Joe Carey (Clare, Fine Gael)
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Question 77: To ask the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government his views on the Joint Committee on Climate Change and Energy Security Meeting of 28 February 2008; if emissions trading sector organisations will have no role in the 3% reduction target; if other sectors will have to decrease their emissions beyond 3% to meet Government targets; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [14324/08]

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
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I refer to the reply to Question No. 76 on today's Order Paper.

I was very pleased with the constructive first meeting which I had with the Joint Committee on Climate Change and Energy Security. The committee is a welcome addition to our national parliamentary structure, one which clearly reflects the importance the Oireachtas attaches to the climate change agenda. I look forward to further engagements with the committee on national, EU and wider international aspects of that agenda.

Progress towards achieving the Government's domestic 3% average annual reduction commitment may be measured with reference to net national greenhouse gas emissions. While this includes emissions from installations in the EU emissions trading scheme, the control of emissions within that scheme is primarily a matter for the scheme participants. The trading scheme allows participating installations to emit in excess of their allocation provided they purchase additional allowances in respect of any excess emissions. Alternatively, an installation may choose to reduce its emissions to the level of its allocated allowances. In this regard, the scheme provides the flexibility for installations to meet their obligations in the most cost-effective manner available to them.

I do not want to continue further because it is a repeat of what I said earlier. It is a cut and paste job so rather than wasting the Deputy's time I will allow him to ask a question.

Phil Hogan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fine Gael)
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We were a little confused by the Minister's previous comments on whether the emissions trading sector was included in the 3% target. The Minister has been very frank in stating that it is part of the 3% reduction. That makes a significant difference from the calculations and statements made by the Minister and to the genuineness of his commitment on this matter. We will revert to the matter.

Will the Minister engage with industry in the near future in a more co-operative way in terms of the big companies included in the emissions trading sector in order to make a meaningful contribution to meeting the Government target?

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
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We have already engaged with industry. There was an energy forum in the Shelbourne Hotel, which was very well attended. It was packed out. That shows the level of engagement that is there.

Phil Hogan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fine Gael)
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They could be frightened.

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
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They were far from frightened when they examined the financial incentives that exist. The Taoiseach said to me on the day that they may not be interested in the environment but they were interested in the tax incentives. They were there in droves. I do not care what is motivating people as long as they make a contribution to cutting our greenhouse gas emissions. We will use every opportunity to engage fully with those who are part of the emissions trading scheme and those outside it so that in both sectors we can make a meaningful contribution.

I will be doing part two of the awareness raising campaign on Sunday. The advertisements have already begun and are viewed as a success. We will go beyond that with the new carbon calculator that I will introduce on Sunday.

Joanna Tuffy (Dublin Mid West, Labour)
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Does the Minister not think the 3% target is a con job on people? He set out in his carbon budget that the bulk of our reductions would be achieved by the purchase of carbon credits. We will buy pieces of paper to achieve our carbon reductions. The rest was achieved by forests that already exist. That is what the Minister set out for 2008-12 in his carbon report the day after the budget. The Minister is talking the talk but, in reality, there will be no significant reductions in emissions. If there were, the Minister would establish good public transport as fast as possible. It is all cosmetic but the Minister will have done nothing to reduce carbon emissions.

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
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We will comply fully with our Kyoto Protocol commitments in the period 2008-12.

Joanna Tuffy (Dublin Mid West, Labour)
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By buying carbon credits.

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
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We will go beyond that. The Deputy knows that money was set aside. There is no indication that the €270 million will be used. I am confident we can do so domestically. The Marrakesh Declaration puts an onus on all states to reduce emissions domestically and not to rely on carbon credits. It is an obvious point to make but the Deputy is right in stating that if we are to make decreases we must get away from car dependency and invest in public transport significantly. Many of these changes will be brought about in any event because the price of oil is increasing all the time. The Government and the Opposition parties are in this together. This will affect all parties and individuals, whether in Government or in Opposition; these two issues will affect the country in a deep and dramatic way.

Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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Question 78: To ask the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if, in view of the recent public opinion poll commissioned by his Department to analyse the potential reception of carbon taxes, he is actively pursuing the introduction of carbon taxes with the Minister for Finance; the other measures his Department is taking to pursue the introduction of carbon taxes; the full cost of the opinion poll commissioned by his Department paid to the market research company; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [14368/08]

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
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In the context of taxation policy, the programme for Government committed to establish a new Commission on Taxation. The commission, which was established on 14 February 2008, is tasked in its terms of reference to look at the introduction of measures to further lower carbon emissions and to phase in, on a revenue neutral basis, appropriate fiscal measures including a carbon levy over the lifetime of the Government. In its work, the commission is required to have regard to the commitments on economic competitiveness and on taxation contained in the programme for Government.

