Olwyn Enright (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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Question 107: To ask the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if the nitrogen element of the nitrates directive as it applies in Irish law will be reviewed; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [5293/06]

Mary Upton (Dublin South Central, Labour)
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Question 112: To ask the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if he has received or reviewed additional scientific information regarding the provisions of the EU nitrates directive, particularly in relation to nitrate and phosphate levels from agricultural waste; and when he expects to publish the deferred regulations in relation to the EU nitrates directive. [5300/06]

Dick Roche (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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I propose to take Questions Nos. 107 and 112 together.

As indicated in reply to Priority Question No. 105 on today's Order Paper, the regulations which give effect to Ireland's nitrates action programme under the nitrates directive provide for nutrient management planning in line with the environmental requirements of the directive and long-standing guidelines published by Teagasc.

I also said that Teagasc has indicated that it may be possible to review part of its advice on crop nutrient requirements in a way which could improve the effectiveness of the regulations. My Department secured agreement with the European Commission that there is merit in allowing time for this advice to be elaborated. It will have to be a very short period of time because as long as this process goes on, it will delay the negotiations on the derogation. I am sure the Deputy will agree that that is something none of us would wish to consider. To this end, I announced the de facto deferral of Part 3 of the regulations. I and my colleague, the Minister for Agriculture and Food, Deputy Coughlan, jointly made it clear that if revised phosphate tables are brought forward by Teagasc and supported by robust underlying science, the Government would be prepared to make a case to the Commission for revising the current limits. Any formulation, and it is important to be accurate and truthful in this, would have to respect the environmental requirements associated with the nitrates directive. I am not sure what will come out of that further elaboration and I look forward to receiving material from Teagasc.

In regard to nitrogen standards, in agreement with farming representatives and in accordance with Sustaining Progress, Ireland is pursuing the derogation from 170 kg to 250 kg. That is critically important to farmers but, more particularly, it is important to dairy farmers. Deputies will understand the reason that is the case. It is crucial that we do nothing to jeopardise that set of negotiations. I did not make the point to Deputy McCormack but I make it now. Until we appeared to be moving off course yet again on this issue there were signs of much good will from the Commission. I believe that if we get on track with our negotiations and focus on that, we will be able to get the derogation but the exact date will depend on when we finish our work.

Teagasc has not been specifically requested to review its advice on the nitrates issues. However, to the extent that its revised submission on crop nutrient requirements, which is still awaited, suggests any further beneficial adjustments to the regulatory regime, these will be considered. The possibility of such further adjustments will also depend on its meeting the environmental requirements in the directive and also on them being approved by the Commission.

Olwyn Enright (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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Why has Teagasc not been asked to review the advice on the nitrogen rather than the phosphorus element? Has the Minister considered any changes to the nitrogen tables? Teagasc has said it is prepared to review that aspect of the issue. Will the Minister formally ask Teagasc to review that area in addition to the other area he mentioned?

Dick Roche (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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I understand the gentleman from Teagasc, who has been very helpful in recent times, offered the information. I am not standing on ceremony on this issue. I want to do the best for farming but I also want to bring to an end to the nonsense that has gone on in this country about the nitrates directive. The reality is that we have boxed ourselves into a serious corner. We are the last country to sign up to the nitrates directive. We have already lost a case in the European Court of Justice. We face daily fines and interference with the single farm payments and we will not be able to progress the derogation. In those circumstances, it is not rocket science to determine the best way of progressing to service farming.

To be clear, Teagasc proffered some additional advice on the issue of phosphates following the signing of the regulation. It has been invited specifically to do so quickly and in a concerted way. It has been asked to bring robust science to us and if it does all of that, we will be able to take it back to the Commission. I am awaiting material from Teagasc and when I receive it I will deal with it.

Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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I was interested to hear the Minister say that he wanted to do his best for farming. I would understand that comment if it had come from the Minister for Agriculture and Food. If the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government takes that particular role in the matter, who is doing the best for the environment? We are taking about the pollution of water from fertilizer run-off from land and the physical waste from poultry farms, pig farms and so on going into ground water, rivers and lakes. I understand the farming interest and the concerns of agriculture in this matter but if the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government believes his role is to do his best for farming, who is defending the environment? Also, when will the advice Government got from Teagasc be published? Surely it is time it was in the public domain. Teagasc appears to be of the view that the advice it gave the Minister is a State secret.

Dick Roche (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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The material, particularly the tabular statements which are the issue here, comes from published Teagasc material. There is no mystery about it. It is a transposition of advice that is long published. It comes from Teagasc's green book. There has been some modifications in those tables but the modifications have been upwards.

