Dáil debates

Wednesday, 19 June 2013

10:30 am

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I wish to raise the significant step change in the technology and development of wind farms throughout the country that is causing considerable anxiety and concern among communities. While we are supportive of the development of wind energy, what has happened recently has scared communities and caused large divisions in many areas for which major proposals are being prepared.

The size and extent of the new proposed wind farms are causing major anxiety in communities throughout the country. Whereas wind turbines were originally 50-60 m high, the current proposals are for wind turbines of up to 180 m in height. In the midlands, there are proposals to build up to 700 such turbines. In Ardglass between Lisgoold and Castlelyons in east County Cork, another major wind farm has been proposed, covering approximately 18,000 acres. In the Glenties, a recent application covering 475 hectares was turned down by An Bord Pleanála because of the scale of its impact on the locality.

Such large-scale wind farms are being developed in Ireland because of significant public opposition in Britain. Many of them are close to large clusters of housing. In east Cork, for example, more than 300 houses are in the midst of industrial wind turbines. To give people a sense of the scale, the proposed turbines would be twice the size of the Elysian. That is an enormous height, but people do not have a proper appreciation of what is being proposed.

There is a fundamental absence of transparency governing these developments. There is an absence of consultation with local residents and communities. Above all, there is an absence of a legislative framework to deal with the step change in technology and scale of development. Since the wind farms are being located close to residential areas, the health implications are causing concern to residents in terms of noise, shadow flicker, the destruction of amenities, particularly residential amenities, the negative visual impact, etc.

Photo of Michael KittMichael Kitt (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
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Could I have a question please, Deputy?

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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To illustrate the level of concern, Professor Alun Evans, who has written in the British Medical Journal, wrote to the residents of each Cork, stating: "I greatly sympathise with you in your plight. Quite simply your life will be ruined if this goes ahead."

A Government intervention is required. The 2006 planning guidelines are outdated and were never framed in the context of the technology that is emerging. Will the Government introduce legislation to govern the development of large-scale industrial wind farms? As a matter of urgency, will the Government accelerate the updating of the guidelines to deal with this new technology?

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Deputy Martin has raised a very interesting point. This is a serious matter. Our country imports between €6 billion and €7 billion worth of energy in fossil fuels every year. Clearly, the Government has set targets to be reached by 2020 in terms of the reduction of carbon emissions. This is an enormous bill that our people must pay.

When I came into this House in the beginning, the Minister for Lands - the Minister for the environment at the time - had full and absolute authority in respect of planning permissions for any kind of development. Clearly, the path that that followed led to serious problems and serious issues, tribunals and all of that. We have got a very robust, very independent and very analytical planning process now.

Deputy Martin made the point that the guidelines did not deal with the extent of the change in technology and its sophistication these days. I would argue differently. The environmental impact analyses that are now required for almost every kind of planning application are exhaustively extensive, I have to say. Clear consultation and discussion with communities is very important.

I know there are two major applications for wind farms in the country. I remind the Deputy that, because of our relationship with Great Britain and because of the energy requirements of Great Britain between now and 2020 in particular, with more than £50 billion to be spent, we signed a memorandum of understanding with Britain whereby if through the planning process here approval is given for wind development or renewable energy development in general, we can export energy directly to the British market, subsidised by the British taxpayer as part of that memorandum of understanding.

I visited the wind farm between Charleroi and Brussels two years ago. It is one of the highest turbine masts in Europe. Farmers get paid approximately €100,000 per year for the location of the mast. These are turbines without gearboxes, so there is none of the traditional noise that used to emanate from them.

Where I live in the west, there are 40 or 50 turbines on the hill. Some of them are ten or 15 years old and they are not as large as the ones the Deputy is talking about.

Consultation is critical. To be honest about this, I understand that the companies involved have had extensive and ongoing consultations with local communities. Deputy Martin might disagree with that; I am informed differently. That is a point of argument again.

