Olwyn Enright (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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Question 79: To ask the Minister for Social and Family Affairs the amount of fraud control savings achieved in 2009; if she has satisfied herself with the savings achieved; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [2057/10]

Mary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
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Welfare fraud is theft. It is a serious crime and the Department is doing everything it can to prevent and detect fraud, and to crack down on those who abuse the system. Several initiatives were introduced or enhanced last year to target controls more effectively in schemes. These included more frequent mailshots to identify people who have left the country and who are no longer entitled to a payment; additional data matches with other agencies to identify welfare customers who had failed to disclose relevant information to the Department, such as earnings and compensation claims; improved internal data matching procedures to ensure that relevant information available in one area of the Department is applied to all schemes; and increased emphasis in the border regions on control of claims from applicants with a previous address in Northern Ireland. These were additional to the improved controls introduced in 2008, which included requiring new claimants of jobseekers payments to collect their money in person at the post office rather than having it paid straight into their bank account.

Greater emphasis was also placed last year on prevention of fraud and error at the claim application stage. While this is the most cost effective mechanism of reducing unwarranted welfare expenditure, it should be noted that savings achieved in this way are not included in the published figures for control savings. For 2009, the Department set a target of reviewing almost 620,000 individual welfare claims. Over 750,000 reviews were carried out last year, which is 20% more than the annual target. The total fraud and error savings recorded for the year was approximately €484 million, which is an increase of €8 million on the 2008 figure.

In considering the level of savings recorded in 2009, it is important to note that the final average live register figure for the year, at 395,500, was significantly lower than the 440,000 that had been predicted when the annual target was set. While it is difficult to identify exactly why the above target number of reviews did not generate higher savings, it may be partially due to decreased opportunities for people to work and claim. Increased emphasis on preventing unwarranted claims at the initial application stage may also have led to a reduction in the number of claims stopped after they had gone into payment.

Additional information not recorded on the floor of the House.

It is also worth noting that the 2009 control savings from several schemes were ahead of target. These include family income supplement, carers, illness payments and State pensions.

Overall, I am satisfied that the enhanced controls introduced in recent years are helping to reduce the potential for fraud and errors in welfare payments. I also believe that the new anti-fraud powers included in the Social Welfare Bill are a clear demonstration of this Government's determination to do everything that it can to stop people getting money to which they are not entitled.

Olwyn Enright (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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The savings made by the Minister were far short of the target she had set, and this is clear from her reply. The same pertained to 2008. She has set a much lower target for 2010. Is that because she has failed to reach her targets for the last two years?

What else does the Minister plan to do? She has asked for useful suggestions. The Joint Committee on Social and Family Affairs, through Deputy Shortall, suggested rolling out a national identification card, something to which the Government has committed itself. When are we likely to see that?

The Minister will be aware of a case that went to court a couple of weeks ago. The gentleman involved collected somebody else's in the same post office as his own for 14 or 15 years. How did that happen? The clear answer is that there was no ID card and there was no requirement for a check to be made on that gentleman. People in the Dublin region have told me that they have gone to social welfare offices and have not been asked for identification. There is nothing to prevent people from collecting someone else's payment. When will a tougher, stricter approach be introduced? We have heard a great deal of talk but it has not been matched by action on the ground.

Mary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
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One of the reasons the target was not met was that the number on the live register did not reach the anticipated level. It is important that we stop people receiving payment before fraud occurs. This issue is being given careful attention. The control target for next year is €533 million. The Department hopes and expects to achieve this target through the range of measures it has implemented and new initiatives.

Money was provided in the budget for the roll-out of a PPS card, which will commence this year. This measure will help eliminate fraud as the new card will feature a photograph. While it will not be an identity card, it will be helpful.

I do not wish to discuss individual cases but it is extraordinary that the person to whom the Deputy referred was able to continue with the fraud for so long. An individual can, however, collect a pension for an older person if he or she is the designated agent.

Olwyn Enright (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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The gentleman in question was not the designated agent in this instance. The person for whom he claimed was dead and could not designate an agent.

Mary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
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I am aware of that. It is awful that anyone would continue to collect money for such a long period.

Róisín Shortall (Dublin North West, Labour)
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The Department held details of the death.

Mary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
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Deputy Shortall makes a fair point. At that time, the systems did not talk to each other. As a result of new information technology, deaths are automatically notified to the Department. This did not occur at the time of the case to which the Deputies refer. One should not underestimate the fact that the systems talk to each other. While it may be odd that is only taking place now, at least it is being done.

Data matching with other groups and organisations is also helping to crack down on fraud. I have twice met representatives of postmasters who have been very helpful. They have requested in their newsletters that postmasters ensure that they ask for proof of identity.

Olwyn Enright (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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With respect, the Minister's statement that the number of people on the live register is not as high as anticipated is neither here nor there. Those who would have been on the live register would not have been fraudulent claimants but people with an entitlement to claim a benefit.

Mary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
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A person who was working would not have an entitlement.

Olwyn Enright (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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If the number on the live register had been higher, it would not have affected the figure. Is data matching in place to enable the Revenue Commissioners to check whether landlords in receipt of rent supplement from the Department are paying tax on the payment?

Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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The Deputy is extending the scope of the question.

Mary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
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I will return to the Deputy on that question. In some schemes, including lone parent's allowance, carer's allowance, illness payments, State pensions and family income supplement, the savings secured from anti-fraud measures have exceeded the targets. We cannot concentrate all our efforts on the live register.

Olwyn Enright (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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The Minister raised the issue, not me.

Mary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
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We will continue to take the issue seriously. The Deputy asked what new measures the Department would take this year. The introduction of the new PPS card is a new initiative. Members of the public can also make a complaint or report suspected fraud on-line without providing any information about themselves. They can provide details and information on the Department's website about people who they believe are engaging in fraud. The success of these initiatives will prove helpful.

Olwyn Enright (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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The Minister indicated previously that the majority of such reports prove to be unfounded.