Dáil debates

Tuesday, 16 April 2013

5:15 pm

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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It is proposed to take No. 23, Defence Forces (Second World War Amnesty and Immunity) Bill 2012 [Seanad] - Second Stage (resumed), and No. 1, Industrial Development (Science Foundation Ireland) (Amendment) Bill 2012 [Seanad] - Second Stage. It is proposed, notwithstanding anything in Standing Orders, that Private Members’ business, which shall be No. 44, Statute of Limitations (Amendment) Bill 2013 – Second Stage, shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion at 9 p.m. on Wednesday, 17 April 2013.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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There is one proposal to be put to the House. Is the proposal for dealing with Private Members' business agreed to? Agreed.

Photo of Michael MoynihanMichael Moynihan (Cork North West, Fianna Fail)
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In light of the fact that SIPTU has voted against Croke Park II, will the Taoiseach outline the legislative timeframe that will be required to implement the Government's public pay proposals?

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The unions have made their decision. I am disappointed that it was not approved, but the Government must now consider the outcome and nature of the ballot and how we intend to deal with the requirement to achieve €300 million in savings this year. We will keep the House updated as the Government makes its decisions on that matter.

Photo of Aengus Ó SnodaighAengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
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Given that Croke Park II is likely to be rejected by its potential victims, would the Taoiseach consider having a debate on this issue tomorrow after the final outcome has emerged from the ICTU meeting?

I wish to raise two other matters. I welcome the weekend's finding by the Convention on the Constitution that the Constitution should be changed to provide for marriage equality. Can the Taoiseach confirm that work is starting on drafting the wording which would give effect to that constitutional change? I have an additional question on the convention.

Will the Taoiseach consider altering the remit of the convention to take account of the need for constitutional change to give effect to an amendment of upward only rent reviews, which Fine Gael------

5:25 pm

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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I am sorry, we do not want a debate.

Photo of Aengus Ó SnodaighAengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
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This is not a debate. A commitment was given by the Government parties prior to the election.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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We do not deal with commitments on the Order of Business.

Photo of Aengus Ó SnodaighAengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
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We do if they come under the programme for Government.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Exactly.

Photo of Aengus Ó SnodaighAengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
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It was promised that this issue would be addressed and it has not been to date.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I do not propose to hold an emergency debate tomorrow. The Government will obviously have to reflect on the outcome of the ballot once it is announced, to consider the nature of that result and to deal with it because we have to find €300 million in savings this year and, clearly, as I have said on many occasions, one can only deal with front-line services being reduced to a limited extent.

I cannot confirm to the Deputy that work is under way in respect of the wording for the outcome of the constitutional convention but I can confirm that the convention is working exceptionally well and that the citizens who were selected at random by an appropriate method have engaged constructively with the political representatives to make the convection work. The level of debate on the issues that have been considered by the convention has been very high. The Deputy will be aware that the convention will send its report to the Government. The Government will consider that report and indicate what its responses to the issues that the convention was mandated to consider should be. We will do that in due course and if the Government decides to accept any of the recommendations made by the convention, it will say so and if the answer is in the affirmative, there will be an indication of a timeline as to when they might be considered by referendum.

I do not propose to prepare a referendum in respect of upward only rent reviews.

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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I too want to add my weight to the call for a debate on the most serous issue of the Croke Park II agreement ballot today because it is important. Where will the Government find the €1 billion otherwise if we do not have a proper debate?

It is no wonder the agreement was rejected. Is the Taoiseach aware that under the health (private patient charges) Bill anybody in receipt of respite care - goodness knows the periods between the provision of such care is lengthy - will be charged €175 per week? It is another stealth tax on people who badly need respite care and this puts pressure on their families because they will not be able to pay it. The clients will have to be kept at home or they could end up in hospital.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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To what legislation is the Deputy referring?

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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The health (private patient charges) Bill. It is another charge that has been slipped in similar to the carbon tax.

I refer to the Central Bank consolidation Bill. We still have no idea about the guidelines that will be used for personal insolvency but the Central Bank seems to be doing everything it wants to secure the banks while to hell with the people, whether it is private business owners or ordinary householders in mortgage arrears and negative equity. The officials are not dealing with businesses; they are only interested in sorting out the books of their own banks. When will the Government take them on?

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The health Bill is listed on the A list for this session. The consolidation Bill in respect of the banks will not be implemented until the supervision and enforcement Bills are dealt and they are on Committee Stage.

