Barry Ward (Dún Laoghaire, Fine Gael)

I welcome the opportunity to contribute to this debate. I also welcome the establishment of the commission by the Minister last week. It is appropriate but, at this juncture, it is worth looking back at how it came about.

Reference has been made to those survivors who brought it about through their courage. Let us never underestimate the courage and determination it would have required for the victims who came forward in the "Blackrock Boys" episode of "Documentary on One" and all the people who came after them, encouraged by their bravery. They came forth, engaged with the scoping inquiry and told their stories so we got some idea of the enormous scope of this problem, how many were affected and suffered over many decades as a result of sexual abuse in schools.

It is important to welcome the fact that the Minister took on board the recommendations of the scoping inquiry and has now enveloped those non-religious schools or those other schools that were outside the scope of the inquiry. They need to be part of it as well. That the Minister took those recommendations on board is positive. The only negative is that it potentially exposes the State to greater financial liability in terms of the damage that was done to people. I do not have a problem with that. In fact, I think it is our responsibility as a State to stand up and be counted in respect of what happened and to accept responsibility for it.

What is most important for those people who were abused within State or religious institutions, in religious schools or by religious orders, is that when it comes to paying the bill, they deserve financial compensation, and I agree with that, but that compensation is not there in any way to put them back to where they were. It cannot do that. It is, however, an incredibly important marker of the importance and extent of the damage done to them. One of the things we, as a society, recognise, whether we like it or not, is that when we put down financial compensation, it reflects the seriousness of a matter. That happens in our courts all the time. If we are not willing to back up inquiries, commissions, scoping exercises and all the rest with actual resources to acknowledge the harm done, it is all for nothing. Those things come together.

When we look back at the history of the State, these appalling acts are not new to us. We knew they happened in other institutions. More have been exposed in recent years and we have seen another sad face of Ireland. When that happens, if an institution has responsibility or liability in that regard, we must be absolutely sure it cannot avoid it. We cannot have a repeat of what happened 23 years ago when religious institutions essentially were let out the door with a limited liability. I am thinking of my own constituency and the Edmund Rice Schools Trust, which runs the Christian Brothers' Clonkeen College. That school is just down the road from where I grew up. That body has frustrated the handing over of money to the Department of Education to cover compensation. It has done so in a way that has further compounded the damage it did to children. The current students of Clonkeen College are denied playing pitches next to the school because that body has, in an effort to leverage the Department of Education, cut off the pitches next to the school and tried to barter with the Department on its financial liability. That can never be allowed to happen. It is compounding the damage done in the past by individuals who were members of orders. We now have a situation whereby that damage carries on to the current generation of children. Boys in Clonkeen College cannot use pitches next door to their school. They are denied a resource that should be available to them.

When it comes to being answerable for these things, the State has ultimate liability and must put together a scheme to compensate those people. The Minister was right when she said that work could continue in parallel with the work of the commission. I look forward to what Mr. Justice Michael MacGrath is going to do. He is a judge of impeccable credentials and I know he will bring an independence of thought to this that will be very welcome. While he is doing his work, there is no reason we cannot be progressing work on a redress scheme. Most importantly, if there are other bodies from which moneys can be recovered, punitively, in terms of recognition or whatever else it might be, as much to recognise the damage done as to save the taxpayer money, we need to ensure there is no loophole to allow those institutions to get out of it. We must ensure there is no alternative avenue for bodies that are responsible for terrible abuses - crimes, in no uncertain terms - for them to evade paying dues that would otherwise be covered by the Irish taxpayer. That must be absolutely clear and certain when redress schemes come. There can be no letting institutions off the hook, as happened in the past in a disgraceful way.

When we look at this broad spectrum of issues, we, as a country, must first and foremost acknowledge that we have failed those children who were abused, those individuals who were the victims of sexual assault, violence and abuse. Crimes were committed against them and we must acknowledge that we failed them because the systems to protect them were not in place at the time. We like to think they are now, but they can always be improved. We can always do more to protect our children. We have acknowledged that in retrospect.

I recently spoke at an event for the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe, OSCE, and criticised another country's record in respect of a particular human rights issue. We in Ireland, despite the fact that we hold ourselves out as a reasonable country that respects the rule of law, is progressive and all those kinds of things, must also now acknowledge our human rights abuses in the past. This is part of it. We cannot stand on the international stage, criticise other countries and say they are not doing enough, that they should not do this or that, without also saying that we are not perfect. We have made gross mistakes in the past that have damaged families, households, children, adults, children who became adults, and all the other individuals involved. We must acknowledge that. The acknowledgment of that is not just about words but must also include compensation. It must be a tangible mark of the damage that was done and the fact that we as a State and nation accept responsibility for our part in failing to protect those children and to deal with those issues in a timely manner. This has been going on far too long.

Just this morning I went with my daughter to what will be her first school to meet the teachers. We entrust our children to those custodians, educators and teachers. We expect our children to be protected. We expect them to be safe. As parents, we hope and expect that. As a State and country, we have an obligation to ensure that is not just an idle hope and expectation but is backed up by proper regulation and protection. We hope that will be the case. As we look to the future, the way we ensure that these horrible things are not discussed in this Chamber in 20, 30, 40 or 100 years' time is to ensure those protections are in place to protect children. They should have been protected a generation or two generations ago and we must ensure children are protected into the future. All of that is the responsibility of the people who occupy this Chamber and the Government. It is an awesome responsibility, but is not beyond delivery. We can do it, but it comes with a package of measures that includes acknowledgement, compensation and future protection.

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