Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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It is proposed to take No. 10a, motion re ministerial rota for parliamentary questions; No. 11, motion re orders of reference of committee; No. 11a, motion re establishment of Joint Committee on Climate Change and Energy Security; No. 11b, motion re establishment of Joint Administration Committee; No. 11c, motion re appointment of members to committees; No. 11d, motion re referral to joint committee of proposed approval by Dáil Éireann of the Regional Fisheries Boards (Postponement of Elections) and Fisheries (Miscellaneous Commercial Licences) (Alteration of Duties) Orders 2007; No. 2, Local Government (Roads Functions) Bill 2007 — Second and Remaining Stages (resumed); and No.17, statements on Transport 21.

It is proposed, notwithstanding anything in Standing Orders, that (1) Nos. 10a, 11, 11a, 11b, 11c and 11d shall be decided without debate; (2) the resumed Second Stage and Remaining Stages of No. 2 shall be taken today and the following arrangements shall apply: the proceedings on the resumed Second Stage shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion at 4.30 p.m.; the proceedings on the Committee and Remaining Stages shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion at 6 p.m. by one question which shall be put from the Chair and which shall, in regard to amendments, include only those set down or accepted by the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government; (3) the following arrangements shall apply in regard to No. 17: (i) the statements of a Minister or Minister of State and of the main spokespersons for the Fine Gael Party, the Labour Party and Sinn Féin, who shall be called upon in that order, shall not exceed 15 minutes in each case; the statements of each other Member called upon shall not exceed ten minutes in each case; Members may share time; a Minister or Minister of State shall be called upon to make a statement in reply which shall not exceed ten minutes; and (4) Private Members' business shall be No. 27, motion re proposed child care subvention scheme (resumed) to conclude at 8.30 p.m.

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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There are three proposals to put to the House. Is the proposal for dealing with Nos. 10a, 11, 11a, 11b, 11c and 11d, motions re ministerial rota for parliamentary questions, orders of reference of committee, establishment of Joint Committee on Climate Change and Energy Security, establishment of Joint Administration Committee, appointment of Members to committee and referral to joint committee of proposed approval by Dáil Éireann of fisheries orders, without debate, agreed to?

Liz McManus (Wicklow, Labour)
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No, a Cheann Comhairle. I object to the taking of 11d, without debate. This relates to fisheries orders, in particular the postponement yet again of elections to the regional fisheries boards. With your indulgence, I wish to make a point. In 2005 the then Minister of State with responsibility for fisheries, Deputy Gallagher, announced he intended to postpone the elections of members to the fisheries boards. In December 2006 the Government announced it would postpone yet again the elections of members to the regional fisheries boards.

It is interesting to note that when this matter was debated by the committee on 13 December 2006 Deputy Eamon Ryan, who was the Green Party spokesperson at the time, described the second postponement as a shocking indictment of the Government's inability to prioritise the environment and wild fish stocks. He actually called it a cowardly act. We are now being asked by Deputy Eamon Ryan, who is now the Minister responsible, to postpone yet again democratic elections to regional fisheries boards. What are we to think about that? Is this an even more shocking indictment of the Government? Is it an even more cowardly act by the new Minister that for the third time we are being asked to postpone democratic elections that should have been held three years ago and will be delayed for another year?

It is important that we debate this issue. It is not good enough, when we consider that wild fish stocks are at risk, that the Government, which pretends to prioritise the environment, is acting in a worse fashion than the previous Government. I believe we should prioritise the environment but it is clear that we cannot depend on the Green Party to prioritise the environment in Government. I feel strongly about this issue. It is an issue of democracy and environmental conservation. I ask that we have a debate on that issue in this Chamber so that we do not participate in what is a charade in terms of ensuring that we deal with issues here and not somewhere down in the bowels of this House in committee.

Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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Perhaps the Deputy does not understand the proposal. The proposal is that it will go to committee and come back here on 5 December. That is precisely what will happen.

Liz McManus (Wicklow, Labour)
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That is my problem.

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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I am sorry. There can only be one intervention.

Liz McManus (Wicklow, Labour)
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Can I ask——

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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No, I am sorry. I must abide by Standing Orders.

Liz McManus (Wicklow, Labour)
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On a point of order, a Cheann Comhairle.

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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There can be only one intervention. That intervention has occurred. The Taoiseach has replied and I will now put the question unless the proposal is agreed.

Liz McManus (Wicklow, Labour)
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I am entitled to make a point of order, a Cheann Comhairle.

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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If it is a point of order.

Liz McManus (Wicklow, Labour)
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It is a point of order. The Taoiseach stated it will go to the committee and then come back to this House. Does he intend to ensure there is a debate in this House or not?

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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That is not a point of order.

Liz McManus (Wicklow, Labour)
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It is a point of order.

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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Is the proposal agreed?

Emmet Stagg (Kildare North, Labour)
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It is not agreed.

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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Is the proposal for dealing with No. 2, Second and Remaining Stages of the Local Government (Roads Functions) Bill 2007, agreed?

