Robert Troy (Longford-Westmeath, Fianna Fail)
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To ask the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform the date on which the Croke Park agreement expires; if he has indicated to the public sector unions if and when talks on a successor agreement will commence; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [43415/12]

Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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The public service or Croke Park agreement negotiated by the previous Government is stated to be for the period from 2010 to 2014. The agreement requires staff co-operation with productivity, cost extraction and reform measures in the public service. The Government has reaffirmed the key commitments under the public service agreement on pay rates and job security for serving public servants. These commitments are contingent on delivery of the necessary flexibilities by public servants. The agreement provides for an annual review process, while the implementation body is charged with making regular reports on the implementation of the transformation agenda across the public service.

No decision has been made by the Government regarding a successor agreement to the Croke Park agreement. The current agreement continues to facilitate, against a background of industrial peace and the maintenance of vital public services at a time of extreme demand for these services, a structured and sustainable reduction in the cost of the Exchequer pay bill through falling numbers and other measures. The implementation body has concluded that the agreement is delivering substantial savings and change, but it will continue to be measured against its ability to accelerate the pace of change across the public service and its potential for extracting further pay bill and non-pay savings. I strongly agree with that sentiment. The priority must be for all stakeholders to concentrate on maximising the contribution of the Croke Park agreement and a successor to the agreement, if any, to the transformation of the public service to enable it to make a continuing and sustainable contribution to our economic recovery.

Seán Fleming (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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I asked a broad question on the Croke Park agreement which, as the Minister noted, was introduced by the previous Government. It has helped to achieve, in industrial peace, the reduction of staff numbers from approximately 320,000 to 292,000 and is intended to bring about savings of some €3.5 billion. It is important to put that on the record because people complain now and ask whether we should cut salaries instead of cutting numbers. Before we started on the formal process of the Croke Park deal there had been pay cuts in the public service as well as new pension levies. On average, public servants are taking pay cuts of 20%, depending on grade. That has been forgotten by current commentators who say there should be pay cuts instead of job cuts. We did the pay cuts, we have made the job cuts but the job is not yet finished, as we all know. Unfortunate as it may be, by and large we are seeing increased efficiencies. I will not go into the exceptions. By and large, public services continue to be provided with fewer staff even though this obviously places more stress on those staff.

Does the Minister have a date in mind in 2014? People keep asking about that. I assume it will be the end of March.

Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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There is no date in the agreement.

Seán Fleming (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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The first annual report covered the period from 1 April to 31 March so one can conclude the same again if it is a four year agreement. Can it extend to the end of 2014? The Minister might clarify that point because people continue to ask that question. Would he be minded to bring forward that date, as some Members on the Government side have suggested, in order to get an earlier deal on which the current Government might stamp its position on the Croke Park agreement? The Minister of State beside the Minister, Deputy Brian Hayes, has referred to this on numerous occasions.

Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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The Deputy asked a profound and important question. The Croke Park agreement, which I acknowledge was negotiated by the preceding Government, has made a very substantial contribution to the transformation agenda in the public service, allowing us to downsize and reduce the pay bill in the terms I talked about and in industrial peace, which is extremely important and valuable in itself. If we did not have that I believe we would have a different dialogue. The perception of Ireland would be quite different.

However, I am also conscious that we have a way to go yet. One thing that has concerned me for a number of months is that despite the extraordinary contribution of the public service to the recovery we still have very significant hills to climb between now and 2015 to arrive at a deficit of 2.9%. It is clear to me there will be a requirement for dialogue if that particular steep hill is to be climbed. I have been thinking about that and dialoguing within my Department on the issue over a considerable period of months.

The specific running time of the current agreement is understood to be the end of next year although that is not specified in the actual agreement. Whether we engage with the public service unions before that time in regard to a successor agreement is obviously important because the horizon I want to reach is 2015, with a reformed public service and a pay bill that is sustainable well beyond 2015.