Billy Timmins (Wicklow, Fine Gael)
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Question 7: To ask the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform if his attention has been drawn to the problem of Internet gambling; his plans to deal with this issue; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [32772/08]

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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I published the report, Regulating Gaming in Ireland, on 10 July last. The report makes some 32 recommendations that have significant public policy implications regarding the future architecture of many aspects of gaming and betting in Ireland, including the subject matter of the Deputy's question.

Among the issues dealt with in this report is the issue of remote gaming. The report notes that remote gaming — which includes but is not restricted to Internet gambling — is the fastest growing sector of the world gambling industry. It also notes the issues pertaining to remote gaming, while thematically similar to those related to terrestrial gaming, are far more complex and difficult to contain.

No reliable data is available in this jurisdiction on the prevalence of Internet gambling. Data from the UK, for example, from the British Gambling Prevalence Survey 2007, suggest approximately 6% of the UK's adult population used the Internet to gamble in the past year.

Anyone in Ireland with access to the Internet can participate in remote gaming and the report says that in this situation, any regulation of this area will have the effect of reducing existing opportunities for on-line gaming with consequential positive social effects. Given the international dimension to remote gaming, technological advances and convergence of technologies, for example gaming available over mobile phones, and different jurisdictional approaches to its regulation, the report took the view that the appropriate questions to be asked are how can this activity be properly regulated and what will be the consequences of doing so.

On the publication of the report, I said we need to get matters right with our gaming and betting codes. In particular, I want to ensure that betting and gaming activities are carried out within a responsible framework that recognises the reality of these activities, but which ensures they are properly managed, particularly as regards problem gamblers.

Besides the issue of on-line and remote betting and gaming, there are other significant issues associated with gaming, such as the proliferation of private members' clubs offering a casino-style experience. Taken together, I consider the complexity of these issues requires further detailed analysis before the Government is asked to make a formal decision on introducing any significant changes to the regulatory regime in the gaming and betting area.

Additional information not given on the floor of the House.

I therefore published the report with the intention of setting up an informal cross-party committee which is to be asked to examine all aspects of gaming in Ireland, including the issue of Internet gambling. In my answer to Parliamentary Question No. 932 of Wednesday, 24 September last, I set out the terms of reference of the cross-party committee. I believe that the establishment of the informal committee represents the best opportunity for identifying options for consideration by the Government on the many complex inter-related issues in this area. It is an approach that offers the best guarantee that the interests of all elements in our society are taken into account from the beginning in an area of important public policy. I look forward to completing the establishment of the committee now that the House has resumed and to receiving the advice of the committee in due course.

Michael D'Arcy (Wexford, Fine Gael)
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Although the Minister has published a report, when will he tackle Internet gambling? Is the Minister aware of the extent of Internet gambling? As I am a bit younger than the Minister, I know that the number of young men participating in Internet gambling is astonishing. It is being carried out in the privacy of homes and even work. The Minister needs to deal with it.

In 2006 the UK regulated Internet gambling while the US banned it. In the past few months Internet gambling has been advertised on Irish television. The longer the Minister considers what he will do on the matter, the greater influence it will have in the gambling world. When will he regulate or ban Internet gambling?

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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I do not believe I can completely ban Internet gambling because it is an international phenomenon across the Internet. We have not been able to ban pornographic material across the Internet. Try as we might at national, EU and international level, it simply has not been possible. While the Deputy claims the UK and US have taken action, Internet gambling is still going on in those countries. This is an issue we must examine which is why, although this excellent report is available, I have asked all the political parties to participate in this committee to come up with recommendations on an agreed basis. The Government will act on the basis of the report of the committee.

Pat Rabbitte (Dublin South West, Labour)
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Last week, I was in Cork speaking to a conference which happened to coincide with a conference on gambling. I was surprised to learn from participants that the Minister's officials were telling all and sundry that I was responsible for the Minister not introducing legislation. Like the Minister, I have been in the House for a while and I did not appreciate my power. I am sorry I have not exercised it more frequently. I did not know I could hold up the Minister introducing a Bill. I might not agree with such a Bill but I am completely puzzled as to how I am holding up the Minister introducing it. I am surprised the Minister's officials decided to weigh into the political argument.

