Dessie Ellis (Dublin North West, Sinn Fein)
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I move: "That the Bill be now read a Second Time."

I thank all those in attendance who have helped to ensure this debate goes ahead. I hope to secure cross-party support for the Bill. Anti-social behaviour is a major problem in communities. It is particularly endemic in working class areas owing to lower levels of employment and educational attainment and fewer amenities being available for young people who need an outlet. The effect of four years of austerity in the communities I represent is clear. Grants, supports and front-line services have been cut, leading to young people finding it harder to stay in education and training or to find productive and useful uses for their time. Community projects, community employment schemes and youth centres and projects have been cut to a point where even the most essential are struggling to survive. We have more young men with more time on their hands, less to do, fewer places to go to and less hope for their future and their control over it. Austerity has resulted in a generation of angry young men in some parts of Ireland who see no value to their lives and no purpose for them. Sinn Féin has been clear on the need to row back on this process of degeneration and abandonment of working class communities. We have been clear that austerity may meet the short-term tick box criteria of the troika, but it is damaging our communities and tears the social fabric. We are all worse off as a result of austerity, whether it hits us in our pocket, owing to the effects it has on the world in which we live. The Bill cannot solve these problems, but it would, I hope, deal with some of their side effects.

I have been aware of this issue for a long time. As a public representative for the working class areas of Finglas and Ballymun, I could not have avoided it. Going around these areas, particularly in the summer months, the problems these vehicles are causing are undeniable. They are noisy and too often used by young men with reckless abandon, which endangers their safety and that of others. I was first struck by the need for this legislation almost two years ago after attending a number of safety and policing fora meetings. I raised the issue with the Garda and others and it was apparent that there was a hole in the legislation which allowed people who used these vehicles for anti-social behaviour to sidestep gardaí in public spaces and prevent the seizure of their vehicles. Currently, if someone is misusing one of these vehicles on a public street, gardaí have the powers to deal with the issue. The vehicle can be confiscated and, depending on the severity of the infraction or the history of the vehicle and its owner, may be held or returned. This provision, when enforced, can work to discourage slowly such behaviour.

Unfortunately, however, these vehicles are not just used and misused in public streets. They are also very common in our green areas and our public parks. They bring with them all of the same anti-social problems from the street coupled with greater potential for damage to public property. These vehicles tear up soil and destroy flower beds, pathways and other amenities. On YouTube one can find videos of the all too common and very dangerous practice of using the rear wheel of a dirt bike to spin a child's merry-go-round in a playground. In many of these videos the foolish people who elect to, or unwittingly, sit on the merry-go-round fly off at great speed potentially injuring themselves greatly.

This is a very simple Bill which will give the power and the impetus for the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, in co-operation with the Minister for Justice and Equality, to lay down regulations allowing the Garda to deal with the problem of the misuse of motorised vehicles in public spaces, namely areas designated as such by local authority by-laws. This Bill will help gardaí in co-operation with local communities to deal with the growing problem of the anti-social misuse of all-terrain vehicles, ATVs. Similar vehicles have been recognised to be causing considerable damage to environmentally sensitive parts of the country with flora or fauna which must be protected. This was dealt with in legislation and though some will break the law, the powers to deal with them act as a significant demotivating factor. Our public parks are important to providing access for our communities to wildlife, leisure activities, a place to relax, exercise and come together as communities. They deserve to be protected and we deserve to have them protected from anti-social behaviour.

Many of the areas I encountered on the edges of Finglas in one of my own areas, Dunsoghly, where the old Dunsink tip head was, residents have been kept up all night as a result of this. In Tolka Valley there is a brand new park which cost millions of euro and these motorbikes and other vehicles are flying up and down these parks. This was brought up at the joint policing committees and the safety fora. I dealt with all the senior gardaí, who told me they could not seize these vehicles as a result of an anomaly in the law. That anomaly exists. There are rules in place for mountainous areas but none for our public parks and spaces. I accept that this Bill may have problems and may require work but I ask that the Government allow it to go forward to be fully debated, developed and amended if necessary.

Finian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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Hear, hear.

Dessie Ellis (Dublin North West, Sinn Fein)
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I will be happy to work with anyone to address this problem in the best possible way. This has caused major problems in parks throughout the country, not just in Dublin. We need to close this loophole and if the legislation I propose does not meet all the requirements, I am open to any suggestions and to listening to what people have to say. This issue has been a scourge on our communities for too long and will continue to be if it is not addressed.

Over the years the superintendent and all the gardaí I have met have told me this anomaly is preventing them from seizing these vehicles and dealing with them. I am not asking that we criminalise the people on the vehicles but that we put in place legislation to allow gardaí to seize these vehicles and stop this. Children, some of them four or five years of age, are going around on these small motorbikes with no helmets. They are flying up and down parks and the vehicles cannot be seized. If they are taken, they have to be given back. That is unacceptable and I ask the House to support me on this.

Finian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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Hear, hear.

Tom Hayes (Tipperary South, Fine Gael)
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I thank Deputy Ellis and the other Deputies who will be contributing to the debate. Everyone in this House would agree that the safety of the public is, and ought to be, a primary concern of any Government, and reflected in all areas of policy. It is, therefore, good to have an opportunity to discuss this issue here in detail. I will start by setting out the actions and systems that are already in place to address the problem identified in the Bill, which can be disturbing in a neighbourhood, damaging to public property and a threat to the safety of ordinary citizens, in particular children and young people.

