Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

It is proposed to take No. 43, statements on industrial action by public sector unions in relation to public sector pay; and No. 44, statements on farming and the agrifood sector.

It is proposed, notwithstanding anything in Standing Orders, that the proceedings on No. 43 shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion after 80 minutes today and the following arrangements shall apply: the statements shall be confined to a Minister or Minister of State and to the main spokespersons for Fine Gael, the Labour Party and Sinn Féin, who shall be called upon in that order, who may share their time and which shall not exceed 15 minutes in each case, and a Minister or Minister of State shall take questions for a period not exceeding 20 minutes; and the following arrangements shall apply in relation to No. 44: the statements of a Minister or Minister of State and of the main spokespersons for Fine Gael, the Labour Party and Sinn Féin, who shall be called upon in that order, shall not exceed 15 minutes in each case, the statement of every other Member called upon shall not exceed ten minutes in each case, Members may share time and a Minister or Minister of State shall be called upon to make a statement in reply which shall not exceed five minutes.

Private Members' business shall be No. 95, motion re flooding

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

There are two proposals to put to the House. Is the proposal for dealing with No. 43 agreed to?

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I object to the Order of Business. I propose an amendment to the Order of Business that the Dáil sits until 9.50 p.m. and that we have a three-hour debate on the consequences of flooding, including 30 minutes of questions and answers with the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government. Fine Gael will set aside its Private Member's time between 7 p.m. and 8.30 p.m., No. 43. should be taken for 80 minutes from 8.30 p.m. and the debate on agriculture should be postponed until Thursday. I do not want this to be like the landings at Dunkirk.

This is a matter of extreme importance to people. We have listened on umpteen occasions to members of the Government talking about Dáil reform. As we sit in the comfort of this leather lined Chamber, people are under five feet of water in their homes, businesses and on their farms. This reflects a gulf, which is filled with anger and misgiving because Government support has evaporated. Today is the halfway point of the Government, which took up office on 24 May 2007. Its integrity is in shreds, its credibility is in tatters and it has lost the moral authority to lead.

If the Government cannot respond in this House to give Members, who represent farmers, housewives, young people and everybody else, the opportunity to speak up and give the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government and the Government the facts of life from village, town and city, then we will have failed in our duty. We talk about Dáil reform. Here is an opportunity to allow for a three-hour debate led off by the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government. Every Member should have ten minutes, which would be followed by a question and answer session, to give the Minister further information in order that he would have a more complete and deeper analysis of what is happening. If we are not able to do that, the House will have failed in its duty to people who this evening are in darkness and who are worried, concerned and anxious because they do not know where the next flood will come from or what will happen.

Despite the good work of the emergency services and the local authorities, it is an important function in our democracy that the representatives of the people in the House of Parliament be enabled to speak out on an issue that is unprecedented and that is a once in 800 years happening. The River Shannon is a foot and a half higher than it was in 1954.

If the Ceann Comhairle thinks this is not worthy of consideration under Standing Order 32, I propose an amendment to the Order of Business that Deputies from the Fianna Fáil Party, the Green Party, the Labour Party, the Fine Gael Party, Independent Members and Sinn Féin be enabled to speak out and inform the Minister and Government of how important a matter this is.

Paul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Sinn Féin Members are not here.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

If we cannot do this, we will fail in our democratic duty to the thousands of people who are seeking a response and some degree of leadership from this House. They know, as we do, that on an occasion like this a Private Members' debate does not deal with the issue because the Minister will not answer questions in that debate.

Seán Power (Kildare South, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Try to look angry.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I would like to hear the advice the Minister gave to the Cabinet. I would like him to hear the views of all Deputies so that he is properly and fully informed of the situation when water and sewage have risen in house after house, town after town and city after city.

Frank Feighan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Show some compassion.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

We do not want to give the impression that the Government or the House do not care. I ask the Ceann Comhairle and the Government to accept my amendment as it in everybody's interest to do so. We should set aside the business planned and deal with the issue that has most relevance for people, even as the rain continues to pour from the sky as we speak.

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Deputy will be aware that this matter is due for discussion from 7 p.m. until 8.30 tonight with a continuation tomorrow night.

Alan Shatter (Dublin South, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Deputy Kirk is not the Chairman of the Fianna Fáil Party any more and cannot interpret the debate.

Billy Kelleher (Cork North Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

That is a disgraceful comment.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I have proposed an amendment to the Order of Business.

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Yes, but the amendment is not in order under Standing Order 26.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The amendment is in order because it proposes that the Dáil should sit longer than is proposed on the Order of Business. Private Members' business today is in the name of the Fine Gael Party. We are prepared to set that aside in the interest of a complete, thorough, full and open debate where the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government can answer questions in respect of observations made by Deputies from Fianna Fáil and the Green Party. If we cannot do this, then let the Whip not come in here and talk about Dáil reform. This issue is relevant to thousands of people regarding their houses, their businesses and careers and for the social comfort of so many whose floors are lifting before their eyes even as we speak. It is about time this Chamber began to be relevant to the needs of our people.

Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

On behalf of the Labour Party, I support the proposal made by Deputy Kenny. This is an extraordinary day and we have an emergency in the country. People's homes have been flooded and many of those whose homes have not been flooded to date fear they will be in trouble. There is a huge problem. I appreciate there is a motion down for debate at Private Members' time, but that is a restricted form of debate which is limited to those proposing the motion, a Minister responding and a few other speakers if we are lucky.

