Dáil debates

Wednesday, 19 October 2011

3:00 pm

Photo of Peadar TóibínPeadar Tóibín (Meath West, Sinn Fein)
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The loss of jobs at Aviva Insurance has been a slow motion catastrophe. Some 950 of the company's staff have lost their jobs, while approximately 300 further staff will have their jobs outsourced. Members of staff have been left in limbo for several weeks. The company is one of the largest and most profitable insurers in the State. The job cuts will result in €36 million being taken out of the economy and have the potential to increase the social welfare bill by €20 million. The Government has acted like Pontius Pilate. For several weeks, I have asked repeatedly that it intervene in this scenario which has been ongoing for weeks. Even at this late stage, I ask that it do everything in its power to save as many jobs as possible. Will it make officials of the Department of Finance available to the staff and unions at the company to ensure the costs and business plan of Aviva can be thoroughly analysed and savings made to make the jobs in question viable?

Photo of Kevin HumphreysKevin Humphreys (Dublin South East, Labour)
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Having experienced redundancy in the recession of the 1980s, I sympathise and understand what the workers at Aviva Insurance and their families are going through. I ask the Minister of State to ensure all possible resources are marshalled to help the workers in question. Will he outline what resources will be made available? I also ask him to meet management of Aviva Insurance to ensure there is certainty regarding the workers and their entitlements and to argue for the retention of as many jobs as possible. Will he also clarify whether it is possible to submit an application for funding under the European Globalisation Adjustment Fund? I understand an application may not be made until March. If that is the case, will he ensure we will be prepared when the time comes? I also call on him to appoint one official to act as the sole co-ordinator across all Departments and serve as a single point of direct contact for workers. Having fallen down in this regard on previous occasions, we must ensure retraining and educational opportunities are available and workers are made aware of their entitlements.

Photo of Willie O'DeaWillie O'Dea (Limerick City, Fianna Fail)
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As has been noted, the catastrophe that occurred in Aviva Insurance today had been well flagged, including, for example, in September when the company announced a review. The tone and content of that statement left us in no doubt as to what was on the way. What has the Government been doing in the meantime? What precise action has taken place to avert, or at least mitigate, this catastrophe? What discussions have taken place at chief executive officer level within other sectors of the insurance industry to adopt a co-ordinated approach? It seems this very important section of the services sector is vulnerable and we do not want another job shock between now and Christmas.

I deplore the lack of communication with the workers, even as late as today. Can the Government ascertain whether the company is in compliance with the provisions of the Employees (Provision of Information and Consultation) Act? It is certainly in breach of the spirit of that legislation and I am anxious to know if it is also in breach of the letter.

Will the Minister clarify the situation in regard to the company's announcement on outsourcing? If this means what we think it means, will the State agencies try to have an arrangement with the company whereby these outsourcing provisions will be confined to ex-employees of Aviva who already have the requisite expertise? My final point was that made by Deputy Humphreys, namely, there should be a single contact point across the board. That is something we experienced in Limerick as a result of the Dell fall-out.

There is one final important issue with regard to the European Globalisation Adjustment Fund. We applied to that after the Dell closure but the effect of the fund's investment was much less than it could have been. A few minor adjustments would have made all the difference. In committee today I asked the Minister of State's colleague, the Minister of State, Deputy Sherlock, whether the Government was seeking change in the criteria by which the European Globalisation Adjustment Fund might be applied. I wish to know the up-to-date position on that.

Photo of John PerryJohn Perry (Sligo-North Leitrim, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Deputies for raising this matter. First and foremost, my thoughts are with the hundreds of workers in Aviva and their families who heard this news today.

Subject to the conclusion of negotiations between the company and the workers over the coming six months, the full support of the Government and its relevant agencies will be at the disposal of the workers affected by the announcement today. The Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation, Deputy Bruton, the Department and the relevant agencies have engaged almost daily with the company in an effort to minimise the impact of this process on jobs in Ireland. The Minister has met and been in regular contact with the Irish management of Aviva. He also met the company's European chief executive officer, Mr. Igal Mayer, and the company's global chief executive officer, Mr. Andrew Moss, and has remained in regular contact with them throughout this process.

There is a lengthy period of negotiation of six months ahead which is in contrast to what applied in the case of other recent job losses. I note the company's ambition to achieve many of its targeted reductions through voluntary redundancies. Any job reductions will begin after March 2012 and will take place over a two-year period which at least provides workers some time to plan ahead. I note also that the company has signalled the potential to grow up to 200 new jobs over the same two-year period. IDA Ireland is working and will continue to work with the company to try to deliver on that potential.

These job losses in Aviva reflect another legacy of the collapse of our economy over recent years. Aviva business has dropped by between 20% and 30% as people are buying fewer insurance products in general. It is also a reflection of the global economy given that Aviva worldwide has already reduced staff numbers significantly from 56,000 to 36,000. We are not immune from that situation but it important to note that Ireland has succeeded in building an international financial services industry that is diverse in the activities carried out and which enjoys a world-leading reputation in several sectors. Although the past three years have represented a severe stress test for all financial centres, firms at the International Financial Services Centre in Dublin have shown resilience and flexibility. Employing some 33,000 people directly and many more indirectly, the IFSC remains critical as both an employer and a centre of economic activity. As the House is aware, this Government has set job creation and retention as one of its key priorities in the programme for Government. It is what drives the work of my Department and that of other key Departments as we seek to provide a better future for our young people and our society in general.