The misuse of vehicles, as described in this Bill, is a matter the Garda Síochána addresses on a practical level as incidents arise and come to its attention. Effective roads policing is central to the Garda policing plan 2014 and enforcement activities are focused on the main causes of death and serious injuries on our roads. The Garda Síochána conducts specific operations to improve the compliance culture among young male drivers including road traffic enforcement measures targeting incidents of anti-social driving behaviour. The Garda authorities work with the Road Safety Authority and other road safety stakeholders to promote road safety among this target group and conduct Garda road safety awareness programmes in schools and third level institutions.

The Garda Síochána conducts ongoing strategic local enforcement operations targeting dangerous and anti-social driving practices. These enforcement operations are intelligence-led, targeting areas in particular where young male drivers congregate. Regular Garda mobile patrols and checkpoints are also conducted in these areas and websites are monitored to assist in establishing where events are taking place and to implement the necessary operational Garda response. Such operations have resulted in a significant number of young drivers being prosecuted for driving without a learner permit, driving unaccompanied while on a learner permit and driving a vehicle with prohibited modifications.

The Garda Síochána's operational response to this type of crime and anti-social behaviour generally is backed up by a long-standing commitment to working in partnership with local communities, which is supported by the Garda national model of community policing. Under this model, community policing teams are headed up by a sergeant with clear objectives such as high visibility in the community, ease of contact by members of the public, and enhanced support for crime prevention strategies. The policing approach under the national model plays a key part in responding to crime by taking into account and responding to local conditions and needs.

The impact of Garda measures to tackle crime and anti-social behaviour can be seen in the official crime figures from the Central Statistics Office. These have been falling steadily, and the most recent figures, for the 12 month period ending 30 September 2013, show an overall reduction of 7.1%. This includes reductions in the range of offences commonly associated with anti-social behaviour and a decrease of 12.6% in offences relating to the taking of a vehicle. Public order offences also showed a decrease of 15.9%. There is also continuing Garda engagement with local communities by working with local groups under the community alert and neighbourhood watch programmes. There are more than 3,500 such groups around the country.

In January 2013 the Garda Commissioner and the Minister for Justice and Equality launched new Garda community crime prevention guidelines, which contain advice for those wishing to set up community alert, neighbourhood watch or similar groups and on the support local community gardaí can provide. Additionally, a new Garda text alert scheme has also recently been launched with the support of a variety of groups and organisations.

The issues often associated with the misuse of vehicles and anti-social behaviour are ones which may benefit from a collaborative approach between the Garda, local authority and community stakeholders. In this regard, An Garda Síochána continues to participate in a wide range of local fora, including joint policing committees which are established in each local authority area under the Garda Síochána Act 2005. These committees may be an appropriate forum in which to raise particular issues relating to the misuse of vehicles and anti-social behaviour in order that an appropriate collaborative approach can be devised with the support of the relevant local stakeholders. Members of local authorities, with their close contacts with their local communities, are in an excellent position to bring specific concerns to the joint policing committees.

There is a range of strong legislative provisions available to An Garda Síochána to combat anti-social behaviour, including provisions under the Criminal Justice (Public Order) Acts and the Intoxicating Liquor Acts. They include powers to seize alcohol to prevent under-age drinking in public places and to forestall public disorder or damage to property. Section 8 of the Criminal Justice (Public Order) Act 1994 provides that a garda may direct a person who engages in disorderly or anti-social behaviour to leave the area in question. Failure to comply with the direction is an offence punishable by a fine or up to six months imprisonment, or both. Incidents of public disorder and other forms of anti-social behaviour are also dealt with by way of a juvenile or adult caution, fixed charge penalty notice or initiating criminal proceedings. Provisions for civil proceedings relating to anti-social behaviour are also available under the Criminal Justice Act 2006, Part 11 of which provides for civil proceedings relating to anti-social behaviour by adults, while Part 13 relates to anti-social behaviour by children. These provisions set out an incremental procedure for addressing anti-social behaviour. With regard to children, they range from a warning by a member of An Garda Síochána and a good behaviour contract involving the child and his or her parents or guardian to referral to the Garda juvenile diversion programme and the making of a behaviour order by the Children Court. With regard to adults, provisions include a warning and the making of a civil order by the court.

Gardaí are playing an essential role in addressing factors contributing to local crime and anti-social behaviour concerns by making considerable efforts to divert young people from offending and being drawn into gang activity. This is illustrated through the Garda diversion programme and a network of 100 Garda youth diversion projects nationwide. The diversion programme operates in accordance with Part 4 of the Children Act 2001, as amended, and under the general superintendence and control of the Garda Commissioner. The aim of the programme is to deal with juveniles who offend by way of administering a formal or an informal caution, thus diverting the offender away from the courts and minimising the likelihood of further offending. The programme embraces, whenever possible, the principles of restorative justice and has due regard to the needs of the victims of youth offending. The Garda youth diversion projects are community-based, multi-agency, crime prevention initiatives designed to engage with and seek to divert young people from becoming involved in or further involved in anti-social or criminal behaviour. They are staffed by two youth justice workers and managed locally by community-based organisations working with a local project committee which is chaired by the local Garda district officer. They aim to bring about the conditions where the behavioural patterns of young people towards law and order can develop and mature through positive interventions and interaction with the project.

An Garda Síochána has advised that it is its view that the Bill is non-specific in what it offers to attempt to deal with or the power it attempts to provide towards investigation. The intended wording may prove problematic and it is the view of the Garda that current legislation adequately provides for the investigation of offences connected with the use of mechanically propelled vehicles under road traffic Acts, as amended. It is clear that there is a very wide a range of approaches already available to An Garda Síochána and communities, either directly or via their local authority, to address the problem the Bill is seeking to consider. There are clear and adequate systems and structures in place, integrated with other measures in criminal law, supports for communities and diversionary approaches for those at risk of offending. The Bill runs the risk of diverting valuable resources from these integrated measures to actions that could only be focused on one symptom of wider problems in some communities. Accordingly, the Government is opposed to approving the Bill on Second Stage.

Timmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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I am disappointed that the Minister of State ended his contribution by suggesting the Government would not support the Bill. My party is happy, in principle, to support what Deputy Dessie Ellis is trying to achieve. Although it is a relatively short Bill, the Deputy has indicated that he is prepared to amend elements of it if the Government sees fit to at least take into account the principle he is seeking to address. The Bill underlines the need for a shift in power towards local authorities and citizens, rather than a centralised approach. This would enable by-laws to be applied in problem areas, rather than having a one-size-fits-all approach. The Bill offers an opportunity to discuss important issues around parking in general and fees, in particular.

The Bill would enable the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government, in consultation with the Minister for Justice and Equality, to draw up regulations to remove abandoned vehicles in public spaces. This is a major issue for people living in urban areas and cities who are trying to maintain communities in a clean and tidy manner. The notion of abandoned vehicles can present a big difficulty. In built-up areas of my constituency small community and neighbourhood groups have come together to attempt to clean up areas and attract positive attention. They seek to get people involved in the maintenance of areas in a neat and tidy manner. For no good reason, others seek to undermine such efforts by abandoning vehicles, which is both annoying and a nuisance for so many communities. We must try to tackle this problem.

The Local Government Reform Bill, pressed through by the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government, Deputy Hogan, fails to address the imbalance of power between local and national government. We need to empower local authorities to tackle these problems and make local decisions. This Bill would afford an opportunity to create by-laws to deal with these problems.

A related issue, not contained in the Bill, is nuisance parking by people who want to avoid paying fees during shopping trips or daily commutes. Fianna Fáil has put forward detailed proposals to address this as part of its vision to revitalise town centres. We propose a review of the parking fee structure in out-of-town developments, a new graded parking fee structure and payment methods and special parking offers to encourage people to visit town centres. This would help re-energise towns while also encouraging people to park legally.

One of the major problems undermining the vitality and viability of Irish towns is the burden of hefty parking charges in town centres in contrast to the cheap or free alternatives in out-of-town shopping centres. The additional cost of parking, wide variations between local authorities, high fines when one overstays the allotted time and the prospect of clamping combine to deter people from shopping in towns. The so-called doughnut effect, which has been recognised in many other countries, is a proliferation of activity on the outskirts while the centre is hollowed out, which damages the vitality of a town. It had implications also for planning law. Local authorities have grown accustomed to using parking charges as a revenue-raising mechanism rather than viewing them as an impediment to businesses, which pay significant rates while their business is sucked out by the areas out of town where customers get free parking. Parking charges penalise customers for shopping in towns, which leads to an increasing number parking illegally.

Any parking charge structure should be equitable across all shopping locations rather than penalising town centre shoppers, which also penalises town centre businesses that pay significant rates and generate revenue for the local authorities. It should be a sustainable source of revenue for local authorities that can be reinvested in the towns and be used to attract people back into urban centres. The current parking charge system is a burden on cash-strapped customers, with a knock-on effect on the businesses that rely on them.

The current system of a standard rate per hour and the need for coins is inconvenient for customers and discourages short-term visits to the towns. There should be a graded parking charge structure and more modern payment methods. This would involve lower costs for shorter stays, with the price escalating for longer stays to deter commuters from parking in town centres. In addition, to make trips into town more convenient and cheaper, we should broaden the payment methods available for parking charges to encompass Internet and debit card payments. The penalty system imposed for overstaying should also be implemented on a graded basis. Minimum fees should be imposed in the case of brief overstays, with costs rising as the length of time involved extends. The focus should be on taking the hassle out of a quick shopping trip into town.

Special parking offers to encourage town centre visits could also be used to revitalise town centres. Flexibility and incentives to attract people back into towns must be at the heart of local authorities’ parking strategies. Special weekend festivals or late-night shopping offers should be accompanied by complementary breaks in parking charges. A frequent-user reduced rate or day break from charges would help encourage greater use. These reduced payments for frequent weekly visits should be integrated into the pricing structure. Local authorities should use innovation and flexibility in parking charges, with local initiatives such as free Fridays to draw additional customers into town.

The wide variety of charges across towns is not simply linked to the differing costs in the provision of parking spaces. There is a wide disparity in parking charges across local authorities. A national parking league showing the various parking fees would bring greater transparency to the system and encourage greater efficiency between authorities and towns. Voters could use this information to lobby their representatives to reduce onerous rates while businesses could use the information to press for greater services on the basis of higher parking costs. The presence of a clear league centralised on the website of the Department of the Environment, Community and Local Government would encourage greater efficiencies in local authorities when they set out pricing structures that help bolster the transfer of best practice between bodies. Combined, these measures will help ensure that cars are not inappropriately parked or abandoned. Local authority by-laws should deal with these continuing problems.

My party echoes Deputy Ellis’s concerns about the abandonment of cars. While the Minister of State has outlined the Garda procedures for dealing with the perpetrators of these offences, I look forward to more action by the Government on this.

Finian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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I welcome the publication of the Misuse of Motor Vehicles (Public Spaces) Bill 2012. I commend Deputy Ellis’s work on the Bill. I will support the Bill, which sets out regulations and common sense. I am extremely disappointed that the Government has blown this legislation out of the water before we even get into the serious debate on it. It is not acceptable.