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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Honestly, I do not know to what the Deputy is referring. I agreed with the approach taken by my predecessor and I published the report shortly after I came into office. In recent days, I wrote to the Chief Whip, Deputy Kenny, the leader of the Labour Party and others to invite them to participate in this committee which I hope in a relatively short space of time will come forward with an agreed view on the issues. Perhaps they will not be able to agree on some of the issues. This is not holding up the legislation.

I accept this is an area where the most recent legislation is from 1956. It behoves the Oireachtas as a group to try to regulate this area where significant changes have occurred for which we have not legislated. To a certain extent, we have tended to veer away from them because they are difficult issues in the context of dealing with gaming, gambling, betting, horse racing and all of the other ways in which betting takes place. We should move on it.

The Garda Síochána is working under old legislation with regard to casino-type operations. To the best of my recollection, it is fair to state that all of the new casino-type places have been visited by gardaí but, as of yet, they have not come across anything which warrants prosecution under the existing legislation. The Deputies will accept that the existing legislation is many years old and we need to introduce new legislation to regulate this area.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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It is unacceptable for the Minister to hide behind the absence of an all-party Dáil committee on this issue. Urgent action is needed. The Minister stated he does not have figures with regard to gambling in Ireland. Will he accept what was stated by Betfair, one of the busiest Internet gambling companies, that Ireland is the third largest market in the world for Internet gambling?

Will the Minister examine what steps he and the Government can take urgently to ensure there is an age barrier on Internet gambling and that persons engaged in this type of activity are not below the age of 18 or 16? It is possible to regulate Internet gambling with regard to age and introduce a barrier blocking mechanism but the Minister has not done so.

Pat Rabbitte (Dublin South West, Labour)
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It is highly unusual for a Minister to state that as an Oireachtas we have failed to do "X" and "Y". We elect a Government which sponsors legislation. For the record, I am in favour of regulating the casino industry and I am opposed to fixed odds betting terminals, FOBTs, going into bookies' shops. I am ready to debate any Bill the Minister wants to introduce. I understand the Minister agrees with me that FOBTs should not be permitted in bookies' shops. If we are agreed, why can we not introduce a Bill?

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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To answer Deputy Flanagan, I am not hiding behind a cross-party committee and in fact some members of Deputy Flanagan's party are exhorting me to get on with establishing the committee. The delay with this committee is due to Labour Party objections on the inclusion of FOBTs which formed part of Deputy Rabbitte's question. However, some of Deputy Flanagan's party colleagues, no later than last night during our late night session, were exhorting me to get on with establishing the committee and I want to do so.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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This is the first time since the Minister took office that he has sought any form of consensus. It does not suit him.

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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It has been the position of Governments of every hue for the past number of decades to shy away from this issue. If my memory serves me correctly, when Deputy Flanagan's party was in government, it tabled proposals in the area and ultimately shied away from it. I may be wrong.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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That was a generation ago. This is a history lesson.

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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With regard to FOBTs, I will bow to the superior knowledge of people such as Deputy Rabbitte on these issues. I see Deputy Rabbitte is participating in a major conference on this issue.

Michael D'Arcy (Wexford, Fine Gael)
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It is still Deputy Rabbitte's fault.

Pat Rabbitte (Dublin South West, Labour)
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I will treat the Minister more generously in his absence than he treated me.

Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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I have declined to do so because as far as I am concerned I will not participate with organisations who want FOBTs issued. I will state publicly that, from what I have heard about FOBTs, I would not countenance them, but they should not be excluded from examination by the cross-party committee just because Deputy Rabbitte says so.

Charles Flanagan (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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The stakes are high if this Minister is looking for consensus.

Pat Rabbitte (Dublin South West, Labour)
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There must be a lot of money in it for somebody.