who expressed their anxiety and concerns. These concerns and anxieties will be reflected in the actions of the Government in today's announcement.

Photo of Catherine MurphyCatherine Murphy (Kildare North, Independent)
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I appreciate that the Taoiseach acknowledged that I am a realist. When Irish Water was established on 1 January, development contributions could have been a key part of funding capital projects, but they were pretty much dispensed with by a circular from the Department. I cannot understand this. There have been no levies applied this year to planning permission applications in respect of water and wastewater, which is astonishing.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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There have been.

Photo of Catherine MurphyCatherine Murphy (Kildare North, Independent)
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We are talking about the need for clarity and certainty and these words are repeatedly trotted out. We heard them earlier this year before the local elections, the protests and the comments by the Commission for Energy Regulation, CER. We would not be talking about this issue today if we did not have the game changer in the middle of October, when 100,000 people took to the streets. That is why we are here today. I attended the march in the middle of October when people were asking why it had not happened five years ago, even before the Government entered office. People realised that this was a powerful action and the message had to be put across in a way that it would people out onto the streets, onto which they will emerge in serious numbers on 10 December. If more than 100,000 people emerge onto them on that day, in what back-pedalling will the Government engage on the Irish Water issue at that point?

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The questions raised which were of great concern to people included using personal public service numbers, the bonus regime, call-out charges and the level of uncertainty about what the contribution would be.

Photo of Martin FerrisMartin Ferris (Kerry North-West Limerick, Sinn Fein)
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The double tax.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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There was concern about whether the Irish Water entity could continue to be able to borrow off balance sheet to enable the Government to invest for the future. All of these matters have been very carefully considered following the legitimate and peaceful expression of people's anxieties and concerns on the streets. It was a very powerful movement, to which I must say with a sense of humility that the Government has listened and reacted.

Photo of Peadar TóibínPeadar Tóibín (Meath West, Sinn Fein)
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It listened to itself.

Photo of Michael Healy-RaeMichael Healy-Rae (Kerry South, Independent)
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In other words, it woke up.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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It panicked a little also.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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People have come to me.

Photo of Michael Healy-RaeMichael Healy-Rae (Kerry South, Independent)
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It came out of the coma.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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To answer Deputy Catherine Murphy's question, the contribution levels to be announced today will be seen to be fair, affordable, clear and consistent in the time ahead.

Photo of Michael Healy-RaeMichael Healy-Rae (Kerry South, Independent)
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After millions of euro has been wasted.

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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A new name.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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It will also deal with the questions of the continued public ownership of the Irish Water entity-----

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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Santa Claus.

Photo of Finian McGrathFinian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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No leaks.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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-----and the necessity for that entity to gain the public's confidence not only by being able to respond to their queries but also by demonstrating the investment programme for the future.

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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The charge is gone. It is now called a contribution.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Most essentially, people's contributions should go strictly towards investment in meeting Irish Water requirements and not to deal with any sideline issue.

Photo of Michael Healy-RaeMichael Healy-Rae (Kerry South, Independent)
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It was a charge last week.

Photo of Joe HigginsJoe Higgins (Dublin West, Socialist Party)
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A contribution has already been made.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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These points were made in a valid way and we have reflected on them and listened to the concerns expressed.

Photo of Ruth CoppingerRuth Coppinger (Dublin West, Socialist Party)
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The Taoiseach has not heard what people said. They said they would not pay anything.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I hope that when the Minister addresses the matter today, he will bring about certainty and clarity.

Sitting suspended at 12.35 p.m. and resumed at 1.35 p.m.