James Bannon (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Ceann Comhairle for affording me time to raise this important topical issue, namely, the need for the Minister for Justice and Equality to provide a detailed breakdown of the projected savings to his Department arising from the announcement of the closure of Columb Barracks, Mullingar, County Westmeath, which will be difficult to rationalise in light of the loss to the local economy, the disruption to Army personnel and their families and the elimination of an integral part of the culture and heritage of the town of Mullingar.

To make any sense of the closure of Columb Barracks, Mullingar it is necessary to be fully informed of the thinking behind it. I am aware that two issues have driven this decision - financial savings and the need to redeploy Army personnel. I ask the Minister, Deputy Shatter, if he can provide a detailed breakdown of the projected savings to be realised. It is necessary to equate those with the potential economic losses to the town of Mullingar and the devastation that will be caused to Army personnel and their wives, families and friends.

It is important to remember that the barracks has been an integral part of the community of Mullingar since 1814. The heritage and cultural aspects of such closures tend to be overlooked in the rush for financial savings but they are a vital part of the equation, and in many ways they are the key. As the barracks in Mullingar is listed as a historical site it cannot be sold on and will be left lying idle and allowed to fall into disrepair if an alternative use is not found.

I am very concerned about the provisions of such an alternative use for Columb Barracks. In this respect, the Minister has assured me that he is committed to expediting such a provision and I have every confidence in his word as he has already done his best to make provision in regard to Connolly Barracks, Longford. In fact, he more than met his commitment in terms of seeking an urgent reappraisal of the value of that site which would be very suitable as an educational facility or campus.

In terms of Columb Barracks, I am not convinced that the case of a financial saving has been proven. Not only is the demand for building land at an all-time low, but the site cannot be sold and therefore I presume the cost effectiveness of the decision relates solely to overheads such as salaries, maintenance etc.

While closing the barracks as an operational defence unit may be projected to make some savings the question is whether that will be enough overall to justify tearing the heart out of a rural town and impacting on the economic profile both in the short and long term. It has been argued that the personnel from the barracks will more than likely remain in the area but that can neither be guaranteed nor is it a complete justification.

That brings me to another point that is worrying me about the closure not only of Columb Barracks but of the 14 barracks that have closed throughout the country since 1998. The fact that the latest closures should be enforced before the publication of the Green Paper on the Defence Forces is of concern to me and to the people of Mullingar.

The Minister has assured this House that he believes the current strength of the Defence Forces should be maintained. That is reassuring given that some people are assuming the closure of these barracks will lead to a reduction in personnel. It is my belief that there could be a small increase in numbers and I would be grateful for clarification on that from the Minister.

Alan Shatter (Dublin South, Fine Gael)
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I thank Deputy Bannon who I know is very concerned about this particular issue. As the House is aware, on Tuesday, 15 November the Government approved a proposal from me to proceed with a further phase of consolidation of Defence Forces personnel into fewer locations with the closure of four barracks, Clonmel, Mullingar, Cavan and Castlebar. It is proposed to have the personnel transferred and the barracks closed no later than Friday, 30 March next.

The consolidation of the Defence Forces formations into a smaller number of locations is a key objective in the ongoing defence modernisation programme in order to maximise the effectiveness of the Defence Forces and has been recommended in many reports over the past number of years.

In these difficult times the closures will enhance the flexibility available to the Defence Forces in the use of their resources, both human and financial. I am especially concerned to protect the strength of the Defence Forces being also mindful of the difficult economic situation facing the country. The numbers are currently just below 9,500 and I am anxious to ensure that Defence Forces numbers are maintained at approximately 9,500 both this year and in future years.

While the major objectives of the closures is to release as many personnel as possible for operational duties, annual savings in respect of utilities, security duty allowances and maintenance will also arise. This will amount to approximately €1.3 million per annum in respect of the four closures.

In addition to the cost of utilities each barracks requires a security detail and additional further personnel are tied up on purely administrative duties connected to the management of the particular barracks. Because maintaining barrack security requires around the clock cover, a much larger pool of personnel is required. Therefore, several hundred additional man years will become available for operational duties. At a minimum, the value of this efficiency gain will comfortably exceed €5 million per year.

