Dáil debates
Thursday, 18 April 2013
Order of Business
11:00 am
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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It is proposed to take No. 3, Criminal Justice (Money Laundering and Terrorist Financing) (Amendment) Bill 2013 - Order for Second Stage and Second Stage; and No. 25, Credit Reporting Bill 2012 - Second Stage (resumed). It is proposed, notwithstanding anything in Standing Orders, that in relation to the Maternity Protection (Members of the Houses of the Oireachtas) Bill 2013, the Second Stage of which shall be considered tomorrow, the following arrangements shall apply: the opening speech of Deputy Seán Ó Fearghaíl, or a Member nominated in his stead, and the main spokespersons for Sinn Féin, the Technical Group and a Minister or Minister of State, who shall be called upon in that order and may share time, shall not exceed 15 minutes in each case; the speech of each other Member called upon shall not exceed 15 minutes and such Members may share time; a Minister or Minister of State, who may speak twice, shall be called upon not later than 1 p.m. to make a speech which shall not exceed 15 minutes; and Deputy Seán Ó Fearghaíl, or a Member nominated in his stead, shall be called upon to make a speech in reply which shall not exceed 15 minutes.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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There is one proposal to be put to the House. Is the proposal for dealing with Second Stage of the Maternity Protection (Members of the Houses of the Oireachtas) Bill 2013 tomorrow agreed to? Agreed.
The last time a Private Members' Bill was taken on a Friday, I stated it was a shame that we were getting into the habit of ordering business in this fashion. It is for a Member to present a Private Members' Bill and the Government to indicate whether it is accepting it. I feel strongly about this matter because the House should order its own business. Deputies should note that I was totally ignored when I requested previously that this matter be considered.
Timmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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Will the Ceann Comhairle clarify his statement?
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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The idea of a Private Members' Bill is that Members rather than parties have a right to introduce legislation. This procedure worked well when we were allowed to call speakers as they indicated, irrespective of whether they wished to speak for two minutes or five minutes. It is wrong that the House is going down the road of ordering everything. Private Members' Bills are not about the Opposition and Government having their say.
Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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That is a good point and one which I endorse.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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I requested a change as late as this morning but my request was ignored. I call Deputy Martin on the Order of Business.
Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I beg the Ceann Comhairle's indulgence for a moment. On behalf of the Fianna Fáil Party, I express sympathy to people in the town of West, near Waco in Texas, on the appalling tragedy that is unfolding as we speak as a result of an explosion at a fertiliser plant. The enormity and scale of the tragedy is truly shocking. I extend our sympathies to all those who may have been bereaved or severely and gravely injured as a result of the explosion.
On domestic matters, thankfully Chief Justice Susan Denham yesterday evening announced a new forum for communication between the Judiciary and Executive. The Government has accepted her proposal and, having called for such a forum two days ago, I welcome this development. I hope common sense and decency will prevail and the forum will prevent the Minister for Justice and Equality, Deputy Alan Shatter, from losing the run of himself from time to time. The Minister has isolated the Garda and annoyed the Judiciary and more groups may come. The publication of the mediation Bill has never been so eagerly awaited as mediation is clearly required. Will the forum announced by Chief Justice Denham require the enactment of the mediation Bill? Will the Tánaiste provide a timeline for its publication?
11:10 am
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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On my behalf and on that of the Labour Party and the Government, I join Deputy Martin in expressing sympathy to the families of those in the town of West, which is near Waco, in Texas, who lost their lives. Our thoughts are with those who are no doubt worried with regard to what has happened there. I was informed about this matter early this morning by our consulate in Chicago , which covers Texas and which is in contact with the authorities in Texas. The staff of the consulate and my Department are available for any Irish citizens or families who may be concerned about loved ones who may be in the area.
I wish to make two points in respect of the other matter to which Deputy Martin refers. Matters relating to discussions and contacts - whether formal or informal - between the Judiciary and the Executive should not be aired on the public airwaves.
Dara Calleary (Mayo, Fianna Fail)
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Including on "Morning Ireland".
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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The mediation Bill is due to be published late this year.
Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
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I join the Tánaiste and Deputy Martin in expressing sympathy to the families, co-workers and friends of those who lost their lives and to those who were injured in the appalling tragedy in Texas.