This Bill will save lives and protect public spaces, football pitches and parks. It will prevent many nasty incidents affecting young people, their families and the broader community. This activity in public spaces is a major problem, not only in Dublin but across the country. Clubs contact us regularly about their pitches being destroyed. Young families are afraid to go into certain areas of public parks after 8 p.m. because of threats, violence and anti-social activity, but the Minister for State, Deputy Hayes, and the Minister for Justice and Equality, Deputy Shatter, say they do not accept the legislation. That is not good enough when a proposal is put forward to deal with this national problem.

The detail of the legislation gives the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport the power, in co-operation with the Minister for Justice and Equality, to lay down regulations allowing the Garda to deal with the problem of the misuse of motorised vehicles in public spaces, designated as such by local authority by-laws. It will also help the Garda, in cooperation with communities, to deal with the growing problem of the anti-social misuse of all-terrain vehicles. We are aware of the popularity of mini-bikes, dirt bikes and quad bikes in recent years, which has given rise to many problems in residential areas and public spaces. There has been noise pollution, damage to public property, threats and violence against families, all sorts of carry-on. This Bill aims to resolve these problems. I welcome the fact the Bill will not criminalise the user of these vehicles but will allow the gardaí to act when they are misused in public spaces.

The Bill attempts to deal with the issue in a sensible way that does not criminalise young children. However, while legislation offers part of the solution, we must also deal with the lack of youth facilities in many disadvantaged areas. On youth issues more generally, we need leadership and greater efforts to deal with youth unemployment. Our youth unemployment rates are among the highest in Europe. This Bill would support the development of an overall strategy through co-operation between the Garda and communities.

As a former member of Dublin City Council, I am aware of the magnificent work it does in managing public spaces. Dublin city has more green spaces per square mile than any other European capital city. There are 30 public parks within a three-mile radius of the city centre and 97% of Dublin city residents are within 300 m of a public green area. Dublin City Council manages 1,500 ha of parks and open spaces, or 2.96 ha of public green per 1,000 head of population in Dublin. It also manages 255 playing fields. This legislation goes a long way towards protecting these open spaces. Approximately 1,000 official matches are played on these pitches every weekend. North Bull Island in my constituency is Dublin's largest park and a UNESCO Biosphere reserve. These spaces belong to the people of Dublin and the parks in the other parts of Ireland belong to the people of their respective counties.

This legislation offers an opportunity to better utilise public spaces. We need to up our game in this regard because public spaces have to be protected and landscaped in a common-sense way. Parks departments need the resources to employ sufficient staff. It gets up my nose to hear people being paid €1 per hour to assist local authorities under the Gateway scheme. People should be employed in full-time jobs with proper rates of pay in local authority parks departments rather than being exploited at rates of €1 per hour.

This morning I read that the Dublin Port Company is again looking with greedy eyes at Dublin Bay. I advise it to keep its hands off Dublin Bay and, in particular, the 52 acres in Clontarf. The national disability strategy aims to support equal participation of people with disabilities. We need to ensure our open spaces are accessible to people with physical and intellectual disabilities.

It is not right that football clubs have to contend with pitches that have been vandalised or destroyed the night before they use them for matches. Dublin City Council and local communities have invested in the region of €4 million in developing these pitches. The Government must listen to the people on the ground.

The Minister of State, Deputy Tom Hayes, referred to the provisions in the Criminal Justice Act 2006 dealing with anti-social behaviour by children. I accept that these provisions are important, but this Bill deals specifically with the issue of all-terrain vehicles. The Minister of State also referred to the 100 Garda youth diversion projects in operation around the country. These projects do great work and I have worked with some of them in my previous day job in the north inner city. However, I could use 100 youth diversion officers on the north side of Dublin alone, never mind nationally. We need to invest resources in protecting our young people before it is too late.

I welcome this Bill's emphasis on protecting public spaces, young people and lives. It is a miracle that more people have not been seriously injured or killed in these open spaces. I commend Deputy Ellis on the work he has done on the Bill and I will be supporting it.

Róisín Shortall (Dublin North West, Independent)
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I am happy to support this legislation and I commend my constituency colleague, Deputy Ellis, on his work in drafting and tabling it. The Minister of State's response is disappointing, however. He seems to be in denial of the problem and in his speech he went on various tangents without making a serious attempt to address the nub of the problem, namely, the increased use of vehicles such as mini-bikes, dirt bikes, scramblers and quad bikes in housing estates. Many of us, particularly in the Dublin area, are conscious of the concerns this problem has caused among local residents. There are serious dangers for the users of the vehicles, who can be as young as seven years, other children playing nearby, residents out walking and elderly people who fear being knocked down. The use of these vehicles is also associated with other anti-social behaviour. These vehicles are noisy and they create a hostile atmosphere wherever they are used. I am not sure that the Minister of State appreciates the extent of the problems they cause.

Parents often mean well in buying these vehicles for their children as Christmas or birthday presents but they do not realise the responsibility that accompanies them.

A person is required to have tax and insurance to operate a mechanically propelled vehicle, but that point is not widely understood. There is a job of work to be done by the Garda in addressing that and making it clear to those operating a mechanically-propelled vehicle what their responsibilities are in that respect.

