Dáil debates

Wednesday, 19 May 2010

1:00 pm

Photo of Mary UptonMary Upton (Dublin South Central, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Question 39: To ask the Minister for Tourism; Culture and Sport if she has received the report from the Irish Sports Council into the serious issues that have developed in the Athletics Association of Ireland; when this report will be published; if she has, or plans to, launch an independent investigation into the issue; her views on the behaviour of the Irish Sports Council on this matter; if her attention has been drawn to other issues surrounding sports bodies which receive funding from the Irish Sports Council; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [20855/10]

Photo of John O'MahonyJohn O'Mahony (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Question 40: To ask the Minister for Tourism; Culture and Sport if she has received a report from the Irish Sports Council regarding the case involving Athletics Ireland; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [20626/10]

Photo of Mary HanafinMary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I propose to take Questions Nos. 39 and 40 together.

I have received the report from the Irish Sports Council, ISC, referred to by the Deputy. It is my intention to place the report on the Department's website, subject to legal advice, when I have fully considered the issues contained in it. I will also be shortly meeting with representatives of the ISC and take the opportunity to discuss the report with them.

As I have previously stated in the House, from a legal perspective, I have no role in the day to day operations of the ISC. Under section 9 of the Irish Sports Council Act 1999, the council has to have regard to Government policy and to comply with any general policy directive which may be given by me as the Minister but it is not under my control. The council is established as a corporate entity with legal personality and is responsible for its own activities.

I have no plans at this stage to launch an independent investigation into this issue. What is important is that we learn how we can avoid this happening in the future. There is a need to learn from this issue about the relationship between the ISC and the national governing bodies of sport, particularly the interaction between them and whether other processes should be used. I am always in favour of using mediation processes in the first instance where they are available, irrespective of the difficulties, and at all times we should avoid recourse to the courts if possible. I consider that there is great potential for the Just Sport Ireland initiative, which was established by the Federation of Irish Sports in 2007 as a specialised independent arbitration and mediation facility. At my first meeting with representatives of the Irish Sports Council, I made it clear to them that I believe that mediation should always be used in the first instance to avoid the type of circumstances we see in this case.

Photo of Mary UptonMary Upton (Dublin South Central, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I am concerned that there will not be an independent report on this. There are three different groups involved in the issue which prompted this debate. In the order of €800,000 of what is effectively public money has gone down the Swanee and this should not have been allowed. I welcome the Minister's suggestion that she is in favour of mediation but surely there must be more. There must be some process whereby a condition of funding is that mediation will take place. That did not happen in this case.

There is another major issue which I raised at the committee. A person who came before the committee went to the High Court and was quoted as saying that he tried to avoid answering questions, doing much prevarication and spoofing. It is absolutely appalling that a witness before an Oireachtas committee would go to the High Court and describe such occurrences at the committee. If this is the case with a sporting organisation which gives evidence before a committee, it is not good enough and we should sort out the issue.

Has the Minister any plans to review the remit of the Irish Sports Council and is there a need for new legislation? The council is defining itself and there are many issues that have not been addressed in the way funding was drip-fed to particular organisations. There seems to be a level of dysfunction in what is happening with various sporting organisations and the Irish Sports Council. As a matter of urgency, these should be addressed.

Photo of Mary HanafinMary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

In the first instance I regret and object to funding given to a sporting organisation being used to fight law cases rather than going into sport.

Photo of Mary UptonMary Upton (Dublin South Central, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

That must be stopped.

Photo of Mary HanafinMary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Irish Sports Council would argue that the direct funding to organisations has not been affected, although it meant there was no money in the contingency fund for events that might arise during the year. Ultimately, money was lost to sporting organisations, which should not have happened. For that reason I said that where disputes arise, as they inevitably will, the mediation process should be used. I suggested it could be used as a condition but it was argued that some organisations might not be ready for that. A number of organisations have already signed up for Just Sport and using mediation; 17 organisations are taking part and five more are about to do so. It is all the better if the process continues with the organisations.

There are a number of other issues. It was a mistake for me to indicate last month that the settlement was confidential; I presumed this was the case but it was not a confidential settlement. There was no admission of liability and the settlement was made in court. The cost included the settlement and legal costs, with the total amounting to over €300,000. That money could have gone to sport.

Several issues must be addressed. The first is the involvement of mediation and arbitration in the settlement of disputes. The second concerns corporate governance training for the organisations. There is also the issue of clarifying the relationship between the Irish Sports Council and the organisations; the council exists to support and develop sport and should help organisations in doing so. It is necessary to have a policy on the recruiting of strategically important senior posts within organisations. All those issues arise immediately from this case and I expect the Irish Sports Council to deal with them.

Photo of Mary UptonMary Upton (Dublin South Central, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

An important part of the question relating to an independent report was not answered. The Minister indicated we must learn from what has happened but I suggest this will not happen unless we get a full independent report into what exactly happened. It is not good enough that the Irish Sports Council, which forms one part of the triangle, is doing a report. That is not independent and will not serve sports or the Irish taxpayer very well.

Photo of Mary HanafinMary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Having read the report, I am not convinced that another report will solve anything. We know the issues and what needs to be done. The report presented to me was in the form of a letter from the Irish Sports Council setting out the issues. It attached the proceedings from the court, which I already had but which gave all the arguments made by the plaintiff. Neither the Irish Sports Council nor Athletics Ireland got the opportunity to give their side of the argument in court because a settlement was made. Between the letter and the proceedings from the court, we have the overall picture. We know what was said, by whom and when. Issues have undoubtedly arisen and some which I referred to a few moments ago need to be addressed.

