Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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Question 106: To ask the Minister for Defence the extent to which it is intended to enhance coastal surveillance with particular reference to the need to assist in the detection of drugs or people trafficking; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [3532/09]

Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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Question 222: To ask the Minister for Defence if it is intended to increase the strength of coastal surveillance and defence with particular reference to the need for increased air and sea rescue services and coastal surveillance to combat drug trafficking; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [3793/09]

Willie O'Dea (Limerick East, Fianna Fail)
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I propose to take Questions Nos. 106 and 222 together.

The Naval Service comprises the maritime element of the Defence Forces and has a general responsibility to meet contingent and actual maritime defence requirements. The Naval Service operates eight general purpose patrol ships. All eight ships are involved in coastal and offshore patrolling and surveillance for the State in that part of the seas where State jurisdiction applies.

The Naval Service provides a fishery protection service in accordance with the State's obligations as a member of the European Union. The service is tasked with patrolling all Irish waters from the shoreline to the outer limits of the exclusive fishery limits. At present, fishery protection activity accounts for roughly 90% of all Naval Service patrol time. However, as the need arises, Naval Service vessels may be deployed to other duties such as offering aid to the civil power and drug interdiction operations.

The current exclusive fishery limits extend to 200 miles offshore and cover an area of 132,000 nautical square miles. The Naval Service currently patrols the entire 200-mile limit and periodically patrols beyond it to protect specific fisheries. These patrols are carried out on a regular and frequent basis and are directed to all areas of Irish waters as necessary. The number of patrol vessels on patrol in Irish waters at any one time varies between three and eight. The Naval Service is committed to having at least three vessels on patrol within the Irish exclusive economic zone at any one time. Naval Service patrols are complemented by assistance provided by the Air Corps. The Air Corps maritime squadron carries out aerial surveillance of territorial waters using the two CASA maritime patrol aircraft.

The Irish Coast Guard has overall responsibility for the provision of maritime search and rescue services within the Irish search and rescue region. In accordance with the roles assigned to them by Government in the White Paper on Defence, the Defence Forces are committed to providing support to the civil authorities, including in regard to search and rescue operations. In this regard, the Naval Service and Air Corps provide support to the Coast Guard as the need arises and within their available capability.

Responsibility for the prevention of drug trafficking and people trafficking rests primarily with the Revenue Commissioners and An Garda Síochána, respectively. However, the White Paper on Defence provides for a security role for the Naval Service and the Air Corps to assist and support the civil authorities in this most important work. Government measures to improve law enforcement in regard to drugs, including the establishment in 1993 of a joint task force involving An Garda Síochána, the Customs Service and the Naval Service, have helped to maximise the effective use of Naval Service resources in combating drug trafficking. The Air Corps provides air support and, on occasion, carries the Customs National Drugs Team in an observational capacity for the purpose of monitoring vessels suspected of drug trafficking and other illegal activities. There is close co-operation between the civil authorities and the Naval Service and the Air Corps in discharging this important mission.

Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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Does the Minister agree that, in the current economic downturn, assistance of the civil power by the Army, Naval Service and Air Corps is required more than ever? Does he not agree that it would be a good idea to ascertain the means by which the backup service might be enhanced, having regard to previous successes in this area and the likelihood of a greater threat in this area in the future?

Willie O'Dea (Limerick East, Fianna Fail)
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I do not foresee any diminution of the service we are providing. On the enhancement of coastal surveillance, the Deputy will be aware I am doing my best at Government level to obtain replacement vessels for the Naval Service that will be more effective than some of those used at present. This, in itself, will certainly enhance the service.

Brian O'Shea (Waterford, Labour)
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In the context of the considerable savings being sought at present, is there not a case for a much more integrated approach in regard to the effort of the Defence Forces, Customs and Excise and Garda Síochána to combat the drugs problem? Many in the fishing industry in Ireland contend there is not sufficient or effective surveillance of vessels fishing illegally in our territorial waters. I hear this quite frequently.

I know the Minister has a specific role, which he has outlined. Is it not about time the relevant Ministers got together to formulate a plan that makes maximum use of resources and improves co-ordination in coming to terms and effectively dealing with the importation of drugs into this country? All the available anecdotal evidence indicates that far more drugs are coming into this country than are being detected. In many ways it appears Ireland is being used as a landing place for drugs to be moved on to places elsewhere in the European Union. What evidence does the Minister have that this is the case, anecdotally or otherwise? I remain to be convinced that we are using and co-ordinating our resources to best effect to combat what is the major scourge and social problem in our country.

Willie O'Dea (Limerick East, Fianna Fail)
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I accept what Deputy O'Shea said. It was decided in the early 1990s to set up a joint task force comprising the Revenue Commissioners, who have primary responsibility in this regard, the Naval Service and the Garda Síochána. When intelligence is received on a possible drug importation into the country, the task force gets together to monitor the situation, to prevent the drugs coming in and hopefully to arrest and successfully prosecute the people responsible.

There is a view that we would detect more drugs if we had more ships. That is basically correct. Nevertheless, if one looks at the matter logically, taking into account the length of our coastline and the area covered by the exclusion zone, no matter how many ships we had we would still not be able to detect all the drugs coming into this country. Currently, the system is intelligence-led. When intelligence comes in, the task force is put together and everything follows on from there. I am always open to new suggestions if Deputy O'Shea has any specific proposals on further integration and co-ordination.