Photo of Willie O'DeaWillie O'Dea (Limerick City, Fianna Fail)
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I wish to raise two issues. There is no Bill to provide for a referendum to abolish the Seanad in the legislative programme for the spring session, although there is a reference to it in section C. This section deals with Bills for which the heads have not yet been approved by the Government. The heads of the legislation to provide for a referendum to abolish the Seanad, therefore, have not been agreed by the Government.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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The Deputy is answering his own question.

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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He will get no answer from the Government.

Photo of Willie O'DeaWillie O'Dea (Limerick City, Fianna Fail)
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Does the Taoiseach intend to proceed with the proposal to abolish the Seanad? When will we see the legislation?

With regard to the issue raised by Deputy Moynihan regarding the rejection of the Croke Park II deal, the Taoiseach will be aware that the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform promised unequivocally, in unmistakable terms, that there would be legislation in the event of the deal being defeated.

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)
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He threatened it.

Photo of Willie O'DeaWillie O'Dea (Limerick City, Fianna Fail)
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Is it the Government's intention to proceed with that legislation? If so, how soon?

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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It is necessary that the Government proceeds to make decisions to find €300 million in savings this year. This is fundamental to the figures we set out for the budget this year. When the details of the final ballot are announced, the Government will reflect on what it has to do to achieve the savings.

Photo of Willie O'DeaWillie O'Dea (Limerick City, Fianna Fail)
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The Minister promised legislation.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The Seanad legislation is not on the list because the tradition in the House has been where a referendum is committed to, the Bill does not appear on the A, B or C list. The Bill to abolish the Seanad will be published this session.

Photo of Timmy DooleyTimmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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Last December, the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform, during the debate on the Houses of the Oireachtas Commission legislation, promised amending legislation to deal with the modernisation of the management structures of the Houses of the Oireachtas. The indication was the legislation would be brought forward in the first half of this year. I am surprised, having looked over the summer session schedule, that no such proposal is included to deal with this promise.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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It is hard to surprise the Deputy.

Photo of Timmy DooleyTimmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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The Taoiseach has.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The heads of that Bill have not come to Government and that is why it is not on the list for this session.

Photo of Timmy DooleyTimmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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Another broken promise.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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No, it will be on its way.

Photo of Joe HigginsJoe Higgins (Dublin West, Socialist Party)
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The Taoiseach has not provided clarity. The Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform promised legislation implementing a 7% across the board cut in public sector workers' wages if the Croke Park II agreement was rejected. The Croke Park II proposals have gone down in flames because low and middle income workers in the public sector cannot take any more cuts, nor can they in the private sector. Is the Taoiseach resiling from the threat of further savage cuts?

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I am absolutely committed to what the Government has decided here. We have to achieve €300 million in savings this year. If the Croke Park II proposals were accepted by the unions, one would operate on the basis of a negotiated deal and a negotiated programme. While I am disappointed by the result, the fact remains that the Government has to achieve €300 million in savings this year and it will now have to reflect on the outcome of the ballot and how to proceed to achieve that figure because that is the bottom line.

Photo of Timmy DooleyTimmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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The Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform reflected on this a few weeks ago when he issued the threat.

Photo of Willie O'DeaWillie O'Dea (Limerick City, Fianna Fail)
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What about his announcement?

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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In the House a month or six weeks ago, the Taoiseach promised three Bills consequent on the Croke Park II agreement, irrespective of whether it was passed, and this point has been missed in the debate so far. One Bill relates to pensions and the others to pay in different sectors of the public service. The Taoiseach and the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform committed to that legislation. The Minister in a detailed public statement pointed out the three areas in which legislation would be required. I have read sections A, B and C of the legislative programme for the summer session and I do not see provision for those Bills. Does that mean they are not even at heads of Bill stage yet? Will they be proceeded with, as outlined by the Minister in the aftermath of the publication of the Croke Park II agreement? He indicated this would happen either way. That is in addition to the threat made subsequently to introduce a 7% across the board pay cut. The Minister said this would happen if the agreement was defeated. We need clarity both on the legislative timeline and the Bills that have been signed up to.

With regard to the media mergers Bill, the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources has written to the Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation expressing his deep concern at the time it is taking to produce the legislation, which would have the effect of making matters pertaining to media mergers his responsibility.