Photo of Robert TroyRobert Troy (Longford-Westmeath, Fianna Fail)
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Hot air.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I recall 30 years ago-----

Photo of Finian McGrathFinian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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Like Deputy Durkan, it is hot air.

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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Best wind turbine in the House.

(Interruptions).

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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-----when we had the provision of telecom masts around the country, all of the public meetings that used to take place-----

(Interruptions).

Photo of Michael KittMichael Kitt (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
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Order, please.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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-----about how these were going to be obstructionist on the landscape and how they were going to create all kinds of difficulty. They were a very important part of the development of our economy in terms of communications.

Deputy Martin asked me to intervene and update the guidelines.

I will see that the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government is cognisant of the guidelines. The Deputy's Government did some good work in terms of wind farm and renewable energy development and we want to build on that.

10:40 am

Photo of Patrick O'DonovanPatrick O'Donovan (Limerick, Fine Gael)
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There is a first time for everyone.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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However, we cannot interfere with the very extensive and analytical planning process whereby environmental impact analysis is up to date with every aspect of intrusion on landscape or other interference.

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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Call in Big Phil.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Of course, when one looks at the spread of population in the country, there are very few places where there can be extensive masts that are not in sight of houses. I once had an engagement with a fisherman in respect of lake development and I asked him what he wanted. He said he did not want to have any house within sight of the waters of the lake in question. Some things are impossible. I have applications in my hand that concern part of our capacity to produce renewable energy to sell into the British market, as subsidised by the British taxpayer, but they are subject to a very strict environmental analysis and planning process. I cannot interfere with that. I will ask the Minister to reflect on the guidelines which, as the Deputy stated, have not been updated.

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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Big Phil again.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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My understanding is that the environmental impact analysis process is exhaustive in dealing with all of the modern issues raised these days.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I am alarmed by the Taoiseach's response. Who represents the citizen in this? Is this House meant to represent and protect the citizen?

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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That has gone long ago.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I am not asking the Taoiseach to interfere in individual planning applications. I do not know if he is aware that his own Government commenced a review of the 2006 guidelines but, unfortunately, allowed only two weeks for submissions from the public. The point is that the 2006 guidelines are hopelessly out of date given the new technology. We are not talking about a couple of turbines on the side of a hill. We are talking about 700 wind turbines proposed for the midlands that will produce exclusively for export under guidelines that, by any professional evidence basis and according to professionals in the field, are hopelessly out of date and inappropriate for what is being proposed. The health implications are real for residents who are close to such large-scale industrial wind turbines. I am simply asking the Taoiseach to create and bring in a legislative framework to govern the development of such large industrial wind farms. It is as simple as that. The planning authorities need guidelines. Even the county development plans are ambiguous in terms of their provision in this area. I have looked at the plan for Cork, for example, and could not understand how wind turbines that were so high could be placed so close - 500 metres - to houses.

We had this situation before with afforestation for which, understandably, there was great momentum. I am for afforestation but it went overboard at the time. Houses were completely enclosed by massive forests, which is wrong. What happened to citizens on that occasion was wrong. The same will happen here. Citizens are concerned and anxious, and we must ask why. It is because there is no consultation. The Taoiseach stated there was extensive consultation but there is no consultation going on. Let him talk to his own Deputies from the midlands. That is why a Government Deputy has tabled his own legislation in this area, seeking to have it dealt with. That is why a Senator in the Government ranks tabled legislation in the Seanad almost six months ago to deal with this issue. When there is an absence of consultation and transparency and a lack of acknowledgement of the genuine concerns of moderate people, the Taoiseach is looking for trouble. He is out of touch on this issue and quickly needs to get in touch with it and provide a framework that at least protects the health of residents, their residential amenities and the visual impact on them. That is the least residents and citizens can expect from their Government.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I do not know whether the Deputy is for or against renewable energy, given his contribution, but I reject his assertion that we are being in any way alarmist. People have every right to live where they choose and in accordance with proper planning conditions. Any application that comes in for industrial or private needs is subject to the planning process. I do not know whether the major applications here relate to the critical infrastructure process and therefore go directly to An Bord Pleanála, but let Deputy Martin not tell me that he has all the answers. I am informed there is extensive consultation with communities, people and personnel.