With regard to the comment about who is doing the best for farming, this is a very difficult time for farming. It is important that we apply this directive. I compliment the Deputy for making his points so accurately because there are some people in this House who would ignore them in terms of the dangers to drinking water and water in general, which is the purpose of the directive. That is why I, as Minister, have signed this regulation. It is 13 and a half years late, and a variety of Ministers before me could have done it but did not. The former Minister, Deputy Noel Dempsey, did a huge amount of work on this and almost came to the point where he could have signed off on it. To be frank, if it had been signed off then we would have been in a better position than we are now, and credit should be given to Deputy Noel Dempsey for that.

Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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Why did he not do it?

Dick Roche (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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The Deputies know the reason. At that time there was not the degree of agreement on it.

In this process I have listened carefully to what farmers and my advisers have said about how to protect the environment and reach a balance. I do not want to apply the regulation and finally bring this hiatus to an end in a way that damages farmers, nor would the Deputy or his party wish that either. One has to implement the directive — I have set about doing that — but one has to do it in a way that is conscious of the challenges that raises for farmers.

Denis Naughten (Longford-Roscommon, Fine Gael)
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Is it not the case that due to three separate REP schemes over 15 years and the good farming practice guidelines introduced in 1996 water quality has dramatically improved in that period and we have the best quality ground water and river water in the entire EU and are one of the top 25 in the world? Is it not the case that Dr. Cross said at a meeting of the Joint Committee on the Environment and Local Government last week the nitrogen tables need to be reviewed and that he was prepared to review them if the Minister requested Teagasc to do so? At this late stage will the Minister ask Teagasc to review the tables? Is it not the case that every other country that made an application for a nitrates derogation has had to wait years to have it approved? Does the Minister believe we can succeed in getting it in six months? Is the Minister aware of research in the UK where similar samples were sent to four separate laboratories to analyse the nitrogen content of soil and the variation was between 63 kgs and 133 kgs of nitrogen per hectare? How can the tables be consistent given that type of inconsistency on a scientific level?

Dick Roche (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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I do not want to continue to focus on this issue because it is not helpful — so much has been said by different persons from Teagasc that it is not helpful because we have had different statements from time to time in the recent past——

Denis Naughten (Longford-Roscommon, Fine Gael)
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The Minister promised to be helpful.

Dick Roche (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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I am simply telling the truth and telling it as it is.

Denis Naughten (Longford-Roscommon, Fine Gael)
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Publish the scientific evidence.

Dick Roche (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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I will be absolutely straight with the Deputy.

Denis Naughten (Longford-Roscommon, Fine Gael)
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Will the Minister publish it?

Dick Roche (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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If everybody spoke with a single resolve on this issue it would be far better for farming. The green book from Teagasc, as the Deputy should be aware as he speaks on agriculture, has been published. It has been the standard and that is what is transposed——

Denis Naughten (Longford-Roscommon, Fine Gael)
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Will the Minister publish——

Dick Roche (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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If the Deputy as an agriculture spokesperson for a party that prides itself in this regard——

Denis Naughten (Longford-Roscommon, Fine Gael)
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Will the Minister publish the information presented to him?

Dick Roche (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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——does not know that, God help us. The Deputy's second point relates to one of a series of statements made by Dr. Cross who did say everything in this directive was agronomically sound. The Deputy asked the length of time it would take for a derogation. I was absolutely confident we would be able to obtain this derogation within a rapid timescale until the latest issue arose. I will have to take whatever science comes from Teagasc on this issue. If there is any equivocation about it, it will not be helpful to farming. I hope the temporary suspension of Part 3 will be a matter of weeks not months. If Teagasc can produce robust science we will go back to the Commission and deal with it at that stage. I am not prepared to tolerate undue delays which will put the derogation under threat. The Deputy, as a spokesperson on agriculture, will agree that particularly on the nitrates side the number one priority must be to get the derogation increased from 170 kg to 250 kg, because otherwise one would be arguing a case for damaging a huge number of farmers, particularly in dairying.

Denis Naughten (Longford-Roscommon, Fine Gael)
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Is it not the case that water quality has improved?

Dick Roche (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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The Deputy is correct. Water quality in this country has improved dramatically. It is also a fact that the highest preponderance of phosphate and nitrate contamination comes from agriculture.

Denis Naughten (Longford-Roscommon, Fine Gael)
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Without the nitrates directive——

Dick Roche (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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That was the point to which Deputy Gilmore adverted. The Deputy is correct that farming alone should not be blamed for contamination of water. There have been other sources but there has been a huge amount of investment in addressing those other sources and we need to deal with the last outstanding source.

Denis Naughten (Longford-Roscommon, Fine Gael)
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In the context of water quality in the EU.