I wish to inquire about a number of items of legislation. When will the electoral (amendment) Bill, which deals with a number of technical aspects of elections - including the review of the European Parliament constituencies - be published? When the local government Bill, which will provide for a range of reforms across the area of local government area - including configuration, mergers, etc. - be published? There is great concern with regard to this legislation, particularly as it relates to the future of municipal authorities. When will these Bills be presented to the Houses for debate? Will the Tánaiste also indicate when it is expected that the health (amendment) Bill and the health information Bill will be published?
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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The local government Bill and the electoral (amendment) Bill are due to be published this session. In the context of the latter Bill and the number of European Parliament seats that will be on offer, the relevant matters have been concluded by the European Parliament but the process relating to them remains ongoing. The health (amendment) Bill is also due to be published this session. The health information Bill will be published early next year.
Joe Higgins (Dublin West, Socialist Party)
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What is the envisaged timescale with regard to the publication of the legislation to make provision for the judgment in the X case? Will it not be necessary to expand this legislation to embrace issues relating to the health of women in view of the evidence given by the clinical director of the National Maternity Hospital in the Coroner's Court in Galway yesterday to the effect that the law of this land actually threatens the lives of women? I refer to the assertion regarding the blanket ban on termination in circumstances where the health of a woman may be seriously compromised before it becomes evident, with certainty, that her life may be lost. Does the Tánaiste accept that a new issue has arisen in this regard and that the forthcoming legislation must embrace it?
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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The protection of maternal life Bill is to be published this session.
Tommy Broughan (Dublin North East, Labour)
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I commend the Ceann Comhairle on the remarks he made with regard to the ordering of business for tomorrow. I congratulate him on the way he has attempted to defend the rights of ordinary Members of the House. Since they were introduced, the Friday morning sessions have worked outstandingly well. A great deal of important legislation - introduced by ordinary Members from all parties - has been successfully ventilated in the House. I commend the Ceann Comhairle on defending the rights of ordinary Members in recent times. I refer, in particular, to those Deputies who no longer take the party Whip. The Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform is present and I am of the view that a key step we could take would be to reform significantly the, in many ways, obnoxious Whip system. It does not matter whether they are members of Fine Gael, Fianna Fáil, the Socialist Party or the Labour Party or whether they are Independents, as elected representatives of the people all Deputies have inalienable rights. I hope the successful Friday sessions, without the imposition of the Whip system, will continue.
Will the Tánaiste indicate when it is intended to bring forward the criminal justice (corruption) Bill? In light of the huge recent public interest in reports which appeared in the Sunday Independent over a number of weekends in respect of matters which apparently were not brought to the attention of the Moriarty tribunal, will it be possible for the House to obtain from the Minister for Justice and Equality, Deputy Shatter, an update in respect of what is happening in respect of the reports published by the Mahon and Moriarty tribunals last year?
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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I thank Deputy Broughan for his kind remarks regarding the initiative the Government took in respect of Friday sittings.
Timmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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There will be no need for a mediation Bill so.
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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Those sittings provide Members of the House with the opportunity to introduce Private Members' Bills. The heads of the criminal justice (corruption) Bill were referred to the Joint Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality for discussion.
Brendan Griffin (Kerry South, Fine Gael)
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When will the criminal justice (forensic evidence and DNA database system) Bill be published? This legislation will certainly be of assistance in the fight against crime. When will the fines (amendment) Bill be published? Will the Tánaiste provide an update on progress with regard to the electronic tagging of sex offenders and any legislative provisions which might make this possible?
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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The criminal justice (forensic evidence and DNA database system) Bill is very near completion and it is hoped that it will be published this session. The criminal law (sexual offences) Bill is probably the legislation to which the Deputy is referring in the context of electronic tagging. Proposals relating to this matter were brought to Government last July and it is hoped that the Bill will be published next year.
James Bannon (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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I welcome the announcement that water charges will not be introduced before 2015.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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We are not dealing with water charges now.
James Bannon (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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This is a very important matter.
Mattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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They will not be introduced before the local elections.
James Bannon (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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Will the Tánaiste indicate whether discussions have commenced with the local authorities with regard to staffing arrangements-----
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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This matter is not relevant to the Order of Business.
James Bannon (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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What will be the relationship between local authority staff currently employed in water services sections and Irish Water?
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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That matter would be best raised in another way. It is not proper to the Order of Business.
James Bannon (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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When will the water services Bill be introduced?
Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I do not believe it has been confirmed that the introduction of water charges has been postponed until 2015.
Timmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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It is only in Longford that they have been postponed.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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When will the water services Bill be introduced?
James Bannon (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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Deputy Martin's party intended to introduce water charges in 2014. We have postponed their introduction.
Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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Is that right? That is news to the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform, Deputy Howlin.
Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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Their introduction has been postponed all right.
Timmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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Deputy Bannon must have a direct line to the troika.
Timmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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Mario Draghi is in regular contact.
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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The water services Bill will be introduced this year. I suggest that the Deputy table a parliamentary question to the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government in respect of the other issues he raised.
Dara Calleary (Mayo, Fianna Fail)
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During the week of the St. Patrick's Day celebrations, the Taoiseach indicated that the Construction Contracts Bill was due to go to the Cabinet for clarification on a number of issues before being returned to the relevant committee. Will the Tánaiste clarify the position in respect of the Bill?
The Companies Bill is due to be introduced in the House next week. The Library and Research Service provided an excellent analysis of the Bill, which is extremely complex and which runs to 1,200 pages. I wish to place on record my thanks to the Library and Research Service for its work on that legislation and for all the other work it does.
11:20 am
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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The Government has considered some amendments to the Bill. I understand that it is on Committee Stage. While it is a matter for the committee, my understanding is that the intention is to deal with Committee Stage in this session.
Tom Fleming (Kerry South, Independent)
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My matter relates to the Common Agricultural Policy, CAP, negotiations and the need for legislation.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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I am sorry, but we cannot deal with that matter on the Order of Business. We are on promised legislation.
Tom Fleming (Kerry South, Independent)
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There is a need, given the fact that climatic conditions are not included in the criteria-----
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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The Deputy must find some other way to raise the issue.
Tom Fleming (Kerry South, Independent)
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We in Kerry are devastated-----
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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We have a shortage of time. There are only three minutes remaining, but I have a number of Deputies indicating.
Tom Fleming (Kerry South, Independent)
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-----by a shortage of fodder for farms, which is influenced by climatic conditions. The importation of fodder from the eastern part of the country-----
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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I appreciate that it is a major problem, but I suggest that the Deputy seek a different way to raise it other than on the Order of Business.
Tom Fleming (Kerry South, Independent)
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Will the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine intervene in this urgent matter? There have been financial losses.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Will the Deputy resume his seat? I am sorry to be rude, but he must resume his seat. I call Deputy Durkan.
Tom Fleming (Kerry South, Independent)
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Many farmers will go out of business.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Will Deputy Durkan put his question, please?
Tom Fleming (Kerry South, Independent)
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Provision should be made within the CAP negotiations. County Kerry is getting 80% rainfall, but the east coast is only getting 40%.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Many Deputies have questions on promised legislation. Will Deputy Tom Fleming resume his seat, please?
Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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On promised legislation apropos the ongoing-----
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Please, be quicker. I have a number of Deputies indicating, but we only have three minutes left.
Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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I am doing my best. I have not delayed the House so far.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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I thank the Deputy.
Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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I assure the Ceann Comhairle that it is not my intention to delay proceedings. Apropos the ever increasing activity of criminal gangs, when is the bail Bill likely to be before the House? Have its heads been discussed and approved by the Cabinet?
Regarding the much publicised need for a court of civil appeal, when is the courts (consolidation and reform) Bill likely to be before the House? It is to provide for the implementation of the recommendations of the Law Reform Commission, LRC. Have its heads been discussed by the Cabinet? What of alternatives?
Dara Calleary (Mayo, Fianna Fail)
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Did the Deputy check on the noise nuisance Bill as well?
Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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I have a few other issues concerning Bills that date back to Deputy Calleary's time in government.
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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The draft heads of the bail Bill are at an advanced stage, but it is not possible to give a date for its publication. The draft Bill contained in the LRC's report will form the basis of the courts (consolidation and reform) Bill. Publication is expected this year.
Michael Healy-Rae (Kerry South, Independent)
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The Minister for Justice and Equality has stated that he will not start recruiting gardaí despite the fact that we only have 13,000.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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To what Bill is the Deputy referring?
Michael Healy-Rae (Kerry South, Independent)
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I will tell the Ceann Comhairle.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Please do, and quickly. Other Deputies wish to speak. We will not have speeches now.
