Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Question 4: To ask the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the steps he will take to address the significant backlog in the area of the Garda vetting, with particular reference to teachers; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [5802/10]

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Garda central vetting unit provides employment vetting for a large number of organisations that are registered with the Garda for this purpose and employ people in a full-time, part-time, voluntary or training capacity to work with children and/or vulnerable adults. The Teaching Council is registered with the unit to submit vetting applications in respect of new teachers. I am informed by the Garda authorities that all applications received from the Teaching Council in respect of new teachers are processed in accordance with the unit's standard operating procedures. The results in respect of each applicant are disclosed to the registered organisation. In line with the framework of the implementation group on Garda vetting, in which the various stakeholders are brought together, consultations are taking place with the relevant education stakeholders on how best to introduce the vetting of existing teachers, which is expected to commence later this year. The vetting of a body of employees of the size of the cohort of existing teachers would present a challenge to any system. The Garda authorities will maximise the resources at their disposal in managing this development.

I cannot accept the Deputy's contention that there is a significant backlog in the vetting process. The current average processing time for valid vetting applications received at the vetting unit is approximately six weeks. This processing time fluctuates during the year due to seasonal demands, when the volume of applications received from certain sectors, including the education sector, can increase. The time required to process a individual vetting application can be longer if clarification is required from the registered organisation as to the details provided, or if other inquiries need to be made. The strategic expansion of the Garda vetting service is taking place by means of a phased roll-out to an increasing number of organisations in the child and vulnerable adult care sectors. This target group is the clear policy priority. It is necessary to phase the expansion of vetting to prevent an unmanageable surge in vetting application numbers, which would likely lead to an administrative logjam. This expansion will continue until vetting is provided for all personnel working in a full-time, part-time or voluntary capacity with children or vulnerable adults.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Can I express disappointment with the Minister's reply, which seems to fly in the face of the facts as far as the vetting unit is concerned? I compliment those involved in the unit, in so far as their resources allow or facilitate them to undertake the duties they are statutorily required to undertake. Will the Minister comment on a recent report which suggested that up to 40,000 teachers are awaiting vetting, but cannot receive their vetting clearance because of inadequacies in the system? It is entirely unsustainable and intolerable in the context of the requirement for vetting. How can his Department stand over the reality that it will take up to four years to clear the backlog under the current regime?

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

As I explained earlier, discussions on the existing cohort of teachers are ongoing. All new teachers are vetted within a relatively short space of time. I am informed that the current average processing time, based on the figures for the last couple of months, is between four and five weeks. That is in contrast with an average processing time of six weeks in 2009. The issues with the existing cohort of teachers will be dealt with on a phased basis.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

It will take up to five years.

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Some 137,000 applications were received in 2006, with an average processing time of between five and six weeks. Some 218,000 applications were received in 2008, with an average processing time of between four and five weeks. Some 246,000 applications were received in 2009. Approximately 18,000 organisations receive vetting services for employment purposes. There is a massive involvement in the vetting process. The vetting unit has a total staffing complement of 78, the vast majority of whom are civilians. One Garda superintendent and five Garda sergeants are attached to the unit - the rest of its staff are civilians. The dramatic growth of this area is demonstrated by the increase in the staff complement over the last three years, from 13 in 2006 to 78 at present.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The difficulty is that the Minister has not addressed the question of how he will meet the significant backlog. He has expressed some surprise about how busy the vetting unit is, but that was always going to be the case in light of its responsibilities. I would like to know why the backlog is so stark. There are people emigrating from this country on a daily basis. Nurses who cannot get jobs in this country, as a result of current Government policy, cannot take up the employment they are being offered outside his jurisdiction because they do not have vetting certificates from Thurles. Is this an information technology problem? Is it a personnel problem? Is it a resource problem? I asked the Minister to outline the steps he proposes to take to address the backlog. He spoke about the backlog and stated it would take some time. By my reckoning, it would take up to five years to deal with the teachers' cohort alone. Is the Minister suggesting that he does not intend to take any steps?

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I did not use the word "backlog" at all.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I asked the Minister about the backlog in the question.

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

As far as my Department and I are concerned, there is no backlog.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Minister is avoiding the question.

Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Allow the Minister to reply.

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I accept there is an issue in respect of how to deal with the cohort of existing teachers in the system. As I stated in my first reply, to which the Deputy obviously did not listen, in respect of consultation with the various stakeholders on the implementation group on Garda vetting, consultations are taking place with the relevant educational stakeholders as to how to best introduce the vetting of existing teachers. This will be done in such a way that it will not lead to a completely unmanageable situation whereby a massive backlog would be created. It will be done on a phased basis. I again revert to the figures, which demonstrate that within just three years, the figures have risen from 137,000 applications dealt with to 246,000 such applications.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

That was always going to happen.

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

In effect, this constitutes a doubling within a short space of time without any backlog.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

That is not news. I refer to proper planning.

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Consequently, I have no doubt but that the cohort of existing teachers will be dealt with easily over the next year or so.