Photo of Willie O'DeaWillie O'Dea (Limerick City, Fianna Fail)
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Then the Taoiseach is misinformed.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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In the same way, when gas lines were installed throughout the country or when the major motorways were being built, there was extensive consultation, with everybody consulted on an individual basis.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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People have had to convene their own meetings.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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There is a process for arbitration or appeasement and, ultimately, for decision. I cannot say whether the applications for wind turbines will be successful. I cannot speak for An Bord Pleanála. All I can tell the Deputy is that the process of updating the guidelines is one element, but we have no function in determining the outcome of this, given the independence of An Bord Pleanála. I am quite sure the Deputy accepts that.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I never mentioned that. I spoke about legislation and guidelines.

Photo of Michael KittMichael Kitt (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
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The Taoiseach to conclude, please.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The Deputy mentioned that the planning process does not take account of current changes in technology.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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It does not. The guidelines are out of date.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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From the very extensive environmental impact analyses that are required to be submitted and which reach many thousands of pages of detailed analysis, my understanding is that they are taken into account. Given the legacy left behind in regard to agriculture, the expertise was never there to deal with the detail of environmental impact analysis in different parts of the country. I have had contact from communities about this.

I share everyone's view that consultation and information are necessary. Had we had those in respect of other major applications throughout the country, things might have been much smoother. These proposals are not yet a reality and I cannot say whether they will become a reality in the context of their applications. There is a process which is independent and robust and which takes account of all these aspects. It is a matter for the promoters and local authorities involved to have extensive consultation with communities, which I support, in order that they are fully informed as to what is involved.

Photo of Michael KittMichael Kitt (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
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I call An Teachta Gerry Adams.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I asked whether the Taoiseach intends to bring in a legislative framework - yes or no.

Photo of Michael KittMichael Kitt (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
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I have called Deputy Adams.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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Does the Taoiseach plan to legislate? Will the Minister bring in a legislative framework? That is all I ask.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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An bhfuil sibh críochnaithe?

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Deputy Martin claimed we were being alarmist in this regard.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I never said the Taoiseach was alarmist.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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There is an independent and robust planning-----

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I made the opposite claim. The Taoiseach is not being alarmist at all.

(Interruptions).

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I asked him to answer "yes" or "no".

Photo of Michael KittMichael Kitt (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
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I have called Deputy Adams. Can we please have order?

Photo of Emmet StaggEmmet Stagg (Kildare North, Labour)
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Scaremongering.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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Tá a fhios agam. Níor mhaith liom cur isteach ar an díospóireacht idir an Taoiseach agus ceannaire Fhianna Fáil. Ba mhaith liom ceist a chur ar an Taoiseach faoi féinmharú. Last weekend a suicidal man was turned away from the acute mental hospital unit in Roscommon. According to the Psychiatric Nurses Association, PNA, that unit does not have the required level of staff to deal with patients. This crisis has been exacerbated by the Government's cuts agenda, specifically the closure of St. Luke's ward in Ballinasloe. We have talked about this before. As many as 1,000 citizens are reported to have taken their own lives - that is three people every day throughout this island. That figure does not deal with self-harm or with those whose deaths are not reported as suicides. In spite of this suicide tsunami, suicide prevention and mental health services are seriously under-resourced.