Paul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
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This is another guillotine in this Dáil's early days. At last week's meeting of the Whips, we indicated to the Government that we would not accept it.

Emmet Stagg (Kildare North, Labour)
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Guillotines at this stage of the Dáil's life are unusual. They deny the House the opportunity to debate issues fully. There have been 691 guillotines in the history of the House, 307 of which were during the previous Government's lifetime. It is not a fact that guillotines are routine. Their use by this Administration is excessive, accounting for 44% of all guillotines since 1921. We object to what has become the Government's habit of ignoring the House.

Mary O'Rourke (Longford-Westmeath, Fianna Fail)
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Off with his head.

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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Deputy Ó Caoláin without interruption.

Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
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Regarding the Local Government (Roads Functions) Bill 2007, it has become the pattern during the closing days of any session for the Government to force through legislation with a guillotine attachment. It is objectionable at any time, but to see it imposed mid term is outrageous. I am not sure as to whether there is a precedent.

Members are entitled to the opportunity to participate fully in important legislation that reflects on local government and that is being watched carefully by our elected colleagues throughout the State. It is imperative that we do our business properly. The guillotine is unacceptable.

Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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I agree with Deputy Stagg. We go to great lengths to avoid as many guillotines as we possibly can, but I cannot understand what we would discuss about this Bill until 6 o'clock.

Tom Kitt (Dublin South, Fianna Fail)
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Hear, hear.

Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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It relates to the transfer of responsibility for non-national roads and the national vehicle and driver file to the Department of Transport. The only reason——

Tom Hayes (Tipperary South, Fine Gael)
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The Minister, Deputy Dempsey, will make a mess of it. That is the reason.

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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The Deputy is not in order. The Taoiseach without interruption.

Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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The Taoiseach is on his feet. Deputies should have a bit of respect. It is the same racket from over there all of the time.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The Tánaiste is barking away all of the time.

Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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The reason is that advice from the Attorney General's office on the transfer indicated that this provision would normally be done by an order. It would not usually come before the House. However, due to recent cases, the Attorney General has stated that certain provisions relevant to the transfer of functions cannot be included in a transfer order and that we need primary legislation. We will debate until 6 o'clock why something will now be done by statutory Act rather than by an order. The suggestion we would need so much time is ridiculous.

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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Is the proposal agreed?

Emmet Stagg (Kildare North, Labour)
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No.

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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I must put the question.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I wish to raise a matter mentioned in this House several times by Deputy Naughten to do with a report produced in 2001 by the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Health and Children chaired by Deputy Jim O'Keeffe. Deputy Jim O'Keeffe in his report requested that the issues raised in the report be debated in both Houses of the Oireachtas. The report was on the compensation for victims of vaccine damage in the national vaccination programme. Deputy Naughten has raised this several times, but it has not been debated in this House. Victims of vaccination have no bereavement entitlement because they were not in a position to work and therefore had made no PRSI contributions. Could the Taoiseach deal with that, even if he does not have the information now?

In respect of the George Mitchell Scholarship Fund Act 1998 (Amendment) Bill, I note that it is intended to bring in legislation next year to facilitate an increase in Ireland's contribution to the fund over the next five years. While I support that, why is it necessary to introduce legislation to increase the State's contribution when it already contributes? It might be possible to do this by ministerial order and a debate on that.

Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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I will have the first matter investigated and see what was agreed in the report. The George Mitchell Scholarship Fund Act 1998 (Amendment) Bill is to increase the contribution. It has been judged necessary to have primary legislation. In many such issues, like the item we just voted on, because of recent court cases the legal position is that we need primary legislation. The old system whereby we would just have an order is no longer sufficient. We will have a great deal of minor legislation in coming years and if we debate each one we will never get anywhere. We will have a great deal of primary legislation to allow us to perform the function of an order. The order system is no longer considered appropriate by the courts. If there is any deviation we need primary legislation, which makes the system more bureaucratic, lengthy, costly——

Denis Naughten (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Fine Gael)
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It makes it more accountable.

Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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I do not agree, but I am not the courts.

Denis Naughten (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Fine Gael)
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The system does not work. We are not allowed to raise issues with regard to it.

Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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I do not see that an order listed here for 21 days is any better than having primary legislation which takes time and is far more costly.

Denis Naughten (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Fine Gael)
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At least one could debate it.

Joan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
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During the last Government the Taoiseach professed himself many times to be committed to regulating and legislating for management companies and agents of apartment blocks and housing developments. We are in a declining property market where many new housing developments and apartment blocks in west Dublin are subject to management companies. Despite the issue being debated here several times we are no closer to regulating management companies. Many young home owners pay up to €2,500 per year to management companies that give bad service. They charge high rates and do little. The Taoiseach has said this area should be regulated. It is one more constraint on a declining property market.

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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The Deputy must pose a question on legislation.

Joan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
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We have a promise from the Taoiseach.

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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I will have to impose Standing Orders.