The terrible news today from Aviva is part of the economic legacy which this Government inherited and we are committed to addressing it. The Government has shown it is a government of action. We have recapitalised the banks, renegotiated the memorandum of understanding with the EU, the ECB and the IMF and have substantially reduced the interest we will pay on loans from those institutions. When we came into Government we were told these things could not be done but we have shown our determination to turn this country around and are doing so in spite of continuing uncertainty in global financial markets. Notwithstanding the likely growth of the economy this year - for the first time in three years - today's announcement underlines the scale of the challenge ahead for the Government and the economy.

Photo of Peadar TóibínPeadar Tóibín (Meath West, Sinn Fein)
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Thoughts and sympathy are not enough in this situation. I do not believe we should have a defeatist attitude. We must save as many of these jobs as possible. The two issues that affect these types of businesses are the anti-investment policy of the Government, which is killing demand, and costs. The Government should send officials from the Department to look, first, at the top-heavy management structures in these businesses, second, at the fact there are upward-only rents on a trophy building which was bought by the company at the height of the boom in 2007, and, third, what can be done in regard to rates and energy costs which significantly affect the cost baseline of business. Those decisions are down to Government. If it acts on them, it has a chance of saving these jobs. If it does not, all we are hearing is platitudes.

Photo of Kevin HumphreysKevin Humphreys (Dublin South East, Labour)
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I thank the Minister of State. It is heartbreaking to see so many jobs being lost and we must work hard to retain as many of them as possible. I ask the Minister of State to act quickly on that. These are young people with young families who have mortgages and debts and are facing into a frightening scenario. Will the Minister of State consider appointing one person to co-ordinate the response? I ask for retraining to start now to allow people to move smoothly into new areas. I reiterate these are young people who are anxious to be retrained although they would prefer to stay in their own jobs. Preparation must start now. We cannot wait until people are walking out the doors. We must ensure now that the maximum number of people are kept in their jobs and that those who lose their jobs will be in a position to take up new jobs in areas in the economy where there is growth.

Photo of Willie O'DeaWillie O'Dea (Limerick City, Fianna Fail)
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I am glad to hear about the meetings the Minister, Deputy Bruton, attended. To what extent did the Minister and the State agencies engage? The impression I get from the Minister of State's speech, and more particularly from the Taoiseach's replies today, is that the Government and the State agencies appear to be passive recipients of information from Aviva rather than actively engaging with the company to discuss any problems it had and whether those problems could be solved with a view to averting at least some of the job losses.

Is the Government now working on any proposals to alleviate this situation? Has it engaged with the company or is it in the process of so doing to see whether specific measures can be taken to make it as easy as possible for the company to retain as many jobs as possible? I reiterate my question about what is happening in regard to other players in the insurance business. Have they been spoken to with a view to their problems and to averting potential further employment catastrophes in this line later in the year?

4:00 pm

Photo of John PerryJohn Perry (Sligo-North Leitrim, Fine Gael)
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I listened very actively to the Deputies' concerns. Our primary concern is for the workers who will eventually face redundancy. In that context, the timeframe announced by Aviva for its restructuring programme at least provides some assistance to workers. The State development companies will work actively in every way possible to minimise job losses. We must provide assistance to workers, and the State development agencies will support them in planning ahead, which is critical. It must and will be done.

When it becomes clear which workers face redundancy, each will be offered the full support of the agencies to ensure they are properly informed about other opportunities that present during the coming six months, such as options in employment, business education and training. The Government is dealing decisively and immediately with this. As Deputy Humphreys noted, this is about straight talking.

In addition, IDA Ireland will continue its engagement with Aviva to try to secure investment in new and growing business areas. This is an ongoing process.

It is important to note here that Ireland continues to be competitive in attracting investment from major global companies. Recent examples which testify to our attractiveness as a location for investment in the area of financial services include the creation of 100 jobs by Fidelity in Galway and Dublin, 100 jobs by BNY Mellon in Dublin, 50 jobs by Butterfield Fulcrum in Dublin, 60 jobs by Allianz in Dublin, 150 jobs by Arvato Finance in Dublin and 75 jobs by D&B in Dublin. In the area of shared services and customer support, recent announcements include the creation of 150 jobs by Quest in Cork, 350 jobs by PayPal in Dublin, several hundred jobs by Zenimax in Galway, 75 jobs by Avaya in Galway, 50 jobs by NEI in Galway, 100 jobs by NPD in Athlone, 100 jobs by Alere in Galway, 50 jobs by Citrix in Dublin and 200 jobs by EA & Bioware in Galway. I accept that what I have said about the creation of other jobs does not compensate anyone with regard to what happened earlier today.

I will bring to the attention of the Minister, Deputy Bruton, the point relating to the appointment of a single point of contact person to co-ordinate activities. As Deputy O'Dea clearly stated, our priority must be to ensure that the relevant agencies, including IDA Ireland, work with Aviva to ensure that the level of job losses will be minimised. The three Deputies may rest assured that the Department will continue its work in respect of this matter. The Minister, Deputy Bruton, has been actively involved in dealing with it since concerns first emerged several weeks ago. He has had discussions with all the senior personnel from Aviva in the context of ensuring the impact of today's dreadful announcement will be minimised.