Dáil debates
Thursday, 4 February 2010
Priority Questions.
Gangland Killings.
Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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Question 1: To ask the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform his views on the five gangland gun murders in the first three weeks of 2010; his further views on the effectiveness of anti-gangland legislation introduced in 2009; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [5800/10]
Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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I deplore the recent killings. They are further evidence of the callous disregard for human life and community safety shown by members of criminal gangs. The Garda Síochána is carrying out intensive investigations of all these killings and has made good progress in respect of a number of them. The Garda Commissioner has kept me briefed on these events.
In setting the policing priorities for the Garda Síochána in 2010, I have asked the Garda Commissioner to continue the focus of the force on serious crime, in particular organised crime. This priority is reflected in the Garda policing plan for this year which has just been published.
It has to be accepted that, as is the case in every jurisdiction, there can be considerable difficulties for police investigators in obtaining evidence relating to gangland murders. Associates of a victim of a gangland killing are often criminals themselves and do not co-operate with Garda investigations. They frequently fail to co-operate even when they themselves are the victims of violence. There is often no connection or personal association between the victim and the perpetrator. Witnesses may be also subject to high levels of intimidation to influence them not to come forward.
It was against this background that last year I introduced a series of strong but necessary anti-gangland legislative measures, in particular, the Criminal Justice (Surveillance) Act and the Criminal Justice (Amendment) Act. I have consistently made it clear that it will inevitably take time for the full effects of that legislation to become clear. The Garda Commissioner has assured me that the Garda Síochána has been making full use of the legislation since it was enacted in order to build up criminal cases against gangland figures. The Garda Síochána is painstakingly working to gather evidence that will be sufficient to enable the Director of Public Prosecutions independently to initiate prosecutions of people relating to gangland activities. A number of Garda investigation files have been already submitted to the DPP. I am confident that as the evidence accumulates against individuals under these pieces of legislation, successful prosecutions will be taken.
Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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I revert to matters which were debated in the past couple of days under the Fine Gael Private Members' motion. A number of questions were put to the Minister in the course of that debate which remain unanswered. How many defendants have appeared in the Special Criminal Court since he rushed through the important legislation to which he refers? I ask that question against the background of there being 32 murders, 114 threats of murder, 65 kidnappings, some of them vicious, 470 robberies of institutions and 1,986 instances or crimes involving the possession of drugs for sale or supply in this State since the enactment of the legislation. Having regard to those thousands of crimes committed since last July, will the Minister say how many people appeared before the Special Criminal Court and how many were successfully convicted by that court?
Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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Either Deputy Flanagan is speaking with a very large tongue in his cheek or he clearly does not understand how prosecutions are gathered. It shows an incredible lack of understanding on his part of how prosecutions are put together, given that those two pieces of legislation were enacted only last July. We are not dealing with ordinary, run of the mill crime but rather with very significant incidents and significant pieces of legislation where there is an absolute requirement, given-----
Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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I take it the answer is zero.
Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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-----all the hoo-ha that was created by people like Deputy Flanagan and others on that side of the House as to whether this was ground-breaking legislation, and I maintained it was not. It takes time for the evidence to be accumulated under the provisions of any new legislation.
Pat Rabbitte (Dublin South West, Labour)
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That is not what the Minister told the papers at the time.
Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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I did not say anything, and Deputy Rabbitte continuously tries to twist things-----
Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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This is Deputy Flanagan's priority question.
Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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-----and say that, and he is patently wrong.
Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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Please allow the Minister answer Deputy Flanagan's question.
Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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The Minister has now finished.
Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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I have to listen to what I regard as claptrap from the people opposite who know right well that I do not prosecute-----
Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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The Minister is filibustering. He has no answer. Not one person has been convicted.
Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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Not one person has been convicted. The Special Criminal Court has not been commissioned on one occasion-----
Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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Please Deputy, I will call you again if I have time, if the time does not run out.
Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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The Deputy, particularly-----
Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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The Minister should tell the truth.
Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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-----as he has a legal background, should understand that I have absolutely no say in which cases can or cannot be brought under this legislation.
Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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As I said in my reply, I understand from the Garda Commissioner that under the Criminal Justice (Amendment) Act, a number of files have been already referred to the Director of Public Prosecutions for decision.
Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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The Minister says he has no say. Will he confirm that neither has he a say in the matter of the appointment of the hundreds of vacancies, almost 800, that have occurred in the Garda Síochána since his Government introduced the budgetary policies of last year? In the context of his recent announcements, who is currently the chief superintendent heading up the National Bureau of Criminal Investigation? I also ask him to name the chief superintendent in charge of the special detective unit.
Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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The Deputy should ask a specific question.
Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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It is a specific question for which I require a specific answer, having regard to press releases and the spin in which the Minister has engaged up to very recently, on the matter of the filling of Garda vacancies. Where are they and who are they?
Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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There has been no spinning with regard to the issue of the filling of the vacancies because the Government just last week made a decision, on foot of the consent of the Minister for Finance, to release 170 promotions. The Deputy may have seen the publicity. Despite the fact he comes in here and says the Minister has the power to fill these vacancies, the Minister, personally, does not have the power to fill the vacancies in the Garda Síochána-----
Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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The Minister is the man with the purse strings.
Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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-----and that is entirely a matter, under the 2005 legislation, for the Garda Commissioner but he has the power and will fill those vacancies very shortly. All that nonsense and spin from the Deputy and his misleading of people by implying this is evidence of the Government not doing its job, I can assure the Deputy and the general public-----
Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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I take it the answer is "No" again.
Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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-----that the current Garda force is the best facilitated and the best resourced in the history of the State.
Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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Zero again. I thank the Minister. He has confirmed-----
Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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I confirmed what the Deputy already knows.
Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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If I had time for further supplementary questions-----
Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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Please, if both sides of the House would have regard to the Chair, we might get through this Question Time.