Ciarán Cuffe (Dún Laoghaire, Green Party)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Question 7: To ask the Minister for Foreign Affairs his views on instituting inspections of certain flights passing through airports here; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [25210/06]

Noel Treacy (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I refer the Deputy to the statement by the Minister for Foreign Affairs to Dáil Éireann on 13 June, in which he addressed the question of aircraft inspection comprehensively. As was pointed out in his statement, we were the first Government, when rumours of extraordinary rendition emerged, to raise with the US authorities our concerns about the matter. We were also the first Government to demand assurances that our territory would not be used for such purposes.

The Minister was the first to raise this issue among EU colleagues in advance of Secretary of State Rice's visit to Europe during the British Presidency, following which, at the Minister's suggestion, the Presidency wrote to Secretary of State Rice on the matter. To speak of a failure to act, which is the essence of the charge on positive compliance, against such a background of proactive intervention, is not reasonable. As we have also repeatedly made clear, the Garda Síochána has the powers it needs to investigate all allegations of illegal activity. In addition, there is no legal bar to the search of civilian aircraft of the type allegedly involved where there is a basis for doing so.

I also remind Deputies that to engage in the search and inspection of aircraft without any basis for doing so would be to set aside categorical, specific assurances which we, unlike almost every other state in Europe, have received from the US authorities, that in the context of extraordinary rendition, prisoners have not been transferred through Irish territory, nor would they be, without our permission. These assurances have been confirmed by the US Secretary of State, Condoleezza Rice. No other state in Europe, to the best of my knowledge, has this combination of clear, categorical assurances and confirmation from the highest levels of the US Government.

It remains the Government's position, therefore, that our obligations under international law are being fulfilled. I want yet again to stress that if we had reason to believe the US was in breach of its undertakings to us in the matter of extraordinary rendition, we would respond immediately. We are also open to examining, in consultation with partners, any practicable and specific proposals that may be made in consequence of the current Council of Europe and European Parliament processes.

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
Link to this: Individually | In context

In his performance today the Minister of State has shown he is the master of bluster. I will try again to get a straight answer. I did not succeed the last time.

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

It would help if the Deputy were to ask a question.

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
Link to this: Individually | In context

What are the proper arrangements and protocols in place for the notification of an incident of concern at an Irish airport? I refer specifically to Shannon Airport. Will the Minister of State please outline what are those protocols?

The Minister of State appears to be going back on the word given by the senior Minister, Deputy Dermot Ahern. Is the Minister of State aware that the Minister, Deputy Dermot Ahern, told The Guardian on 16 June this year, "Given the fact that an incident like this has happened we would put the [police] on notice that perhaps they should start inspecting on a case-by-case basis"?

Is the Minister of State also aware that on 14 June the Minister stated, the Government "was now going to engage with the US embassy with a view to strengthening the verification procedures and if that entails inspection so be it. We have an open mind in relation to that"? Does the Minister of State still have an open mind?

Noel Treacy (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

My mind is never closed on any situation. We are totally open to ensuring that not alone are the laws of this land adhered to, by all people traversing and transiting our country, but also that international law is taken into account and fully implemented, as is our obligation as members of the European Union, the United Nations, and the IKO convention on aviation transiting our area. We are fully committed to all of those situations and these laws and regulations are in place to deal at any time with suspected criminal activity. We have absolute assurances that this is the position. Extraordinary rendition is not taking place. We accept those assurances until we have evidence to suggest otherwise. There is no other evidence and under no circumstances has there been any extraordinary rendition of prisoners through Ireland at any time. That is the de facto position.

Aengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context

We do not know that.

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
Link to this: Individually | In context

What are the protocols?

Noel Treacy (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The protocols are wide ranging in that the Departments of Foreign Affairs, Justice, Equality and Law Reform and Transport have to be consulted in all of these situations——

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
Link to this: Individually | In context

But they were not.

Noel Treacy (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

——whether it is to do with people in the case of prisoners, goods etc. I have gone through the details already today in reply to other questions. People are using the particular instance involving a soldier to muddy the waters and create an idea that something is amiss and that we, as a sovereign Government, are not maintaining the integrity of our laws and the integrity of international law. We will not allow that to happen. It has not happened and it will not happen.

John Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
Link to this: Individually | In context

It did happen.

Noel Treacy (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

It did not.

Bernard Allen (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

We could have but did not request passenger name records from all US aeroplanes passing through Shannon from the United States.

