Barry Ward (Dún Laoghaire, Fine Gael)

-----he believes people should be able to say whatever they want, as is the case in America. He believes people can say whatever they want and it does not matter if they do down someone's good name or incite hatred against them. What an absolute nonsense stance to take. He should be responsible and recognise that no right in our Constitution or any other international instrument we are part of is absolute. Every right comes with a responsibility. While people have free speech, they cannot use that right to do down a group because they have particular characteristics. That was what that law was about. He is quite right that it did not pass in full. It certainly did not pass to the extent I wanted to pass in the previous Oireachtas. I welcome that the Taoiseach has said the Government will work to reintroduce such legislation. As the Deputy has said, we are outside the norms of the European Union because other European Union states actually have the courage to stand up and say they want to protect people who are being put down by people who think that they can use their characteristics to operate against them. That is what that is about. Let us not misrepresent what is actually there.

Let us also recognise that when we look at the progress of European legislation, workers in this country are better off, safer and have better conditions because of European law. We did not tell the European Union to "get stuffed" on that stuff either. The reality is we have benefited time after time from the European Union. By the way, we cannot speak about it as if we are not part of it because our Ministers sit at the European Council table. We have a Commissioner at the Commission table. We are part of that decision-making process. We have benefited from the fact that collectively as the European Union, we have handed down legislation in this country that means we have good health and safety, good employment rights and good employment benefits.

Therefore, if we tell the European Union to go and get stuffed, we are telling ourselves to go and get stuffed because we sit around the table in Brussels as much as any other country. The big change for us in joining the European Union in 1973 was that we went from being in the shadow of a former colonial power to being an equal party at the table. Perhaps the most significant thing when we talk about the European Council statements is that our leader sat at that table, equal to the German Chancellor and equal to the leaders of France, Spain and Italy, which are much bigger countries by population and economy but we have an equal place. When the Deputy says, "Go and get stuffed", he is telling our country to go and get stuffed. He should have a little bit of sense and decorum in relation to what we are actually trying to do with that legislation.

What I actually wanted to talk about are the items on the agenda referring to European enlargement, which is hugely important. It is something that has stalled to a large extent. I have raised this issue on a couple of occasions and I do not do so in any way to undermine the process of enlargement and the process by which countries must meet the Copenhagen criteria before they become members of the European Union. I also do not say it with a view to saying that countries should not have the right to veto a new member, but I do not think any member state should have the right to veto the process through which another country goes to apply for membership and to start the process of joining.

These are issues I have raised at COSAC, which is the European committee where the chairs of the European Union affairs committees of each member state come together twice during each Presidency. I spoke on this in Warsaw last month and in Copenhagen last week. These are important issues. We know that European enlargement is better for the European Union. We are better if we are bigger and have more members. As a bloc, we are much stronger. We know that the countries coming into the European Union are better off when they are inside the European Union because they sign up to adherence to the rule of law and the other instruments that form part of the Copenhagen criteria which make the citizens of those countries better off. If enlargement of European Union is better for those of us who are in and better for those who are coming in, let us make sure it progresses because it feels very much like it has stalled at the moment.

Regarding Moldova, I acknowledge that there was a bilateral summit between Moldova and the European Union, the first such summit, which is very welcome. Moldova is wedged on the edge of Europe and on the edge of Ukraine and is in a very vulnerable position.

The ambassador here, Ms Jana Costachi, will have spoken to many Deputies in this House, I am sure. She is constantly talking to people here about that membership process. Moldova is not alone in that regard. There are countries like Serbia, for example, that are probably further away from being ready for membership. Georgia unfortunately has taken a turn in the opposite direction through the dominance of Georgian Dream in Georgian internal politics. The approach to opposition politicians in Georgia is deeply regrettable and sinister and is something the EU needs to keep an eye on and address. However, I do not think it reflects the attitude of Georgian people, the population of Georgia who have for a long time been progressing towards EU membership but have now been set back by that. Türkiye also has a number of issues that it has to address before it will be ready to meet the Copenhagen criteria. North Macedonia, on the other hand, has taken huge steps forward. It changed its name and flag after it ceased to be known as a former Yugoslav republic. It is now being asked by the EU to make constitutional changes as well. This week I met with the Bulgarian ambassador to Ireland who has specifically spoken about the Bulgarian minority in North Macedonia. That needs to be respected too but the danger with countries like North Macedonia and, indeed, Montenegro, which is probably the readiest of the accession countries, is that if they do not see progress down the road of membership then the people who are opposed to EU membership within those countries will start to point to the EU and say, "Look, we told you. They do not really want us as members. They just want us to keep jumping through hoops and every time we jump through the next hoop, they will produce another one.". That is not what is happening but there is a danger that we allow that to be the narrative within those countries.

Let us recognise the readiness of countries like North Macedonia and Montenegro, the progress made by countries like Albania, and the distance still to be travelled by Bosnia-Herzegovina. Let us recognise the work they are doing. At a European level let us say that we want to welcome these countries in, we want to make progress down that road, to help them to reach the Copenhagen criteria and when they have done that, to make them full members of the EU on an equal footing with Ireland, Germany and all of the other countries that have signed up to those common ideals that are so valuable to us in Ireland.

Somehow, in this Chamber, we still have a few Deputies who will do them down for the sake of scoring their own political points. That is not the way to do it and it is far too easy to say that it is Europe's fault. We are Europe. We make those decisions as well. Let us stand by them and recognise the value they have for the people we represent in this Chamber.

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