These are issues that crop up in the constituency I share with Deputy Ellis and in many other constituencies, particularly in the Dublin area, where there are large housing estates. There has been no serious attempt by the authorities to address this problem, which tends to be hidden away in estates and for that reason causes much aggravation to local residents. There has not been any adequate official response to it. The problem exists, certainly within housing estates, but it is particularly acute when young people use those vehicles in what are regarded as public places other than public roads. I refer in particular to playing fields and public parks. This is something that has been identified over some time by the Garda. For example, local authority parks do not come under the ambit of the Road Traffic Acts because the roadways or pathways in parks do not constitute public roads. This was confirmed to me in a reply to a parliamentary question by the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Varadkar, earlier in the year. I raised this issue and asked him to confirm that the Road Traffic Acts did not apply to public parks. The Minister confirmed this in his reply, stating that if the parks are places to which the public do not have access with vehicles, it is a matter for the management body concerned to provide for and enforce relevant governing legislation or by-laws, including on the use of quad bikes, as the case may be, to ensure that all persons comply with the permitted use of the park. It has been confirmed that the Garda cannot enforce the Road Traffic Acts within public parks, and that is the nub of the problem. Deputy Ellis, in this legislation, is seeking to provide for powers in order to be able to enforce that legislation in public parks.

Deputy Ellis stated quite clearly that he is dealing with one aspect of the issue here. He is open to amendments in any part of the Bill where they are required. He is taking an open approach in a genuine attempt to address this issue. Deputy Ellis has drafted this legislation and I believe the response of the Government, as outlined by the Minister of State, Deputy Tom Hayes, is wholly inadequate. The Minister of State is ignoring the existence of a problem and putting his head in the stand. I do not know whether it is through lack of awareness of the problem, but there is a genuine attempt being made here to address the problem.

Undoubtedly, there is a serious issue with the use of various motor-propelled vehicles by young people in parks. Others have spoken about this. We regularly hear complaints from sports clubs that on a Saturday or Sunday morning when they go to play a match the pitch has been all dug up the previous night due to the use of scrambler bikes or mini-bikes. It costs a lot of money and takes a lot of time to reinstate a pitch that has been destroyed in such a manner to a point at which it is playable.

The other point is that public parks are where parents take their children to ride tricycles or go to a playground and where the elderly go for walks, and they are prevented from doing that because of the use of these kind of vehicles.

The Garda's hands are tied in tackling this problem. If the Minister of State speaks to a garda working in any of the constituencies in the Dublin area, the garda will explain the nature of the problem here. Their hands are tied because they cannot enforce the Road Traffic Acts in a public park. This is a genuine issue.

I would appeal to the Minister of State, who has been given a script to read, to engage with those on this side of the House and accept that we raise this issue genuinely because it is a serious problem. It means that what should be the terrific local amenities of public parks, in which local authorities are investing a great deal, are being rendered unusable in many cases because of the practice of young people using these vehicles which cause such a danger to other park users and to themselves.

There is a need for the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport to focus on this issue. It should stop talking about youth diversion programmes and such matters. That is irrelevant to this problem. There is a real practical problem in relation to the use of these vehicles in public parks and we need a practical solution. Deputy Ellis has proposed a solution that goes a long way towards dealing with the problem, and I would appeal to the Minister of State to keep an open mind on this and recognise at least that the problem exists and that something practical has to be done to enable it to be tackled by the Garda in conjunction with the local authorities. As for stating that it is a matter for the local authorities to deal with, the Minister of State knows perfectly well that there are not staff from local authorities in parks at 10 o'clock, 11 o'clock or 12 o'clock at night. Gardaí recognise that there is a problem but their hands are tied because of the absence of appropriate legislation.

I would ask the Minister of State to step back to consider the points being made here today, to recognise that this is a real problem in local communities, to accept the bona fides of Deputy Ellis in attempting to address this problem and to at least not oppose this legislation. He should say that the Government accepts the legislation, recognises there is a problem and will do its utmost to deal with it. I strongly appeal to the Minister of State to take that approach.

Aengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
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I seriously expect the Government at least to support the Bill's proceeding to Committee Stage.

This is an issue that has been addressed at virtually every joint policing committee, JPC, around the country. I am one of those who has served on a JPC since such committees were founded and who encouraged the then Minister to set them up to address problems such as this. When the local authority members, national public representatives, local gardaí and officials from the local authorities come together and find problems in legislation that need to be addressed, they can raise those issues.

This issue has been raised in particular in Dublin, because that is the area that I am well aware of. Time after time, we have been told by the Garda and local authority officials that their hands are tied. This piece of legislation is to address a particular problem.

I was not in the Chamber to hear all of the speech by the Minister of State, Deputy Tom Hayes, but I have not heard such claptrap in all my life. Most of the four-page script that he read out had nothing to do with the point that has been raised, but one of the worst aspects is that Deputy Tom Hayes knows about his own local authority area in south Tipperary, where this is a problem. Deputy Tom Hayes raised the issue of anti-social behaviour in the towns of Cashel, Cahir and Carrick-on-Suir in this Chamber when he was on the Opposition benches. The local authorities in those areas with which he is familiar have identified the misuse of quads and other motorised miniature vehicles as a particular anti-social problem in specific areas. I will give one example, which emerged only recently, in the Glen Oaks estate in Clonmel, of which Deputy Tom Hayes will be aware. It was only last year that the local authority had to take measures to put in place two walls to prevent access to a field which was being misused by anti-social elements in that town.

One of the residents' chief complaints related to the noise associated with the misuse of scramblers on that site. If it was so easy for An Garda Síochána to-----

Tom Hayes (Tipperary South, Fine Gael)
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What happened in that instance? If the Deputy is going to tell a story, he should tell it properly.

Aengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
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The council blocked access to the site. My point is that if it really was so easy for gardaí to address the problem, then they would have done so. The Minister of State has referred repeatedly to the force's position on this issue, but the reality is that the Garda did not have the law behind it in this case. The only way to deal with the issue was to block access to the site. Of course, blocking access to public parks is not a desirable solution. We should not be making it more difficult for parents with prams, for example, to walk through the gates of public amenities. We should be seeking to ensure that people who want to play football at the weekend can do so. There should not be a situation, as other Deputies referred to, where people turn up to find the pitch destroyed. Public moneys are being pumped into these parks to maintain playing surfaces and so on, only to have them destroyed by motorbikes or, on one occasion in my constituency, a car. In that instance the council had spent a fortune upgrading two pitches but on the weekend they were due to be opened, a car was driven into the park and destroyed them both. Local football teams and local communities are suffering the impact of this type of activity.

The response from the Garda at local level to these events is that its hands are tied. The purpose of this legislation is to untie the hands of gardaí, so they can go in and confiscate the vehicles that are causing the problem and pursue the people who are engaged in this type of vandalism. Gardaí must have the capacity to take action against the owners of the quads, motorcycles, scramblers and other vehicles that are causing damage and creating a noise nuisance, right through the night in some cases. The problem is especially acute around Christmas time, when people receive these vehicles as presents. Young people are putting themselves and others in dangerous situations because the vehicles are being driven at breakneck speed through public areas. That is what the Bill seeks to address. It is not about trying to deal with the problem in the way it was dealt with in Clonmel, because that was a private park and it was possible to block access to it. I am aware of other areas in south Tipperary in which this problem has arisen and has not been fully addressed. I am sure gardaí in south Tipperary would love to have the powers Deputy Ellis is proposing to give them to confiscate the vehicles in question.

This issue has been an ongoing problem for several years now and any step we can take to address it is welcome. Some local authorities might be able to take imaginative action, as was done in Clonmel and in certain instances by South Dublin County Council, for example, but they should not be obliged to create new by-laws to address the problem. What we need is an overarching law, which is what Deputy Ellis's Bill will provide. The Deputy has acknowledged that his proposals might not be the final word on the issue. That is why he has asked that the Bill be sent to the committee where there will be an opportunity to invite local authority members, gardaí and so on in to discuss it.

The Minister of State indicated that the Garda has a certain view on this matter. I would be interested to know the view of the Attorney General, which is what is usually referenced by Ministers in this Chamber. Anybody who attends meetings of any joint policing committee in this city or throughout the country will conclude that the view of gardaí, in fact, is that there is a need for this legislation. Gardaí are not seeking new laws for the sake of having new laws. They are seeking change because this particular problem is one of the issues that is raised most often in local policing fora. Gardaí have repeatedly stated that this change is required because, without it, their hands are tied. Even the Minister with responsibility for this area, who is not in the Chamber today, has acknowledged the need for action, in a context where public parks are designated in a way that makes it difficult for An Garda Síochána to confiscate vehicles and prosecute those involved in this type of activity.

I appeal to the Minister of State to reconsider his position. Opposing this measure would be a retrograde step. I urge him instead to allow it to progress and be a mechanism by which the transport or justice committee can examine the issue in full and perhaps determine whether there is any additional mechanism to prevent the type of abuse of our public spaces we have seen. The people who engage in this behaviour have no regard for their own community, other road users or the users of public amenities. In many ways, they have no regard for themselves - after all, these are dangerous vehicles being operated in a dangerous way. It is something that happens quite regularly in my own area of Dublin South-Central and is raised by constituents on a continuous basis. I urge the Minister of State to get real and recall when he was on this side of the House, not so long ago, appealing to Ministers to allow the Garda Síochána to take the type of action to tackle anti-social behaviour that Deputy Ellis has proposed.

Seán Crowe (Dublin South West, Sinn Fein)
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The Minister of State has said he is not for turning on this issue. If there is a problem there, he is telling us, there is already legislation in place that covers it. Our information is the opposite to that. The Minister of State said that gardaí have told him they do not recommend the approach we are proposing. Will he indicate the ranks of those gardaí? There is clearly a disconnect between the gardaí , of superintendent rank, who have given us information about what is happening in these areas and their colleagues who are informing the Minister of State and his officials.

Does the Minister of State accept there is a problem? Anybody who goes into these areas would agree there is. I am sure there is legislation in place that might possibly be applicable to this problem, but it is not sufficient to address it. Other speakers referred to the noise nuisance element. It is unfortunately the case that in many of the areas I represent, the vroom of revving engines is a constant presence in parks and other green spaces. Sometimes it starts as early as 7 a.m. and, as Deputy Ó Snodaigh mentioned, it might go on through the night. Are the departmental officials suggesting that those responsible should be pursued under the noise legislation?

Reference was made to the cost borne by local football teams as a result of the damage done to pitches. We all commend the many volunteers who work hard to maintain these facilities and ensure they are safe for players. Go to any match, whether soccer, GAA or rugby, and one will see the volunteers walking around the pitch to ensure there are no broken bottles, syringes or anything else that could potentially be harmful. Has the Minister of State attended a football match where a vehicle crosses the pitch during play? Perhaps this type of thing is unknown to others in this House, but I have been at football matches where a horse crossed a pitch. I have seen quads and motorcycles bring driven across the field. What does one do in a situation where these vehicles are causing damage to public spaces day after day and night after night? Mostly people pick up the telephone and call the local Garda station; certainly, that is what we would advise them to do. I am going around knocking on doors at the moment and people are telling me there is a problem in regard to green spaces. Johnny So-and-So has a moped or motorcycle, they tell me, and is going up and down the green space day and night.