In recent weeks, as the Deputy is aware, I have met with individual Members of the Oireachtas and a delegation from Mullingar as well as delegations from Clonmel and Cavan. I have reflected carefully and at length on the sincere and genuine concerns raised by the delegation who put forward very strongly held views as to why the barracks in Mullingar and the other two barracks should be retained. I wish to acknowledge the sincerity and courtesy with which these views were conveyed.

It is appreciated and understood that the consolidation proposals may result in a level of hardship on some personnel and both staff of the Department and the military authorities will take into account the personal circumstances of those stationed at the locations concerned including Mullingar. Generally speaking, people will be expected to transfer with their unit to the new location. However, requests for transfers to units in other locations will be examined on a case-by-case basis having regard to the availability of vacancies.

The military authorities have agreed to provide a transport service between Mullingar and Athlone if required. This will be for an initial period to allow the transfer to be effected. Briefings will be held in all barracks including Mullingar. The purpose of these briefings is to give precise details of the change of station allowance scheme and to address any concerns that may arise. Essentially, this scheme provides for the payment of certain allowances to personnel who are permanently transferred to a new station and who meet certain conditions.

Arising from the Government decision I have asked my Department to enter into discussions with other Departments, local authorities and State agencies regarding the possible purchase of the properties to benefit the local community as a whole but with particular emphasis on job creation measures.

As I stated earlier, I am conscious of the hardship this decision may impose on some personnel and their families and I can assure the House that it was not a decision that was taken lightly. However, because of the appalling economic legacy inherited by this Government from its predecessor difficult decisions have to be taken affecting all areas of society. The current proposals are in the best interests of the Defence Forces and that must be my priority. Maintaining the numbers in the Defence Forces to ensure they can maximise their capabilities to the benefit of the community in both domestic and international duties is central.

There is no question of the barracks being left idle and let fall into disrepair. As Deputy Bannon knows, since becoming Minister I have been actively engaged in seeking a means of dealing with Connolly Barracks, Longford, which has been revalued. As a consequence of an engagement between my Department and the local council I am optimistic that in the not too distant future arrangements will be made to the benefit of all with regard to that barracks.

The legacy of barracks in this country does not derive from any strategic decision ever made by our Defence Forces. They derive from the view of the British authorities when we were a colony as to where barracks should be located to keep down the rebellious Irish. We will have 14 barracks in the country when the four barracks in question are closed. I hope these decisions will be to the benefit of the Defence Forces and to the community generally.

James Bannon (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Minister for his reply. I emphasise, however, that I am not convinced that the case for savings has been proved. I have been informed today by a number of Army wives of a disturbing development in the matter concerning Columb Barracks. It has been brought to my attention that troops from Mullingar are being moved into the old FCA quarters in Athlone, which is a condemned building. It has been further claimed that troops will have to collect their weapons in Athlone and bring them under escort to rented premises in Mullingar for training purposes. This journey will be undertaken twice per day. Surely this is ludicrous in terms of cost and efficiency. Is the information provided to me true? There is great anger and frustration among people in Mullingar and the wider community about the closure of Mullingar barracks which has been an integral part of the community since 1814. I am as disappointed as everyone else about what has taken place.

Alan Shatter (Dublin South, Fine Gael)
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As Deputy Bannon knows, no one will lose his or her job as a consequence of these changes. The jobs will be retained and I hope and believe the families concerned will continue to reside in Mullingar. The Mullingar economy should continue to benefit from the income received by the troops in Mullingar from the work they do in the Defence Forces. I know the Deputy and his constituency colleague, Deputy McFadden, have been very concerned about these developments. I assure them I will do what I can to work with colleagues in the House and the local community, through the Department of Defence, to ensure matters are dealt with in a manner that is ultimately to the benefit of the community and a value is realised from the premises to the benefit of the Defence Forces, as has happened in the past, so that moneys can be reinvested in the Defence Forces to the benefit of all of those who currently serve in Mullingar.

I am unaware of the issues the Deputy raised and will ensure I obtain information to respond to him on them. I will write to the Deputy in that regard. I look forward to working with him and his colleague, Deputy McFadden, in seeking to identify appropriate uses for the barracks and, I hope, appropriate purchasers for the site so that it becomes a dynamic centre of activity to the benefit of the local community.