Leo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
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Question 10: To ask the Minister for Communications; Energy and Natural Resources if he will reconsider his opposition to the sale of State assets like ESB Powergen, Bord Gais and ESB customer supply in view of the crisis in the public finances and the International Monetary Fund/EU intervention; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [45063/10]

Eamon Ryan (Dublin South, Green Party)
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As the Deputy is aware, I have responsibility for a range of commercial semi-State bodies. These companies play critical roles in the economy by providing essential infrastructure and services to consumers and enterprises. They are also significant employers and most of them contribute substantial dividends to the Exchequer.

The major energy utility companies referred to by the Deputy, ESB and Bord Gáis Energy, BGE, are key contributors to the achievement of the Government's energy policy objectives. These objectives are fully in line with EU energy policy objectives. The State utilities are collectively committed to decarbonising the energy system in support of our smart economy. They ensure security of supply to the economy, business and domestic consumers through investment programmes in the energy networks and power generation, including major renewable energy investments. The supply businesses of ESB and BGE have also contributed to the much more competitive regime now operating in the electricity and gas markets.

The Deputy is aware of the review group on State assets and liabilities, chaired by Professor Colm McCarthy. Along with officials from my Department, I have met the review group, with which I had a wide-ranging and useful discussion. I expect the group will report to Government around the end of the year. In this context, the recently published national recovery plan indicates that the Government will consider the disposal of assets. The work of the review group presents an opportunity to examine existing structures and practices within the State ownership model, and to assess how best these valuable assets can contribute to national investment priorities and help restore growth.

I agree that given the current economic situation and the severe pressures on the public finances, consideration should be given to making the best use of State assets, including their possible disposal or part disposal. The consideration must be a fully balanced one which takes account of wider policy considerations and, in the specific case of our State energy companies, the vital role they are playing to deliver policy objectives such as security of supply, competitiveness and promotion of renewable energy. I am not in favour of any measures that will undermine the significant progress made to date in network and power generation investment and offering meaningful choice to business and domestic consumers. I remain of the view that State ownership of the energy companies was and will remain a key element in achieving these objectives.

Leo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
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I asked the question because of a speech the Minister made some weeks ago. I do not want to go into the question of NewEra, but the Minister largely misrepresented it and then underlined his opposition to the sale of any State assets. He pointed out that a number of the semi-State companies are engaging in investment programmes, which is correct. Of course these are all the network companies that we would retain in State ownership. However, we are now in a different situation and need a stimulus in the economy. The National Pension Reserve Fund has largely been given away to the banks by the Fianna Fáil-Green Party Government, and the best option, in my view, is to sell off the non-essential semi-State companies and a minority share in the monopoly companies to raise, according to estimates by Davy, some €9 billion, which is an enormous amount of money that could be used to fund a stimulus in the economy and avoid many of the very painful measures this Government intends to impose on the people.

The Minister did not answer my question. I asked him whether he was reconsidering his position, to which he indicated he was and he was not, which is typical of the Greens. One does not know whether they are coming, going or staying put. I will put the question clearly: will the forthcoming budget on 7 December include provision for revenues from the sale of State assets? If one looks at the budget, there is about €2 billion in tax cuts, €2 billion in spending cuts, and €700 million under the category entitled "other". Does that include the sale of semi-State assets and in the event, will he vote against the budget?

Eamon Ryan (Dublin South, Green Party)
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I am not completely opposed to the sale of State assets, where appropriate, but the Deputy's question asks about ESB and Bord Gáis Éireann. In regard to-----

Leo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
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And ESB Powergem.

Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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Please allow the Minister to reply.

Eamon Ryan (Dublin South, Green Party)
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ESB and Bord Gáis, and in regard to those companies-----

Leo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
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I did not ask about the ESB, but rather about ESB Powergem.

Eamon Ryan (Dublin South, Green Party)
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-----I disagree with Fine Gael policy and do not believe it makes economic sense.

Leo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
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What about Bord Gáis?

Eamon Ryan (Dublin South, Green Party)
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I believe that separating supply generation from the network businesses would undermine the investment opportunity the State needs. With regard to the benefits we are starting to see from the competitive and effective electricity and gas markets, the policy approach is working. Deliberately breaking up those companies would undermine something that is working and the investment case we need.

I say this in particular, with regard to the Fine Gael separation proposal which seeks to sell the generation and supply businesses-----

Leo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
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Will the Minister answer the question about the budget?

Eamon Ryan (Dublin South, Green Party)
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The budget will be set out next week. Whatever it says in terms of revenue streams will be true but I do not believe-----

Leo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
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Will it include the sale of State assets?

Eamon Ryan (Dublin South, Green Party)
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--------it should include the sale of Bord Gáis Éireann or the ESB because those companies provide a significant dividend stream to the State, which represents important revenue at this time. Those companies are making massive investments in our State, and helping private sector companies use the networks to make other investments. These areas of economic policy are working. What Fine Gael is trying to do would cause enormous dislocation in what is an effective energy policy approach.

Leo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
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It seems the Minister has answered my question to the effect that the budget will provide for an initial public offer of the semi-States bodies. Will he confirm for me that there will be a sale of State assets under his remit in the budget next week? There is some confusion about the memorandum of understanding and perhaps the Minister can explain it. There is some suggestion to the effect that it has been agreed that if any State assets are sold, the money will have to go towards paying off the national debt and that the next Government would not have the right to use it as it sees fit. Perhaps the Minister would clarify that.

Eamon Ryan (Dublin South, Green Party)
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The budget next week will be written by the Minister for Finance but I do not expect any major change in the policy that I have set out as Minister responsible for an energy policy that is working in terms of regards bringing down prices, introducing investment in jobs and having a competitive market where State companies allow other concerns access to the networks while at the same time allowing their energy and supply companies to develop. This policy is working, it makes economic sense and is creating jobs. What Fine Gael is planning would break up all that and damage the country, which I would not allow.

Leo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
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Answer the question.