The commission has invited my Department to make a submission to assist in its deliberations. I welcome that invitation and my Department will respond within the deadline set by the commission. I believe that the correct course of action is now to develop the carbon levy commitment in the programme for Government through the commission and I will not be pursuing any alternative approaches while the deliberations of the commission are in progress.

The public opinion poll was carried out by the market research company Behaviour and Attitudes as part of the current climate change awareness campaign at a cost of €20,580 exclusive of value added tax.

Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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The Minister states he took the correct approach in this matter. Why was an opinion poll necessary in the first place? Was it insisted on by the major party in Government? Could the Minister not go ahead otherwise? The Minister did not indicate if he intended to introduce carbon taxes. What type of behaviour was identified by spending €20,580? What was the manner and process by which the poll was commissioned and carried out?

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
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I welcome the fact that the company carried out the poll. There was no need to consult other members of Government. I am the Minister responsible. We set out to have an awareness raising campaign and, in order to raise awareness one must measure how quickly and by how much one can raise awareness. A baseline study is needed to find out where we are now. The poll findings were interesting and show that, in principle, 81% of people favoured the introduction of a carbon levy. It was a comprehensive questionnaire, conducted face to face. I gave the details of the poll in my speech in the Mansion House at a seminar organised by the EPA, which was attended by approximately 900 people. They showed that once one got beyond the principle of a carbon levy, when one got into specific items such as increasing the price of petrol by eight cent or whatever, there were slight problems and there was less enthusiasm. When we went into it in further detail we discovered that 50% of people still wanted to see action on the carbon levy. However, one could say there is a 50% element of resistance there as well.

Joanna Tuffy (Dublin Mid West, Labour)
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I was very curious about that survey and I wrote to the Minister's Department a couple of weeks ago for a copy to see what questions were asked, the findings and so on. I find it difficult to believe that 81% of people are in favour of carbon taxes.

Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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Some 81% of the Government is in favour.

Joanna Tuffy (Dublin Mid West, Labour)
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There were recent news reports about rising food costs and that people are struggling with increased petrol costs and so on. Why should people want to pay more for their petrol or gas? I find this incredible. I notice the report stated that people were in favour of tough measures, such as carbon taxes. These are basically tough measures affecting individuals, which will add to inflation and so on. What about tough measures for the Government, such as better public transport? The Government should be faced with tough measures.

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
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The Deputy asks why people will support carbon taxes. Believe it or not, some people are responsible——

Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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Some 80% of the Government support carbon taxes.

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
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——and understand they have a duty, as we all do, to tackle the biggest issue facing humanity. People want responsible action. I can check how many members of the Labour Party, perhaps, or what percentage of its supporters are in favour of these measures. I suspect it is more than the Deputy believes. Too often politicians run for cover when they hear of a carbon levy. If the Deputy talks it up in the way she is doing, she is not doing anyone a service. She is scaring people off. I come back to Deputy McCormack in this regard, there is a definite commitment in the programme for Government to introduce a carbon levy. I sincerely hope members of the Opposition will be as enthusiastic about the introduction of a carbon levy as I am.

Phil Hogan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fine Gael)
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We are aware of the Minister's commitment to a carbon levy. He said during the publication of his carbon budget that he would expect it to be introduced in 2009. What progress has been made and will there be an interim report from the Commission on Taxation before the next budget that will draw on that matter? When will the Minister put a price on carbon, as he promised? Were any other surveys carried out by his Department which were not published and of which we should be aware?

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
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This is the only one I know about so far, but I shall check it out for the Deputy.

Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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They would not tell the Minister about them all.

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
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We shall see whether there are any further surveys. All politicians are interested in surveys to see how the people are thinking, but it is encouraging. The fact that the Green Party's poll ratings are going in the right direction is further evidence that people are interested in acting responsibly in tackling this very important issue. As regards the carbon levy and the deliberations of the Commission on Taxation, I do not know whether it will publish an interim report. I certainly hope it does. It has been tasked with the introduction of a carbon levy and asked to make this a priority, and I hope that happens. I am due to meet Professor Frank Convery in May. He is a member of the commission and I shall ask him in detail what progress has been made. From everyone's viewpoint I hope the carbon levy will be introduced.

Phil Hogan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fine Gael)
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Is Professor Hogan the Minister's man on the commission?