Dáil debates

Tuesday, 10 December 2013

Other Questions

Magdalen Laundries Issues

3:40 pm

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
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73. To ask the Minister for Justice and Equality when he will establish, fund, staff and accommodate a small dedicated unit charged to provide the following services for eligible Magdalen women as recommended by Mr. Justice Quirke and if this unit will publish quarterly reports on its work: a help-line accessible daily by the women to assist them to obtain the health, monetary and other benefits to which they will now be entitled; investigative and other help and assistance in obtaining such sheltered or other housing as they may be entitled to; investigative and other help and assistance in obtaining such educational assistance as they may be entitled to; practical and, if necessary, professional assistance to enable those women who wish to do so to meet with those members of the religious orders who have similar wishes to meet and interact; similar practical assistance to meet and interact with other Magdalen women; the acquisition, maintenance and administration of any garden, museum or other form of memorial which the scheme's administrator, after consultation with the advisory body or committee referred to, has decided to construct or establish. [52551/13]

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
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On 7 November last, the Minister announced that the Cabinet had agreed details of the implementation of the Quirke scheme for women who had been in Magdalen laundries. However, the announcement at the time only dealt with monetary payments, which the women still await, with no mention of the other strands of Mr. Justice Quirke's recommendations. My question asks about those other strands, including a help-line that is accessible to survivors to assist them in achieving and maintaining health monitoring and the other benefits to which they are entitled.

Photo of Alan ShatterAlan Shatter (Dublin South, Fine Gael)
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The Government's first priority is to facilitate the processing of applications under the scheme and to implement those measures necessary to provide the individual benefits recommended by Mr. Justice Quirke to the women who were admitted to and worked in the institutions in question. To this end, on 5 November 2013 the Government agreed to the payments and services to be provided on an individual basis to women who come within the scope of the scheme.

Within my Department a unit of nine officials is working full-time on engaging with the women and processing applications. They are available to answer a range of questions. Decisions on establishing a permanent and separate dedicated unit, its role and method of operation have not been finalised and will not be finalised until more progress has been made on processing applications and on the provision of payments and benefits. While some preliminary work has been done by my Department on exploring the question of a memorial, again priority is being given to processing applications and the provision of payments and benefits.

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
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I thought the Minister might give that answer. Obviously, the applications must be processed, but it is now ten months since the Taoiseach made the apology to the survivors of these laundries. Many of the survivors are asking whether they will ever see their redress. Two of the women concerned have died, sadly, without seeing a red cent, much less the support services promised under the scheme. Will the Minister be a little more precise? When can survivors expect to receive not only their monetary payments but also to have access to the services?

I have a related question with regard to disputes in respect of a woman's length of stay in one of these laundries. Where does the balance of proof lie? I have a letter from a woman who spent a considerable length of time in the Good Shepherd laundry in Limerick. She is in dispute over the length of stay. The records in these laundries were vastly incomplete and women should not be penalised for the fact that these institutions did not keep, and cannot produce, full records.

Photo of Alan ShatterAlan Shatter (Dublin South, Fine Gael)
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To date, 636 applications have been received and these are being processed as quickly as possible by the Department. A total of 270 provisional letters were issued to applicants that are at an advanced stage of processing requesting them to agree or disagree with the provisional assessment made by my officials on the length of time they were in a relevant institution. Some 145 applicants advised that they agree with the provisional decision and formal letters of offer will issue to these women shortly. The Attorney General's office is also finalising a waiver document which will be sent with the letter of formal offer. I have referred to that document previously.

The Deputy's timeline is somewhat skewed. My recollection is that Mr. Justice Quirke's report was published in June this year, not nine months ago. It recommended that as a precondition of receiving benefits under the scheme the women concerned should sign a waiver not to take proceedings against the State. Before signing the waiver the women will be encouraged to take independent legal advice and financial provision is made to facilitate them doing so. I expect some payments might be made before the end of the year.

Given the length of time involved in processing these requests and applications, will the Minister consider increasing the number of staff in his Department dealing with these matters? As the Minister is well aware, because it has been reiterated repeatedly in this Chamber, the survivors are elderly and in many cases they are in ill health. In fact, two of them are now deceased not having seen a cent. Let us hope we do not see any more victims going to their Maker without the satisfaction of redress from the State.

When there is a dispute between a woman and the institution in question over the length of her stay, will the Minister clarify how that matter is mediated upon and decided? The records in these institutions were incomplete, as recognised by the McAleese report and, more importantly, by the UN Committee Against Torture.

3:50 pm

Photo of Alan ShatterAlan Shatter (Dublin South, Fine Gael)
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I find it difficult to take the Deputy lecturing me on this issue when I compare it to the callousness of her and her colleagues' response to the Smithwick report.

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
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Give over. Answer the question.

Photo of Alan ShatterAlan Shatter (Dublin South, Fine Gael)
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It is amazing how members of one party are sensitive to some issues, but lack the sensitivity to appropriately address or to recognise their responsibility for other issues. As the Deputy should know, matters relating to the scheme were finalised only on 5 November because of the complexity of the Quirke recommendations. My Department has done extraordinarily well since 5 November in sending out 270 provisional letters, 145 of which have been already accepted. Only two applicants have advised that they disagree with the provisional assessment. These cases will be reviewed by an officer of a higher grade and if the applicant still disagrees, we provide a procedure whereby the matter can be dealt with by the Ombudsman's office.

Photo of Finian McGrathFinian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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Another cover-up.

Photo of Alan ShatterAlan Shatter (Dublin South, Fine Gael)
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The Deputy is focusing on one or two applicants who have run into a difficulty, out of 270 odd. I particularly welcome the fact that we have this scheme in place and are processing it. Former residents of the Magdalen laundries have furnished us with their applications and are engaging with us. So far, there has been substantial acceptance of offers made in the context of timelines. I look forward to the reality that in the not too distant future, residents of the Magdalen laundries will receive the funds to which they are entitled. The Government made important decisions to have this issue comprehensively addressed for the sake of residents in Magdalen homes who worked there for no reward. Without the necessity of any prodding from the Deputy, this Government will implement the commitment that was made to the women concerned.

Photo of Finian McGrathFinian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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The Minister is waffling again.

Photo of Mary Lou McDonaldMary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)
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Apparently not, but the Minister is just the sensitive soul of this Chamber.