Dáil debates

Wednesday, 24 November 2010

Ceisteanna - Questions

Constitutional Issues

11:00 am

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Question 1: To ask the Taoiseach if he will report on the implementation of The Sullivan Review of the Office of the Attorney General of June 2006; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [37172/10]

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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What is the position with regard to the legislation required to place the Children First guidelines on a statutory footing? The Taoiseach will be aware that said legislation relates to the use of soft information. Is he in a position to outline the position in this regard? I understand the legislation could have been enacted this year if priority had been accorded to it.

Photo of Brian CowenBrian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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The supplementary information in my possession relates to the Sullivan report, which arose as a result of a review chaired by Mr. Eddie Sullivan, the then Secretary General of the Department of Finance, the purpose of which was to identify any aspects of the organisational structure, systems, procedures or staffing arrangements within the Office of the Attorney General that may require to be amended to ensure that the information and notification deficit which occurred in the office in respect of the handling of the CC case does not recur. It was, therefore, an organisational review and that is the supplementary information available to me in respect of it.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Is the Taoiseach in a position to indicate the current state of play regarding the referendum on children's rights? The purpose of such a referendum would be to give constitutional recognition to the rights of children and set out the constitutional standard that is required to ensure the State, its agencies and the courts will be in a position to provide children with the protection to which they are properly entitled. At this late stage in 2010, is the Taoiseach in a position to provide an indication with regard to the timeframe relating to the holding of the referendum to which I refer?

Photo of Brian CowenBrian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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That is a separate issue. However, as stated on previous occasions, the Minister of State with responsibility for children and youth affairs, Deputy Barry Andrews, is working on the matter in question and will revert to the Cabinet in respect of it in due course. The Cabinet will be then in a position to consider the options and perhaps return to the Members who have shown an interest in this matter in order to outline - based on both the best advice that would be available from the Attorney General at that point and departmental observations - what might be the best way forward.

Photo of Eamon GilmoreEamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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Does the Taoiseach expect the legislation which arose on foot of the A case, to which the Sullivan report related, will be brought forward by the Government prior to the general election? In the past, various referenda were held on the same day as general elections. A general election is to take place some time in the new year. Is it intended that the referendum on children's rights will take place on the same day as the general election?

Photo of Brian CowenBrian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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I could not give that commitment until such time as the important work which is being undertaken at present is completed and considered by the Government and probably the House. I could not, therefore, indicate whether that would be the case at this point.

The Sullivan report related to the CC case which, in turn, related to statutory rape. The report noted that all the relevant parties accepted that the CC case had met the criterion of being an important and sensitive case such as to warrant reference to the Attorney General in accordance with office policy and protocols. In particular, it identified several milestones in the evolution of the case about which the Attorney General ought to have been informed or consulted. In reality, the Attorney General was consulted only about the first of these, namely, the nomination of counsel.

The Sullivan report instances the various relevant procedures and protocols in force, the policies that existed to ensure that staff were aware of the requirement to refer the case to the Attorney General and the existing office co-ordination arrangements which provided further mechanisms to assist in observance requirements. The report found, however, that the reason the Attorney General was not notified or consulted on the remaining milestones was the result of administrative error. In noting that no perfect system could be designed to deal with such administrative errors, the report concluded that the initiatives already under way as a result of an earlier review, the new measures proposed and the recommendations arising from the Sullivan review, would further enhance the operation of the office and reduce the risk of such an event recurring. The report set out 19 measures designed to further minimise the risk of recurrence. These included enhanced risk assessment procedures, various enhancements to IT systems and new management procedures.

The original question specifically relates to the actions taken to date and, as already stated, all the recommendations contained in the Sullivan report have been fully implemented. What I have outlined is all the information I have in respect of the matter.

Photo of Caoimhghín Ó CaoláinCaoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
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In the interests of obtaining clarity in respect of the work on the Attorney General regarding the recommendations from the Joint Committee on the Constitutional Amendment on Children, will the Taoiseach indicate if the Attorney General has concluded his consideration of the proposed wording and of the submissions from each of the potentially affected Departments to which the Minister of State with responsibility for children and youth affairs had referred the wording for assessment? What is the current status of the Attorney General's work in respect of the preparation for the expected referendum on children's rights, which hopefully will take place in 2011?

In the interests of establishing greater understanding of and confidence in the work of the Attorney General, will the Taoiseach indicate if there is a body of work in respect of which confidentiality is not a core requirement and with regard to which the advice of the Attorney General could, in certain circumstances, be shared with Members in this Chamber? If there were a way to share information in the way to which I refer, this would allow for some degree of appreciation regarding the approach being taken and the advice being offered.

Photo of Brian CowenBrian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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As already stated, I do not have in my possession any papers relating to that specific matter, which does not come within the purview of the original question. It was not anticipated that supplementary questions of this nature would arise. However, there are some issues which I brought to the attention of the House in reply to supplementary questions posed on a previous occasion. This matter is being pursued by the Minister of State with responsibility for children and youth affairs, Deputy Barry Andrews, who will revert to the Government in respect of it in due course. The Minister of State is affording this matter priority.

This is a complex area and I respect the fact that the Joint Committee on the Constitutional Amendment on Children did a substantial amount of work in respect of it. The committee brought forward a lengthy and detailed suggested wording and, as the Deputy will be aware, in terms of constitutional matters all words count and everything must be considered.

I assure the House that if this was not as complex as it is, I am sure we could have made headway a little more quickly. Everyone who was on the committee spent considerable time and effort putting his or her thoughts together on it. However, the Government must consider all of its implications. When work is completed in that area and considered by Government, I would envisage that we would have to come back to the House to discuss it further.

Photo of Caoimhghín Ó CaoláinCaoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
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On the role of the Attorney General, is there any situation that the Taoiseach could envisage where the Attorney General's advices to Government could be shared across the House? I am not seeking to be vexatious with this. It is only just to have an understanding of the approach and advices given. Are there situations that the Taoiseach could envisage where the confidentiality issue is not absolutely paramount?

Photo of Brian CowenBrian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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I understand the imperative here for the independence of the Attorney General as legal adviser to the Government to be unimpaired and unconstrained. At the end of the day, it is a matter for Government to decide on what is the best outcome and then to come to the House armed with whatever arguments it requires to put its proposal and to explain its position.

It is important that the Attorney General, as a constitutional officer, discharges his or her functions on the basis of pointing out if there are constitutional issues that need to be addressed in a proposal before it would be put. Otherwise one is leaving it open with that knowledge to constitutional challenge subsequently and, possibly, it having to be withdrawn or amended subsequently.

It is a matter of some importance, as one would expect where an insertion or deletion of a constitutional provision is being envisaged, that all aspects of the matter are very carefully considered and that at the end of the day the Government comes with what it believes to be a proposal which meets with the constitutional requirements while implementing the change it seeks to bring about subject to the agreement of the people.