Joan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
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The property services regulatory authority legislation is on the list of Bills, but we are getting nowhere with it. What is the Taoiseach's view at this stage? When is his Government going to address this issue? There is no regulation and young people buying homes are at the mercy of rogue developers who will not put management companies on a proper footing.

Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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The Law Reform Commission published a consultation paper on multi-unit developments last December and it drew attention to a broad range of issues relating to the governance and operation of such developments. The issues include the manner in which company law currently applies to property management companies. That paper was very comprehensive and it makes it clear that the action to address these problems will be required across several policy fields. We originally thought we could do it simply through one Act, but that is not the case. The report stated that it would affect company law, consumer protection law and the development of regulatory structures.

Due to the cross-cutting nature of many of the issues identified in the report, I asked that a high level interdepartmental committee be established to assist in the development of a coherent and comprehensive response to the problems. A key task of that committee is to identify the legislative and administrative actions to be taken in response to the definitive recommendations for legislative reforms, and to determine the timeframe for that.

I am asked this question almost every week. I expect that report will be published by the end of the year, and I will then be able to say something else on it.

Joan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
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Does that mean that the property services regulatory authority Bill is effectively on ice until this committee has reported? People are being left inlimbo regarding property management companies. In a declining property market, we could do without people's title to their homes being questioned due to the management company relationship to the ownership of common land in the vicinity of the property. It is a difficult legal issue.

Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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The property services regulatory authority Bill was to provide for the establishment of a property services regulatory authority to give effect to the report of the auctioneering estate agency review group. I have tried to go far further than that and see if we can deal with property management companies in a comprehensive way.

Tommy Broughan (Dublin North East, Labour)
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When?

Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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I have just answered that. Did the Deputy hear what I said?

Tommy Broughan (Dublin North East, Labour)
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The Taoiseach will be out of office.

Ruairi Quinn (Dublin South East, Labour)
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I hesitate to ask the Taoiseach a question because I know he is annoyed at being held to account in this place, but if he is not busy, perhaps he might——

Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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On a point of order, I have given a comprehensive answer to the Deputy's acting leader. I am not entitled to do that under Standing Orders, but I asked the Ceann Comhairle if I could do so. I am only meant to answer questions on legislation during the Order of Business. I was trying to be helpful to Deputy Burton, but having given a comprehensive answer, a Labour Party Deputy ignored what I just said. That is what is irritating.

Tommy Broughan (Dublin North East, Labour)
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People are fed up waiting. It has been going on for years.

Ruairi Quinn (Dublin South East, Labour)
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The student support Bill was promised for this session. Students are ten weeks into term, but many of them have yet to get their grants and are on loans. When will this Bill be published?

Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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I understand it will be published shortly, during this session.

Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
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The current critical crisis in cancer care, especially in mammography, has highlighted once again the inadequate powers of the Health Information and Quality Authority. It has been acknowledged on all sides of the House that the failure to include the private hospital providers within the powers of HIQA is a fundamental weakness——

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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What is the Deputy's question on legislation?

Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
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The question is about the deficiencies in the legislation on HIQA itself——

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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To what promised legislation is the Deputy referring?

Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
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I am referring to legislation that will ensure that HIQA has the required powers to carry out its remit efficiently and effectively across the board, in both the public and private sectors.

Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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It has already been enacted.

Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
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No it has not. There are deficiencies. Surely——

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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The legislation has already been enacted. The Deputy's question is for Question Time and is not in order.

Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
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That attitude achieves absolutely nothing.

Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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Sometime before the last election, the postal services miscellaneous provisions Bill was promised in this House. The European courts made a decision in the last few days which now affects positively the future of An Post and the postal services. Is it the Taoiseach's intention to restore that Bill to the Order Paper? The way has now been cleared for it. We need to ensure that the haphazard closure of post offices and sub-post offices throughout the country does not continue.

Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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The Deputy is correct. That Bill was in the Dáil, but it was dropped when the idea of an ESOP for An Post was dropped.

Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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Has he anything more to add?

Michael Ring (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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There was a joint motion in the Dáil last week. Will the Taoiseach go to America? We need a bilateral agreement for our undocumented Irish. The legislation will be dealt with in the US in November, so will the Taoiseach go there to try to do something about it?

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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This is not in order.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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On a point of order, the House agreed unanimously that it would pursue the concept of a bilateral agreement with the US.

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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It was a Private Members' motion and it was fully debated. Deputy Ring openly contributed to that debate. We cannot debate it now.

Phil Hogan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fine Gael)
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When is it going to be implemented?

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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The motion was amended with the consent of the Government, which had a strong part to play on it. We do not want to divide on this issue. The Taoiseach's imprimatur is critical to the whole business.

John O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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It is not in order now.

James Bannon (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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The Health Information and Quality Authority published its report yesterday, which stated that 51 public hospitals did not receive a top rating of excellence. When can we expect legislation to enforce public hygiene in our hospitals? This is affecting patients right across the country.

Bertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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As I said to Deputy Ó Caoláin, legislation on HIQA, which is responsible for enforcing standards, has already been enacted. A health amendment Bill will be published next year.