Tá sé an-soiléir ó na figiúirí atá foilsithe gurb é féinmharú fadhb mhór na linne seo. Cuireann an easpa acmhainní leis an bhfulaingt. Yesterday, An Teachta Ó Snodaigh raised the case of a young girl who spent four days in an accident and emergency department in Cork because there is a shortage of beds in the child and adolescent mental health services unit. She was eventually transferred to the adult unit. Surely it is not acceptable that children should be admitted to adult mental health units, yet 106 children have been thus admitted. A quarter of all children who presented with mental health issues - 106 children - were admitted to adult mental health units last year. Does the Taoiseach accept this is a crisis? Has he heard what Mr. Paul Gilligan, the clinical psychologist and CEO at St. Patrick's University Hospital, stated? He said the State was failing these young people.

Does the Taoiseach accept that our mental health services are seriously under-resourced and will he ensure that the Minister of State, Deputy Kathleen Lynch, intervenes immediately to tackle the crisis in Roscommon? Does he agree that a wider response across the island is required?

10:50 am

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I assure Deputy Adams that the Minister of State, Deputy Kathleen Lynch, is closely involved in this. She met with the two senior officials from the Department and the HSE in regard to the situation that arose in Roscommon. I understand that HSE west has adequate nursing staff. This has been confirmed by senior personnel. However, they are inequitably distributed throughout the region, which is why the issue has to be addressed by redeployment. This is why the Minister of State was involved in the issue before it was ever raised in this House. I understand from the HSE that the Roscommon acute psychiatric unit has experienced a high level of sick leave among staff over the past number of weeks and, therefore, to maintain a safe environment for patients and staff, which is very important, the HSE is operating acute services across Galway and Roscommon. I heard the comments from one of the co-ordinators of the psychiatric services this morning.

The HSE reports that a robust clinical plan was in place last weekend and it remains in place for the management of acute admissions across the region. The Deputy will be aware that Galway and Roscommon mental health services are managed as a single service across the two counties. There are three acute units in the area, in Roscommon, Ballinasloe and University College Hospital, Galway. If any one of these acute units reaches its maximum operational capacity because of the number of patients with illnesses, patients will receive treatment in one of the neighbouring units. That is normal practice across mental health units in Ireland. It is what should happen and does happen. I understand that no patient is turned away, as is being alleged. Any person who presents to the acute unit in Roscommon is seen by a psychiatrist who makes a clinical decision on treatment based on individual needs. I am sure that matter was discussed in detail with the Minister of State, who is more than capable of providing a detailed response.

In regard to the Deputy's question about child and adolescent mental health services, a child should only be admitted as an inpatient to a psychiatric facility as a last resort and should in so far as possible receive the necessary treatment in the community. We are speaking about major structural change in the way mental health services are delivered. For many years, the entire area of mental health services was hived off as the Cinderella of the health service. This Government has made it a central part of the delivery of normal health services. This is why the Minister of State is focused on dealing with the adjustments that have to be made around the country.

Where staff retired last year as part of the voluntary retirement scheme, it resulted in a reduction in psychiatric nursing capacity in many parts of the country but the replacement is not happening in strictly the same way because the institutions are moving into the community and services will be provided in communities by qualified personnel. The Minister of State met with the HSE and the Department of Health about the issue in Roscommon just last night.

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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I am pleased that the Minister of State has intervened. We will watch that space. It is reported that a man was turned away and the fact is that a child was put into an adult mental health unit. The figures set out in the report of the Mental Health Commission indicate that 160 of the 2,056 young people waiting for treatment for mental health issues had been waiting between nine and 12 months. One quarter of those who were admitted for treatment were admitted to adult mental health units. Surely it is unacceptable to treat a child in an adult mental health unit.

In regard to suicide prevention, every three days a citizen takes his or her own life - this is only the number reported. A Vision for Change was launched ten years ago to deliver on a mental health strategy but it has not yet been implemented. I have asked on numerous occasions for an all-island approach to this issue. We should put together an authority that would be similar to the Road Safety Authority to deal with it. Although we are currently discussing a particular problem for young people, the issue does not only affect young people. This State ranks fourth highest in suicide rates among those aged between 15 years and 24 years. I attended the funeral in west Belfast of Fr. Matt Wallace, a Wexford man in his late 60s. He was a wonderful and decent man who worked on behalf of the people of west Belfast for decades. He took his own life. I pay tribute to him. It was an awful tragedy for his parishioners in west Belfast and his fellow priests.