Michael Healy-Rae (Kerry South, Independent)
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The Taoiseach and two Ministers promised that legislation would be introduced if Croke Park II was not agreed.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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No, Deputy.
Mattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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They did.
Michael Healy-Rae (Kerry South, Independent)
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I am tying my question into that issue.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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We have discussed it.
Michael Healy-Rae (Kerry South, Independent)
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That is one matter. The second relates to a national crisis that was raised at this morning's meeting of the agriculture committee. The Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine should attend the Dáil-----
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Deputy, please.
Michael Healy-Rae (Kerry South, Independent)
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-----or appear before the committee to deal with the fodder crisis.
Mattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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I also wish to raise an important issue. I compliment the Ceann Comhairle on his remarks on Private Members' Bills. I have resubmitted one. The Minister for Justice and Equality promised that he would introduce legislation to address thefts of scrap and precious metals. It is happening wholesale, but nothing has been done.
Under the forestry Bill, will the Government please desist from the proposed sale of our precious-----
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Please, other Deputies wish to contribute.
Mattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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Yes, but this is on promised legislation.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Submit a parliamentary question on the matter. This is not for the Order of Business.
Mattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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I have, but I received no answer.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Is there a precious metals Bill?
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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I understand that the Minister for Justice and Equality is awaiting a report from the Oireachtas justice committee, which has been considering the matter. The forestry Bill was agreed by the Government on Tuesday.
Mattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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Will the Government sell the rights?
Michael Healy-Rae (Kerry South, Independent)
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A rhino's horn was stolen from the National Museum.
Pearse Doherty (Donegal South West, Sinn Fein)
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Is there an intention to amend the NAMA Act, given the publication of the minimum income guidelines later today? They will cause hardship for many, particularly if, as reported-----
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Is there promised legislation on this subject?
Pearse Doherty (Donegal South West, Sinn Fein)
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-----families are only to survive on €20 per day.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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I am sorry, but there is no promised legislation on this subject.
Pearse Doherty (Donegal South West, Sinn Fein)
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Will the guidelines be applied to NAMA developers who have had millions of euro of debt written off or-----
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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The Deputy must submit a question or use some other means-----
Pearse Doherty (Donegal South West, Sinn Fein)
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-----will they just be applied to those in mortgage distress, ordinary people who did not cause the crisis?
Joanna Tuffy (Dublin Mid West, Labour)
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I support the Ceann Comhairle and Deputy Broughan's comments on Private Members' Bills. The Government's reforms are welcome and it was the Tánaiste's stated intention to rebalance our Parliament in favour of the ordinary Member, but there is a problem with reforms, in that we sometimes revert back to type. Topical Issue debates are an improvement on Adjournment matters, but we are reverting to Ministers of State who are not even from the relevant Departments being sent in to answer questions.
Pádraig Mac Lochlainn (Donegal North East, Sinn Fein)
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Hear, hear.
Joanna Tuffy (Dublin Mid West, Labour)
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This is not satisfactory. Debates should be taken by Ministers or, at the very least, Ministers of State from the Departments concerned.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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I have noted the Deputy's comments.
Dessie Ellis (Dublin North West, Sinn Fein)
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I am sure the Tánaiste is aware that many problems are developing with the rental accommodation scheme, RAS, and rent supplement. Many landlords are looking for their premises back. Their tenants are at risk. Is there any way to introduce the important housing Bill instead of putting it off until the end of the year, as we are repeatedly told? This is a serious situation. This week, at least seven people in this position have approached me.
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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The Government is introducing three housing Bills. The housing (amendment) Bill will amend section 1 of the Housing (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act. Its heads have been approved by the Government and its publication is intended for this session. The housing (miscellaneous provisions) Bill is meant to strengthen the regulatory framework for social housing, including statutorily underpinning the new scheme of housing assistance payments. Its heads are expected shortly and its publication is expected for this year. A second housing (miscellaneous provisions) Bill will be published next year.
Dessie Ellis (Dublin North West, Sinn Fein)
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Can the second Bill not be moved forward?
Joe Higgins (Dublin West, Socialist Party)
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Briefly, I wish to support the Ceann Comhairle's point.
Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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I thank the Deputy.
Joe Higgins (Dublin West, Socialist Party)
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The Whips should discuss it. It is wrong that the system crushes people who do not have the protection of parties, etc. I will raise the matter with the Whips.
Paul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
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The Deputy does not attend on Fridays to see it working.