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Does the Deputy have a question?

Bernard Allen (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

In view of the European Court of Justice ruling on 30 May that deemed invalid the agreement between the European Union and the United States in regard to passenger name records, and given that negotiations will have to commence between the Council of Ministers and the US authorities in regard to this matter, will the Government demand a bilateral agreement on passenger name records? If the United States is demanding passenger name records from our Administration, will we do likewise under any new agreement reached as a result of the failure of the prior agreement?

Noel Treacy (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

It is my understanding that the situation pertaining to international aviation passenger records is currently being considered by the European Union and the United States' authorities in the interest of combating international terrorism.

Bernard Allen (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The question is if we will demand it.

Noel Treacy (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Bilateral discussion are taking place between the EU and US authorities on that matter. We also have an interest in aviation traffic between the United States and Ireland.

Bernard Allen (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I know that.

Noel Treacy (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

During the years international traffic has been of benefit to this country, especially the mid-western region.

Bernard Allen (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Will the Minister of State answer the question?

Noel Treacy (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

In any discussions we are having, or will have——

Bernard Allen (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Will we demand it?

Noel Treacy (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

——on bilateral aviation matters between Ireland and the United States, all of these issues are discussed in the interests of the protection of citizens and all persons transiting internationally and the elimination of international terrorism.

Bernard Allen (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Will we demand it?

Noel Treacy (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

We all have a fundamental responsibility in that area and we will not be found wanting in that regard. We will continue to co-operate in the international effort to ensure terrorism is eliminated.

Bernard Allen (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Minister of State has spoken many words but given no answer. Will we demand a reciprocal arrangement?

Aengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Does the Minister of State deny that aeroplanes involved in the extraordinary rendition programme used Shannon Airport? Will he categorically deny comments attributed to the Minister for Foreign Affairs, Deputy Dermot Ahern, in Ireland on Sunday two weeks ago which stated, if it was up to him, full inspections would have begun a long time ago? He also stated he had argued at Cabinet for the inspections to begin and feels the Americans are making fools of us. Does the Minister of State deny that senior gardaí have confirmed preparations are under way for full, official inspections?

Noel Treacy (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I do not know from which document the Deputy is quoting. I did not see that statement and I do not know its genesis. There has been no extraordinary rendition of prisoners through Ireland.

Aengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Does the Minister of State deny that aeroplanes which went through Shannon Airport were involved?

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Minister of State should be allowed to speak without interruption.

Noel Treacy (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

There will not be. We will not allow it or tolerate it. We have got assurances that it has not happened and it will not happen. We will see to it that this remains the case.

Aengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Does the Minister of State deny that the aeroplanes used Shannon Airport?

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Minister of State should be allowed to speak without interruption.

Aengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context

He is not answering the question.

Michael D Higgins (Galway West, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Does the Minister of State agree that in regard to our international obligations there is no requirement on a citizen to produce evidence? The demand for compliance falls on the State. Is he not concerned that all of those who are interested in the implementation of the UN Convention against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment, the UN committee, the Secretary General of the Council of Europe, the European Parliament, and everyone involved in the campaign against torture, have said that diplomatic assurances are insufficient on this important matter? It is a red herring to suggest the onus is on the citizen. Does the Minister of State agree? In his response to the questionnaire supplied to the Council of Europe he correctly stated the Air Navigation and Transport Act 1988 and the Air Navigation and Transport (Amendment) Act 1998 allowed for inspections. He did not state, however, that not one single inspection resulted. Does he agree that compliance requires inspection and the responsible implementation of the State's obligations? One cannot substitute an unfair obligation on citizens.

Séamus Kirk (Louth, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

We have spent a long time on this question.

Noel Treacy (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I never said the onus was on the citizen in this situation. The onus is on the transiting state to ensure the necessary mechanisms are in position. The Secretary General of the Council of Europe has paid tribute to Ireland for the detail contained in the report we submitted. This is one of the few countries from which the Secretary General did not have to seek supplementary information.

I recently attended a meeting of the Human Rights Council recently in Geneva on behalf of the Minister of State, Deputy Conor Lenihan. The Secretary General commended and complimented Ireland on its standards, commitment to human rights and eliminating international terrorism. There is no doubt about our commitment nor the international recognition of the standards we will continue to uphold.

Michael D Higgins (Galway West, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Therefore, a few inspections would not matter.