This is an issue that arises every day. It is a crisis that requires a proportionate national response. Irrespective of reforms that the Government is introducing, it is a fact that we do not properly fund mental health services. I ask the Government to respond in a proportionate way to the crisis that has arisen for communities and families. The Members of this Dáil know of a friend and fellow Deputy who took his own life. This issue touches everybody and we need to respond to it. We have not thus far developed a response, particularly in regard to mental health issues affecting young people. It is not acceptable to treat young people in adult mental health units.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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We need a national response and we are getting a national response. The Government recognises this is a problem that from its beginning and through to its tragic end in some cases affects communities, households and families all over the country, for a variety of reasons. That is why a Minister of State was appointed, with ring-fenced moneys, to do something about it. It is why the national response is A Vision for Change. It is why the taxpayer funds the national response, which includes an additional €70 million in expenditure for 2012 and 2013.

In regard to inpatient child and adolescent services, 39 child and adolescent psychiatric inpatient beds were available nationally at the end of April 2013, comprising 12 in Dublin, 12 in Cork and 15 in Galway. A further eight beds will be commissioned in Cork, while five more beds will be open in Galway by the end of the year.

The second phase of the child and adolescent unit at St. Vincent's Hospital, Fairview, will increase capacity from 12 to 18 beds in Dublin by the end of 2013. The increase in bed capacity is reflected in a 57% decrease in admissions of children to adult units, from 247 in 2008 to 106 in 2012. I accept that a child should only be admitted to an adult psychiatric unit as a last resource. A Vision for Change recommended the provision of 80 child and adolescent psychiatric inpatient beds. There are currently 39 nationally and the changes that are now taking place will bring that figure to 76 by the end of next year. It is envisaged that the provision of improved community based services, coupled with that increase in bed capacity, will put an end to the practice of placing children and adolescents in adult psychiatric facilities. The additional funding of €70 million between 2012 and 2013 is primarily being used to strengthen community mental health teams in adult and children mental health services.

The Linn Dara child and adolescent mental health facility at Cherry Orchard in Dublin opened recently and a number of child and adolescent community mental health teams have moved into the new premises. It is expected that the day hospital will be operational by the end of this year and it is also proposed to construct a 22-bed inpatient facility on the Cherry Orchard site. The new facility is expected to be completed by the end of this year or early next year. A ten-bed child and adolescent forensic mental health unit will also be provided as part of the proposed new Central Mental Hospital campus which the Government approved some time ago.

On 4 September 2012, the HSE management team approved new access protocols for 16 and 17 year olds to mental health services, which were to come into effect from 1 January 2013. As a result, with effect from the start of this year, in all new cases involving children up to their 17th birthday who require mental health assessment and treatment, the child is seen by the child and adolescent mental health services in areas where current limits are 16 years of age. With effect from 1 January 2014, all children up to their 18th birthday who require mental health assessment and treatment will be seen by the child and adolescent mental health services.

What do these developments mean? They mean the Government has recognised the problem; is implementing the national document, A Vision for Change; has increased expenditure by €70 million over two years; has ring-fenced money specifically for this purpose; and has appointed a Minister of State who is well capable of delivering the structural changes that are important for the country as a whole and individual families.

I take the point Deputy Adams raises and note the concern he expressed. While we cannot do everything overnight, we have a clear strategy to have mental health services provided as part of normal health service delivery in the interests of everybody.

11:00 am

Photo of Clare DalyClare Daly (Dublin North, Socialist Party)
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It is important to take this opportunity to bring some balance into the discussion surrounding the visit of the US President and his wife, given the almost unprecedented slobbering over the Obama family to which the nation has been exposed in recent days. It is difficult to decide which is worse, the outpourings of President Obama and his wife or the sycophantic fawning over them by the political establishment and sections of the media. While we had separate and special news bulletins by the State broadcaster to tell us what Michelle Obama and her daughters had for lunch in Dublin, there was very little questioning of the fact that they were having lunch with Mr. tax exile himself. The statement that Mrs. Obama was glad to be home was barely challenged even though "home" is a country she has been in for less than one week and to which her husband has only tenuous links.