We know what happened and I am not sure we need an independent inquiry to tell us what happened. We must consider the issues to ensure it does not happen again.

Photo of John O'MahonyJohn O'Mahony (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I am interested in the Minister's statement that she knows what has happened and needs to be done. Perhaps she might tell us what needs to be done. I was also interested in her comments on the relationship between the Irish Sports Council and the governing bodies. I agree that it has reached a critical point. Deputy Mitchell raised the question of this report in the past and the need for an independent report. It is unacceptable that the report comes from one side of the battle.

I had four questions disallowed today which dealt with the relationship between the Irish Sports Council and governing bodies. In reply to Deputy Mitchell the last day in dealing with this report, the Minister suggested that we should see that this does not happen again. It is already happening in the boxing association, which my disallowed question dealt with. There is a dysfunctional pattern building between the Irish Sports Council and governing bodies.

Photo of Brendan HowlinBrendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Does the Deputy have a question?

3:00 pm

Photo of Mary UptonMary Upton (Dublin South Central, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I am not apportioning blame to sides but this matter should be examined. There is a high-performance director who was not appointed in the boxing sector but who brought all the medals and glory to us. That director has been offered a position with another nation.

The basketball association will be having its AGM in a couple of weeks time. It is on its knees and its staff have been told that their employment cannot be guaranteed past June.

Photo of Brendan HowlinBrendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Deputy is making a speech rather than asking a question.

Photo of John O'MahonyJohn O'Mahony (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I have a letter with me from a parent whose daughter has been picked for an international basketball team. She must pay €2,500 if she is to play.

Photo of Brendan HowlinBrendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I want to allow the Minster to reply.

Photo of John O'MahonyJohn O'Mahony (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

This is a new system of pay-for-play.

Photo of Mary HanafinMary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I wish to clarify something. The settlement in the case amounted to €309,283, of which the Irish Sports Council's contribution was €150,000. Its legal costs amounted to €225,000. I wish to clarify this in case I gave the wrong impression.

We know what occurred because we have both sides of the story. We have the sports council's account in the form of a letter and we have the court proceedings, which constitute the plaintiff's account. Mediation, governance and recruitment into important posts are three of the issues that must be addressed.

Deputy O'Mahony raised two important issues about boxing, which is not only important in terms of sport, but also in the context of our Olympic hopefuls, given the fact that 12 of our 23 Olympic medals have come from boxing. Basketball is also important. The sports council, which gets almost €50 million per year, will give €864,048 to basketball this year. I do not know why the association claims it cannot keep its staff, as this is a significant amount of money. The council supports associations and governing bodies in drawing up job descriptions and participating in recruitment panels, etc. It is important that all recruitment should be open and transparent.

Photo of John O'MahonyJohn O'Mahony (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

With regard to boxing, the Irish Sports Council, ISC, has stated it will withdraw funding to the Irish Amateur Boxing Association for the posts that have been appointed. What is the Minister's opinion on this matter? The situation cannot continue.

Photo of Mary HanafinMary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

It is a matter for the ISC, but it is important that all appointments be made in an open and transparent way. I hope that any difficulties between the council and an important sport like boxing can be resolved. The funding for this year is €959,000, which could go a long way in boxing.

Photo of Mary UptonMary Upton (Dublin South Central, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Minister keeps saying it is a matter for the sports council, but that is at the heart of the matter. There is a level of dysfunction between the sports council and the governing bodies of the various sporting organisations. There is a need to review the role and responsibilities of the council and there may be a need to introduce legislation.

We have learned of a big spat with the Athletics Association of Ireland, AAI, and we now know of another with the amateur boxing association. Where will it stop? We are also aware of other issues. The learning curve is slow indeed and the legislation needs to be reviewed.

Photo of Mary HanafinMary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The legislation probably encompasses enough of what the ISC is trying to do. A clear policy on recruiting strategically important senior positions into the governing bodies is necessary and the ISC has indicated to me it wants this to be done in order that the process can be as open and transparent as possible.

Photo of Mary UptonMary Upton (Dublin South Central, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

It does not interfere-----

Photo of Mary HanafinMary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

In respect of boxing, the council has indicated that its decision only applies to the two specific posts that have been in question in recent weeks and that the priority is to ensure a minimum of impact on boxers and to see the men's senior team participating in the European championships. In the past month, the boxers have met with considerable success on the international stage, so the situation is not impacting on them.

We need transparency at that level. While there is no need for a change in legislation, clarification of the relationship and the support the ISC can give is necessary.

Photo of John O'MahonyJohn O'Mahony (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Is further legal action pending in respect of the AAI as a result of the original case? This matter is in the public domain.

Photo of Mary HanafinMary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

No. My understanding is that the settlement ended all future legal action, including before the Employment Appeals Tribunal, etc.

Photo of John O'MahonyJohn O'Mahony (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

That is not the information we have.

Photo of Mary UptonMary Upton (Dublin South Central, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Deputy O'Mahony is on the same wavelength as me.

Photo of John O'MahonyJohn O'Mahony (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

It was in last weekend's Sunday Times.

Photo of Brendan HowlinBrendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Perhaps this matter could be followed up by the appropriate committee.

Photo of Mary UptonMary Upton (Dublin South Central, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

We are discussing vast amounts of money and potentially significant costs for sport and the taxpayer if further legal cases are pending, which we believe to be the case.