There has been considerable comment recently about important issues such as media diversity, media ownership and public debate, all of which go to the heart of democracy. Many people are concerned about the plurality and diversity of the media. The letters written by the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources, Deputy Pat Rabbitte, to the Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation, Deputy Richard Bruton, were published at the weekend. The Government's legislative programme does not indicate any sense of urgency. Either it will be a very long summer, metaphorically speaking, or a great deal of substantive legislation will not appear in 2013. Perhaps the legislative programme does not mean anything given the Taoiseach's previous reply that major legislation which does not appear on the legislative programme will appear when it appears.

5:35 pm

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform, Deputy Brendan Howlin, set out on behalf of the Government the requirement to achieve €300 million in savings this year. He has issued detailed statements on the matter and the Government will now consider the implications of the ballot and make decisions in respect of achieving the savings. The legislation on media mergers to which Deputy Martin refers is the Consumer and Competition Bill. A great deal of work has been done on the Bill, which will be published this session. In the case of 17 of the 25 or 26 Bills on the A list a great deal of work was carried over in the previous session and the Bills will all come through over the course of the next 15 weeks.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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The legislation does not feature on the list.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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It is on the A list.

Photo of Patrick NultyPatrick Nulty (Dublin West, Labour)
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With respect, the Taoiseach did not answer the questions asked by previous speakers. Is it the Government's intention, in light of the rejection of the Croke Park II agreement by rank and file workers, to legislate to cut workers' pay and conditions or will it return to the negotiating table and try to reach an agreement?

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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The House has been given an answer to the question. We will not have a debate on an issue that has been dealt with.

Photo of Timmy DooleyTimmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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SIPTU dealt with it.

Photo of Patrick NultyPatrick Nulty (Dublin West, Labour)
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Will the Government legislate for pay cuts?

Photo of John O'MahonyJohn O'Mahony (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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When will the long-awaited Construction Contracts Bill come before committee? Many subcontractors have gone out of business despite the main contractors being paid.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The amendments came before the Cabinet in March and it is expected that the Bill will go before committee this session. As a number of the amendments were technical in nature, they were delayed for some time. However, they have been approved by the Cabinet and the amended business should go before the Cabinet this session.

Photo of Patrick O'DonovanPatrick O'Donovan (Limerick, Fine Gael)
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On the same issue, the Executive in Northern Ireland recently introduced an initiative similar to the Construction Contracts Bill. Is the Government prepared to take on board some of the amendments that could emerge from this initiative when the Construction Contracts Bill comes before the House?

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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That is a separate issue.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Amendments can be dealt with when the Bill comes before the House.

Photo of Séamus HealySéamus Healy (Tipperary South, Workers and Unemployed Action Group)
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The Irish National Teachers' Organisation has rejected the Croke Park II proposals, with 69% voting against the agreement. In view of the outrageous attempt by a Labour Party Minister to cut pay and pensions and diminish working conditions-----

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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We have already been through this.

Photo of Séamus HealySéamus Healy (Tipperary South, Workers and Unemployed Action Group)
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No, we have not.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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The Taoiseach replied to the other Deputies who raised the issue.

Photo of Séamus HealySéamus Healy (Tipperary South, Workers and Unemployed Action Group)
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In view of the Minister's outrageous attempt to cut pay and diminish the working conditions of public sector employees, when does the Taoiseach expect the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform, Deputy Howlin, to hand in his recognition, as he should do?

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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The Deputy should table a parliamentary question.

Photo of Michael Healy-RaeMichael Healy-Rae (Kerry South, Independent)
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Farmers are running out of fodder for their animals, which has created an unprecedented crisis in the farming community.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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Fodder shortages will be dealt with in two or three minutes in the Topical Issue Debate.

Photo of Michael Healy-RaeMichael Healy-Rae (Kerry South, Independent)
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I raised this matter with the Taoiseach before the Easter recess and the problem is worsening. Farmers are attending auctions to try to buy fodder.

Photo of Seán BarrettSeán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
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The issue is not related to legislation.

Photo of Séamus KirkSéamus Kirk (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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Electoral reform is the next item for discussion at the Constitutional Convention. Is it intended that the convention will have an opportunity to consider the proposed abolition of the Seanad before a final or firm decision is taken on the matter? Will the convention have an opportunity, following consideration of the issue, to report to the Taoiseach or House?

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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No. As part of the programme for Government, the abolition of the Seanad is a separate matter that was accepted by the Government before the Constitutional Convention was established. The convention has been given a different range of topics on which to deliberate. The Bill to give effect to the abolition of the Seanad will be published this session, will be subject to normal procedures and will be put to the people in the autumn.