What does the Minister of State suggest I do? I tell them to telephone the Garda and they do. However, when the Garda come down they say that, because of the way the legislation is framed they cannot seize the vehicle. Therefore, what does one do? Does one wait for them to come off the green space and arrest them on the road? We have a situation where we will get a Garda vehicle, possibly more than one, to catch the individual, particularly if he is on a motorbike, so the gardaí will sit around the park all day in the hope of catching the individual leaving the park. They may be able to do it under the Criminal Damages Act or perhaps under the Wildlife Act on the basis that they are interfering with wildlife and the noise may be affecting the breeding season of the local ducks. Is that what the Minister of State is suggesting?

Like others, I have sat on local policing forums where we have discussed the problem of motorbikes and quads. At my own local forum in Tallaght, we discussed the problem in terms of motorbikes. At the time I was told by the local superintendent that the Garda would upskill and train a unit to go into the parks and arrest the individuals on these bikes. As many parks do not have fencing, they can come in at different angles and get away just as easily. When my local GAA club telephones and asks if I can do anything about the mopeds, quads and whatever else is driving across the pitch and destroying it, I say that legislation is already in place and the Garda can respond. Yet, when one telephones the Garda station, the Garda says it cannot do it because it does not have the powers to seize the vehicles. Do we have to wait for them to come back on the roads, if that is the solution?

I believe that parks should be inclusive spaces for everyone. I do not think anybody in the House would disagree with that. A young mother or a young father with a child in a pram, will certainly not go into a park where there are motorbikes, quads and other vehicles driving up and down. That means those families cannot enjoy the playgrounds or the services in that park. Again, what are we to say to those families? Do we tell them it is an exclusive space for these individuals. Deputy Róisín Shortall said that the noise of the vehicles driving up and down is intimidating. If this happens on the green space where one lives and one telephones the Garda and there is no response, what is one to do? The Minister of State is saying there are responses and solutions here. We are supposed to be legislators to come up with solutions.

Deputy Dessie Ellis has drafted legislation having seen a gap, a problem and the impact it has on the community he represents. Many of us who are active in our own communities could say that the problem is not just in Finglas and Crumlin, it all over this city and other cities and towns and villages. The problem may not be as bad in other areas but it is bad and it is really bad in some areas, so the attempt in the Bill is to come up with a solution. However, we are told there is no need, that the legislation is in place. I am aware of the positive work of the youth diversion projects in many communities and I would like to see more of them active right across the State.

We speak about anti-social behaviour. I do not know what happens at the Minister of State's clinics but not a week goes by but people come to my office intimidated and frightened and want to get out of their homes because of what is happening. I am aware that legislation is in place to deal with intimidation but, unfortunately, it is not delivering for those families who are affected, and similarly in this case. Will the Minister of State please outline to us who are active in our communities what exactly the Garda is to do in such a situation? It tells us one thing: it may be telling the Minister of State something different. If so, that is wrong; that is not the approach I want to see. If there are steps we can take to eliminate the problem without the necessity for Deputy Dessie Ellis's Bill, please outline them to us before the debate ends.

The Minister of State mentioned neighbourhood watch. If there is a problem concerning these cars in one's neighbourhood, does one telephone the Garda and what happens next? What are the steps after that? He has not outlined that in his contribution - he may have another contribution in his pocket - and the position is not clear. The problem still exists and it will exist when the Government votes down the Bill on Tuesday. I do not know if he can go back and discuss the matter with his colleagues. I do not think that anything I say will convince him that we have a serious problem which is growing. Some people said the problem was with youth. It is not just youth as some of those involved are adults and some are teenagers but there are many people involved in this activity and it is getting worse.

In my community we have joyriders back again. Many of us thought that was a thing of the past and we will be told there are all kinds of responses to that issue. The joyriders or the joy killers are active again. I am aware there are measures the Garda can take. We had an epidemic of it before and it is back again. Similarly, with this problem, sometimes it ebbs and flows but where there is a problem it is really difficult. We do not have any solutions and we cannot say anything to those families who are affected by it. We are talking about decent families who want their children to live in the best environment possible, who want to walk their children in the park and who want their children to play in the park, the carparks to be inclusive and we have not been able to deliver. Shame on us, and shame on this House if the Bill is voted down.

Seán Kenny (Dublin North East, Labour)
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As no other Deputy is offering, the Minister of State may reply for five minutes, immediately before the proposer replies, if he wishes.

Tom Hayes (Tipperary South, Fine Gael)
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I thank Deputies for their contributions which were quite genuine and informative. There are a few basic points I wish to deal with. Much emphasis was put on the Garda Síochána. I was quite clear and I outlined the position in my opening statement. I was questioned on where the Garda came from, and from what level of the Garda the information came. The information arrived this morning from the Garda Commissioner's office in the Phoenix Park. The view of the Garda Síochána, as I made clear, is that there are sufficient powers available to them under existing legislation and that there are serious problems inherent in the draft Bill, as presented to the House. That is the view of the Garda in black and white and I have no problem putting that on the record of the House.

I did not deny at any stage that there was a problem in some communities. This problem is being addressed by the Garda. The fact is that I mentioned this in my opening address. Section 8 of the Criminal Justice (Public Order) Act 1994 provides that a Garda may direct a person who engages in disorderly or anti-social behaviour to leave the area in question. That is in the legislation. Failure to comply with the direction is an offence, punishable by a fine or up to six months imprisonment, or both. These are the facts. That is why I stated in my opening remarks that there are other ways of doing it.

There is no point in introducing extra legislation and believing that it will solve every problem. That is the issue. There are other ways of dealing with it.

Deputy Ó Snodaigh referred to Clonmel. I do not know if he is relying on his memory or it is good research, but it is true that there was an issue. It was dealt with, and fair play to the gardaí who dealt with it in co-operation with the local community. They did not fob it off.

Aengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
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The council built the wall, not the Garda.

Tom Hayes (Tipperary South, Fine Gael)
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Yes. It was dealt with in co-operation with the local authority. That is what must happen.

If this becomes a bigger problem-----

Seán Crowe (Dublin South West, Sinn Fein)
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If it moves to middle class areas, it will be a problem.

Tom Hayes (Tipperary South, Fine Gael)
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The members of the Dublin local authorities were contacted for the numbers. It has been raised at some of the joint policing committees but it was raised in tandem with other issues in the area. To suggest that introducing this legislation will immediately eliminate the problem is not the case. That is the reason it is being opposed.

Other issues were raised in this regard. Deputy Dooley raised the matter of car parking charges. While I agree with what he said, decisions on car parking charges can be made by the members of the local authority. This is an issue his party has been promoting.

In general, the reason the Government decided to oppose this legislation is that it is not seen as something that can solve a problem. We do not believe the problem is as big as the Deputy outlined, but if it becomes a bigger problem and there are statistics and facts to support that from the local authorities and there is a recommendation from the Garda, the Deputy could introduce it at a future date. At present, however, it is the Government's decision to oppose the legislation.

Dessie Ellis (Dublin North West, Sinn Fein)
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I am absolutely flabbergasted by the Minister's response. It is not dealing with the real world. The Minister says advice was provided from the Garda Commissioner's officer. It flies in the face of what is said by every garda and superintendent I have met at the joint policing committees, which are also attended by councillors and Deputies from Fine Gael and the Labour Party. The Acting Chairman, Deputy Seán Kenny, attends them and has heard that there is a problem in the legislation. We have road traffic legislation, but it does not deal with public parks.

This is not just about the damage done to the parks. It is about the pathways on which these vehicles, be they motorbikes, quads or otherwise, are driven in a dangerous fashion, sometimes by children as young as four years old. We are talking about a very specific area, not all the laws that are in place. We already know those laws are there and that there are other means of catching people, but this is specifically to deal with a vehicle. The gardaí cannot seize the vehicles. Did the Minister not understand that? That is the problem.

Tom Hayes (Tipperary South, Fine Gael)
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I did, but they can talk to them.

Dessie Ellis (Dublin North West, Sinn Fein)
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No, they cannot take them. If they do, they must give them back. That is the specific issue we are discussing. I have attended numerous meetings with gardaí but they have consistently told me that they cannot seize the vehicles. Is the Garda Commissioner lost somewhere? If he is giving this advice, there is something wrong.

All we ask is that this legislation be brought forward and debated and if areas must be addressed or areas are omitted, let us deal with that. However, the Minister has come here to shoot down this simple Bill. Everybody here knows there is a problem, as does the Minister. He might be defending the position as written in the script, but he knows there is a problem just as I do.

People in communities in my area cannot sleep because of the motorbikes driving around all night. In Finglas, vehicles travel around Dunsink dump all night and the residents cannot sleep. The vehicles cannot be seized, so they can be driven around until the cows come home. Our parks and some of our green areas are a safe haven for them. The Government is putting its head in the sand and the Garda Commissioner says we do not have a problem, but the gardaí tell us something different.

I cannot believe what I have heard. We cannot even debate this in the House. Members of the Minister's party know that not only Dublin but Cork and other areas across the country have the same problem, because they are encountering it daily. Can we not hear their voices to verify that this is the case? The Government is saying it will shoot down this Bill, but the community safety statement from the south Tipperary joint policing committee in 2011 identified quads and motorised miniature vehicles as an issue. That is in the Minister's constituency. The committee knows it is a problem and knows we cannot seize the vehicles. People can joyride around the park until the cows come home. The attitude is that it will be dealt with when they come out onto the road. The Minister is saying that if they are not doing damage in the park, even though they are flying around on the paths and endangering people, they can be left there as there are other means of dealing with them when they come out onto the road. We are putting people's lives at risk and communities in danger.

This is happening everywhere. It is not just confined to working class areas. It is a bigger problem in certain areas, but it is a problem in every area of the country. The Minister mentioned section 8 for dealing with this, but that does not confiscate the vehicle. The big problem here is the vehicle. I am pleading with the Minister. The Minister for Justice and Equality, Deputy Shatter, or the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Varadkar, should have been in the House to deal with this. I called down to the Minister, Deputy Vardkar, to try to explain what I am seeking to do but I could not catch him. I ask the Minister of State to go back to the Ministers on this specific matter. It is a major problem and we cannot ignore it, but that is what the Government is trying to do.

The gardaí will confirm this and are saying as much themselves. The Minister should ask them. The policing committee in Dublin City Council, which is the biggest in the country, has this issue on its agenda. The gardaí and the superintendents have said it is a problem that must be dealt with. The specific problem is that the Garda does not have the power to seize the vehicles. All I ask is that the Minister reconsider his position and not just shoot down this Bill. He should think again and ask the Ministers to examine it again. I am prepared to meet with them and explain the problem.

It is a far bigger problem than the Minister has said. It is a massive issue because communities are being tortured. People in parks are not afforded the same protection as they have on a road. That is the issue, and it must be addressed. One cannot simply leave them be in that area, which is what the Minister is effectively saying. I never claimed that this Bill would solve everything. I asked for suggestions to deal with the problem. I plead with the Minister to think again and not just put the Bill to a vote and dismiss it. For me, this is an issue involving the health, safety and interests of our citizens in our parks as well as looking after our parks.

Michael Kitt (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
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In accordance with Standing Order 117A(4), the division is postponed until immediately after the Order of Business on Tuesday, 11 March 2014.