This is not a day when we can do business as usual. It is a day when one part of the country is under water and when virtually every public office and service in the State is closed down in an industrial dispute. Is it seriously being suggested in the national Parliament that Members, who represent constituencies that are under water and people whose homes have been flooded and whose businesses have been ruined and who are frightened about what faces them, cannot debate the matter here? Deputy Kenny and I raised this issue on Leaders' questions. We did not do this in an adversarial way but in order to respond to the situation and to try to get some response from Government. It is reasonable that Members who represent constituencies and people directly affected by this should have the opportunity to debate the issue and have their say on it in Government time, not Private Members' time.

Deputy Kenny has proposed a formula whereby that can be done. I support that, but I would make one slight change. I think we could deal with the statements on the industrial dispute immediately after the Order of Business. This would, among other things, allow the Ministers who must deal with the emergency situation to prepare for the debate and take advice or do whatever is necessary. This small alteration in the order in which we deal with the issue might be acceptable. This is not a business as usual day. I appeal to the Taoiseach to agree, on behalf of the Government, to allow us deal with this issue. It is unthinkable that Members must go back to their constituencies and face people whose homes have been flooded, businesses ruined and their farms left under water and when they are asked whether they raised the matter to have to reply they are sorry but they could not because of the rules of the House. People will find that laughable. It will make this House and the institutional Parliament a laughing stock and irrelevant. I appeal to the Taoiseach to agree to the proposal made by Deputy Kenny, with the adjustment I have suggested, and that we get on and deal with the issue.

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I must advise the House that I must implement Standing Orders. Under Standing Order 26-----

Alan Shatter (Dublin South, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

On a point of order, the Ceann Comhairle is out of his depth. He is drowning. The Taoiseach can amend the Order of Business any day.

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I ask the Deputies to resume their seats. I call on Deputy Shatter to resume his seat.

Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Perhaps I can be of assistance. I understand it was agreed to have statements on the farming and agrifood sector last week.

Ciarán Lynch (Cork South Central, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

That was before the floods.

Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Allow me to say a few words without interruption. I am trying to be of assistance.

Paul Connaughton Snr (Galway East, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

We will listen to the Taoiseach.

Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Where would we be without the Deputy?

Paul Connaughton Snr (Galway East, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Where would we be without the Taoiseach?

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Taoiseach, without interruption.

Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The only thing we can be sure of is that Deputy Connaughton will be in the same position.

Alan Shatter (Dublin South, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Minister for Finance, having destroyed the economy-----

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Taoiseach, without interruption.

Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

To return to the Order of Business, we should proceed with No. 43, statements on industrial action by public sector unions. Deputy Kenny has suggested that Fine Gael would withdraw Private Members' time so we could take statements on the flooding situation. I suggest that after the statements on the industrial action we could take statements on flooding until 8.30 p.m. I believe that would cover the requests made.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Taoiseach has come part of the way. However, if we have statements, these should be followed by a 30 minute session of questions and answers with the Minister. I will accept the Taoiseach's proposal if that is done.

Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

It is a matter for the Whips to discuss that.

Alan Shatter (Dublin South, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Taoiseach should get one thing right. Even his predecessor would agree to this.

Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

With respect, the proposal has come without notice. I am seeking to accommodate the views of the House, even if there is no way of satisfying Deputy Shatter. I have suggested that we should have statements on industrial action, followed immediately by statements on flooding, in lieu of Private Members' time which would not normally start until 7 p.m. If we were to proceed with this arrangement, we would commence at 6.20 p.m. with statements on flooding until 8.30 p.m. We can talk to the Whips about any further arrangement.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I suggest the Ceann Comhairle might adjourn the House for ten minutes so the Whips can make arrangements. I thank the Taoiseach for his concessions so far. I suggest that following the statements we should have 30 minutes of questions and answers with the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government. That would satisfy the demands of all Deputies and it would be a more thorough, deeper, clearer and fairer debate.

Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

We are heading towards agreement on this arrangement. It is important the proposed statements should not be pro forma type statements. There needs to be an interaction between Members and an opportunity for them to be able to put questions to the relevant Ministers. As I said earlier, this should not be an adversarial debate. We want to respond to the needs of the people affected by the flooding and the weather, to get as much information as possible and perhaps to make suggestions to the Government and to Ministers about what might be done.

Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I agree with Deputy Gilmore. It was the view of the Fine Gael Party that there should be a Private Members' debate on this subject this evening and the Government has no problem in agreeing to this. We have now received a request without prior notice which I am seeking to accommodate. I suggest we take statements on industrial action. The Whips can meet in the meantime. I suggest we finish our business at 8.30 p.m. or 8.45 p.m. and work out the details based on statements-----

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

So long as the Taoiseach shows a willingness to have a question and answer session at the end of the statements, then there will be no difficulty. I suggest we begin with statements on the industrial dispute.

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Is the proposal for statements on industrial action agreed?

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Is the sitting suspending for five minutes?

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

It has been suggested that the Whips can meet while the statements are proceeding.

Leo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

They just need to ring Deputy Gormley.

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

It has been agreed to suspend.

Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

After I take the Order of Business.

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Is it agreed that the sitting be suspended for five minutes?

Paul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

On a point of order-----

Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I suggest that, to assist matters and given the urgency, we might agree to take the Order of Business and then suspend the sitting.

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Is it suggested that the sitting suspend immediately?

Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Yes.

Joan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

And come back to the strike.

Paul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Is the sitting being suspended now?

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Unless there are any other items for the Order of Business before we suspend the sitting.

Paul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I suggest the sitting be suspended now.

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The sitting will be suspended for five minutes.