The greatest irony of the visit was the protestations of President Obama in his speech about peace to children in Northern Ireland, in which he stated the following:

To those who choose the path of peace, I promise you, the United States of America will support you every step of the way. We will always be a wind at your back.
Is the US President seeking the hypocrite of the century award? We must call things by their right names. The reality is that by any serious examination, this man is a war criminal. He has just announced his decision to supply arms to the Syrian opposition, including jihadists, which will fuel the destabilisation of the region, continue to undermine secularism and set back conditions for women. President Obama is, in essence, stalling the Geneva peace talks by trying to broker enhanced leverage for the Syrian opposition by supplying it with arms and to hell with the thousands more Syrians who will lose their lives and the tens of thousands who will be displaced as the war continues. This is the man who facilitated a 200% increase in the use of drones which have killed thousands, including hundreds of children.

The Taoiseach has turned a blind eye to these activities. He spoke of the G8 summit being an opportunity to showcase Ireland. Is it not the case that he has showcased us a nation of pimps prostituting ourselves in return for a pat on the head? We were speculating this morning about whether the Taoiseach would deck out the Cabinet in leprechaun hats decorated with stars and stripes to mark our abject humiliation.

Photo of Tom HayesTom Hayes (Tipperary South, Fine Gael)
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Bring back Mattie.

Photo of Clare DalyClare Daly (Dublin North, Socialist Party)
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What steps will the Taoiseach take to follow the correct decision made by his colleague, the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs, Deputy Eamon Gilmore, to vote against a proposal to lift the arms embargo on Syria? What steps will he take to ensure no weapons destined for Syria will be transported through Shannon Airport in breach of our international duties as a neutral State? What steps will he take to showcase this country, not as a lapdog of US imperialism but as an independent nation with an independent foreign policy, one which takes a lead in international diplomacy to outlaw the use of drones, the favourite method of extermination of the Taoiseach's friend, President Obama?

Photo of Anthony LawlorAnthony Lawlor (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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Madame Putin.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Let me first confirm to Deputy Daly that President Obama did not inquire about her whereabouts or well-being. The Deputy's comments are disgraceful and do down the pride of Irish people all over the world who were more than happy to see Ireland host the G8 summit of the leaders of the most industrialised nations of the world. For the Deputy to criticise the American President for offering his continued support for the fragile peace process in Northern Ireland where more than 3,000 people lost their lives in 30 years is a disgraceful doing down. If she represents the Deputies on the back row of the benches opposite, the comments she made were beneath her. Even the comments made by her colleagues, in their brilliance, have never matched what the Deputy has said here.

I remind Deputy Daly that communities in Northern Ireland, various Irish and British Governments and politicians from Northern Ireland have put together a very fragile peace. Far be it for her to criticise somebody who wants to support this process visibly, personally and by providing the assistance of the United States. Some 35 million Irish Americans want the peace process to continue. The young student who introduced President Obama in Belfast put her finger on the matter when she stated that Northern Ireland has both a past and a future. That future is one where peace should abound in and across communities. It is beneath the Deputy to state the American President should not be a party to keeping the peace process alive and visible.

In so far as Syria is concerned, there was a serious discussion among members of the G8 at the summit. I am not sure whether Deputy Daly favours the Russian intervention or the position put forward by the European Union. While there was division among the countries of Europe about the lifting of the arms embargo on Syria, Ireland took a very clear position on the matter, one which was articulated by the Tánaiste, namely, that the embargo should not be lifted. The conclusion of the G8 summit was that the Geneva peace talks should proceed. Nobody wants to see wanton slaughter and the exodus from Syria of hundreds of thousands of people. Far from a warmongering discussion, the question is what can be done to bring about discussions and negotiations that will restore peace and a structure to allow Syria to continue in the time ahead without the obscenities and humanitarian crisis we have witnessed in the past two years.