P J Sheehan (Cork South West, Fine Gael)
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Is the Minister satisfied he has sufficient manpower in the Customs and Excise and the Garda? Is he satisfied also that he has sufficient facilities for those two groups of people to monitor the huge south-west Cork coastline, which is the targeted zone for the importation of drugs?

In reply to a parliamentary question on Wednesday, 26 November 2008, the Minister indicated that the Maritime Analysis and Operations Centre-Narcotics, based in Lisbon, is designed to tackle smugglers bringing drugs from Europe, Latin America and West Africa? The Minister informed me in that reply that the centre is operated by seven countries, namely, Ireland, the United Kingdom, Portugal, France, Italy, Spain and the Netherlands.

Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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The Deputy is giving information rather than asking for it.

P J Sheehan (Cork South West, Fine Gael)
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No.

Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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He is being encouraging.

P J Sheehan (Cork South West, Fine Gael)
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I want to know how effective is the Maritime Analysis and Operations Centre that was set up in Lisbon on 25 July 2007. How is it operating? Is the Minister satisfied that we can now detect all the illegal importations of drugs into this country? Drugs are the scourge of humanity and they will be the scourge of this country unless they are curbed.

Willie O'Dea (Limerick East, Fianna Fail)
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I do not disagree with much of what Deputy Sheehan is saying. I am satisfied with the sufficiency of manpower and facilities to patrol not only the south-west Cork coast, but the coast generally. I am satisfied also that the best possible use is being made of the existing facilities and that the customs officers and the Coast Guard in particular are doing a tremendous job. Of course, if we had more personnel and greater facilities we could do more. There is only so much personnel and facilities one can afford at any one time, but I do not know of any country in the world that could not use even more resources in the fight against drug trafficking.

The centre in Lisbon was, as Deputy Sheehan indicated, established on 25 July 2007, which is just more than a year and a half ago. The information I have is that it is operating well and is making a significant difference. In reply to another question, I do not think it is possible to detect every attempted importation of drugs but I am told that the centre is making a significant difference and that will be reflected in future years.

Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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We are well over time. I will take a final supplementary question from Deputy Deenihan.

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North, Fine Gael)
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Will the Minister clarify whether the Naval Service can only get involved under the direction of either the Revenue Commissioners or the Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform? If the Naval Service is suspicious that a yacht or other vessel may be carrying drugs, is it not possible for it to get involved without direction?

Yesterday, the Taoiseach indicated there would be cutbacks in defence spending such as on equipment. He was not precise about the effects. Will that affect the acquisition of a replacement Naval Service vessel which, as the Minister is aware, is critical?

Willie O'Dea (Limerick East, Fianna Fail)
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As I already outlined, the position is that when something comes to the attention of the Garda Síochána, a task force is put together involving the Naval Service.

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North, Fine Gael)
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But it cannot operate independently.

Willie O'Dea (Limerick East, Fianna Fail)
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No. What happens if something comes to the attention of the Naval Service is that it contacts the Garda Síochána and takes direction from it. That is my understanding of how the system operates.

Regarding the €15 million to which Deputy O'Shea adverted earlier, that will not affect our programme of Naval Service vessel replacement. We are evaluating tenders on the replacement of those ships and that will be completed shortly. It will be a decision of the Government as to whether we can order new ships at that point. That was the original decision. I have to go back to Government on that.

Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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In view of the importance of this question, I will allow a final brief supplementary question from Deputies O'Shea and Durkan.

Brian O'Shea (Waterford, Labour)
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I do not wish to give the impression that I do not believe good progress has been made. I do not have any illusions about anything close to all shipments coming into the country being intercepted. I recall reading that on the south coast of England local people were employed to walk the coastline because they would be able to identify any strange ships, whereas a stranger would not be able to differentiate between yachts, which is the type of vessel that blends in. To the best of my recollection that was a customs operation.

In addition to the Naval Service resource, the Minister has access to military intelligence, which rightly is highly regarded. The Minister made the point that the big seizures have been intelligence-led and that is the most economic and efficient way of doing it. To what extent is military intelligence involved in this process in regard to human trafficking in addition to drugs?

Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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Arising from his earlier reply, does the Minister agree that in the context of the policing of the large and pivotal coastline in a European context that it might be effective to increase air surveillance, which can cover a greater distance and has been proven in other areas? Will the Minister also indicate the extent to which GPS can be utilised in the fight against people and drug trafficking, which is being done in a number of other jurisdictions, especially in Latin America?

Willie O'Dea (Limerick East, Fianna Fail)
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Regarding Deputy O'Shea's question, military intelligence is involved but I do not know to what extent. I do not know what percentage of its time is allocated to people trafficking or drug trafficking. It puts a heavy focus on internal security of the State, as the Deputy is aware, in regard to members of foreign-based terrorist groups in particular.

Brian O'Shea (Waterford, Labour)
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Firearms are also being brought in with some of the drug shipments.

Willie O'Dea (Limerick East, Fianna Fail)
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I appreciate that.

With regard to Deputy Durkan's comments on air surveillance, the navy can get involved in one scenario outside the structure of a task force. The CASA aircraft occasionally carry members of the drug teams in an observational capacity to monitor and so on. I cannot disagree that if we had sufficient resources, more air surveillance would be useful.