Photo of John HalliganJohn Halligan (Waterford, Independent)
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The Americans are warmongering in Afghanistan, Iraq and South America. Hezbollah is using American arms.

Photo of Clare DalyClare Daly (Dublin North, Socialist Party)
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I did not say anything about the Northern Ireland peace process. While everyone supports the peace process, that does not give one a licence to do whatever one likes anywhere else around the globe. There is not much peace in Iraq where 26 people lost their lives yesterday, Afghanistan, Pakistan or Syria. My position on Syria is one of agreement with Oxfam, which issued the following statement on the issue:

Sending arms to the Syrian opposition won't create a level playing field. Instead, it risks further fuelling an arms free-for-all where the victims are the civilians of Syria. Our experience from other conflict zones tells us that this crisis will only drag on for far longer if more and more arms are poured into the country.
This is essentially what the Americans have done in Syria. I can only assume from the Taoiseach's failure to answer my question that he will not take steps to ensure arms are not sent through Shannon Airport in breach of our neutrality.

He said here last week that no arms ever came through Shannon Airport. How does he know that given that no investigations take place? In 2012, 548 US planes landed in Shannon Airport. How does he know what was on them if they were never examined? In reply to a parliamentary question, the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport revealed that 239 civilian planes that landed in Shannon Airport sought permission because they were carrying munitions of war or dangerous goods on civilian aircraft. What steps will the Taoiseach take to intervene in this situation?

People in this country are very fond of our American brothers and sisters. We stand far more shoulder to shoulder with them by making valid criticisms of their President who has broken his election promises rather than just pimping this nation as a tax haven for their corporations. I am sure the Americans would far prefer their multinationals to pay their taxes at home rather than offshore here so that they could develop their health care and would not be wasting money on arms being sent to slaughter people in other countries.

11:10 am

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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As the Deputy is aware, 100,000 American people are employed by Irish-owned firms across 50 states, and it is something similar here from American invested corporates in this country. The American Government - I obviously do not speak for it - has taken a view in terms of withdrawal of its troops from Afghanistan and Iraq. There was not any intervention in terms of troops in Libya and there has not been any intervention in terms of troops in Syria. We have never supported rendition flights through Shannon Airport and it ill-behoves the Deputy to make comments that are not true.

(Interruptions).

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Out of the middle of that rant, she seemed to support the Government position as articulated by the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade that this country did not and does not support the lifting of the arms embargo in Syria. Clearly, with an opposition comprising very diverse factions, these are very vexed questions. The decision of the European Council not to agree in terms of the embargo means that that opportunity presents itself. Everybody at the G8 summit, as I understand it, was focused on getting the peace talks in Geneva under way which might bring about some sense of solution here.

Clearly, the Deputy has not condemned the Iranians, Hizbollah or the Russians for supplying arms to the regime of President Assad. She has not commented on the atrocities carried out under President Assad in Syria.

Photo of John HalliganJohn Halligan (Waterford, Independent)
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The arms Hizbollah is using are American arms.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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She seems to have a very biased view of the wanton slaughter of the Syrian people. Everybody on this side, in so far as we are party to the European Union, wants to see a structure that will bring about the removal of President Assad and peace restored to that country and its troubled people, including the hundreds of thousands involved in the exodus across the border with nothing but their families and belongings with them.

Photo of Finian McGrathFinian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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The Taoiseach did not answer the drone question. He ducked it.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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In that sense I hope - it is the hope of the Government - that the peace talks in Geneva can actually take place and that something comes from them. While I was not party to the discussion about Syria at the G8 summit, I understand there was a very frank disclosure about the various views here and that it is hoped something beneficial will come from that.