Neale Richmond (Dublin Rathdown, Fine Gael)

I really appreciate the opportunity to contribute to this debate. I can confirm the Government is of course not opposing this motion. From my time in this Chamber and before that in the Upper Chamber, I know we all share a long-standing desire to deepen the connections between Ireland and the global Irish, but especially on this island. I know there are very few of us in the Chamber who have not been touched by emigration.

I am going to use the ten minutes available to me to do three things, if that is okay with the Opposition. There will then be other speakers and my colleague the Minister of State, Deputy Higgins, will conclude the debate. First, I will lay out a little of the work we are doing for the Irish abroad, because that is important to the House. Second, I would like to address the specific proposal here. Third, I will reply to a few of the points or questions, should the time allow for it.

One of the great privileges I have in my role as Minister of State with responsibility for the diaspora is the ability to travel and meet quite a number of our Irish abroad, as Deputy O’Reilly alluded to. It must be said Irish people emigrate for many reasons. Some indeed do so out of economic and housing necessity and the prospect of a better life, but many also wish to work or study abroad and experience life in another culture, which is what our friends in New Zealand call the overseas experience. We regularly hear the trope that everyone is leaving to go to Australia because of housing, but then you realise that rents and house prices are higher there, the waiting times greater and the cost much greater. It is important to provide actualities beyond rhetoric. Moreover, many of those who have moved abroad have had an extremely positive experience. I am always delighted to see the positive contributions our diaspora have made to their new communities, but there are also those who have not been so fortunate and we owe a real duty of care to those who are among the most marginalised and vulnerable. Our diaspora are not an homogenous group, nor is the experience of living abroad a linear one. There are many decisions involved in deciding to live abroad, whether you are getting ready to leave or just arriving in your new home, have settled for the long term or are thinking about returning home.

As the Minister of State responsible, I want to ensure the Government has supports in place to assist our diaspora no matter what stage someone is at on their journey. Essential to this work is the emigrant support programme. Since it began in 2004, the programme has granted over €250 million to over 900 organisations in 51 countries and the budget for this year will again be almost €16.5 million. It is also important for me to make a brief reference to the changes in US immigration policy and the impact those are having on Irish communities there. Through the emigrant support programme and our missions in the US, we work with communities and the Coalition of Irish Immigration Centers to provide advice and assistance to those affected. In the past few months, I have had the opportunity to see the community care pillar of the programme in action in Coventry, Birmingham, Manchester, Warrington, Boston, Philadelphia and Pittsburgh. I am sure many of the Deputies opposite will join me in paying tribute to our diplomats and colleagues who implement so many services in those sectors, which are so important to our Irish abroad.

The programme for Government makes a specific commitment to facilitate emigrants looking to return home. An area I am focused on is making it easier to exchange driving licences, which Deputy Guirke has been very outspoken on. I really welcome his contributions and hope we can continue to work together on this. Already the Government has been able to secure agreements with all the Australian states and seven Canadian provinces. I will work with every Deputy, but especially the Minister for Transport, as well as the Road Safety Authority, to ensure we secure that, much like when I was in a previous brief and we were able to launch a new company specifically offering motor insurance to those who have returned from abroad.

The new programme for Government also commits to delivering a new diaspora strategy. I am in the middle of doing the consultations for this. I have had seven in-person strategy meetings so far and there will be a meeting for Oireachtas Members tomorrow morning in Iveagh House. I look forward to seeing real, fruitful engagement.

I will respond to some of the specific points. I will not get to all of them but I will try my best. There was a mention from one Deputy - I think it was Deputy Crowe - of the notion in 2011 of reserving Seanad seats for the diaspora.

That was followed up by the appointment to the Seanad of the late, great Billy Lawless, who I had the distinct honour to serve with along with then Senator Mac Lochlainn. He was a great voice for the Irish in America. Deputy Kenny spoke about international comparisons, and I will go into that because it is really important. We are talking today about votes for President. Votes for President is a straightforward proposal, for the Irish in this jurisdiction and across the island and for Irish citizens living abroad. However, when we start making comparisons with Brazil, Poland, France or Italy, it is important to keep it straight because those are jurisdictions that allow votes for those abroad for specific houses in parliament, or in the case of the United States, for taxpayers living abroad. This is where we will get into somewhere we have to provide clarity when talking about comparisons.

Deputies Mitchell and O'Hara also mentioned, parallel to this, the case for a united Ireland. Deputy McDonald and I have shared a couple of stages talking about this. I know she read the paper I wrote called "Towards a New Ireland". I am more than happy to join anyone of any party, and their supporters, to make sure we can achieve that. That has not changed in any instance. That is something on which we can hopefully all rise together and, in Deputy O'Reilly's words, work together on.

On the specific point, the Government has always recognised the commitment in the Good Friday Agreement that allows all the people of Northern Ireland to identify as Irish or British or both. I was pleased to see that not only was the issue of voting rights in presidential elections debated recently in the Northern Ireland Assembly but that a vote in the positive was passed. I support that. We have also been supportive of the work previously undertaken by the Convention on the Constitution, but we must be frank that the matter is not without challenges, even if these challenges are easily overcome. Operationally, a number of practical implementation issues will have to be addressed, including the establishment of online-based voter registration and the extension of postal voting. That is straightforward and there is no doubt we can do it in the modern age.

However, there is something I have a real fear about, and it is not in any way to diminish the commitment. In order to achieve this, it does not really matter what any of us says in this Chamber this evening or what the vote is on a motion that is not being opposed by the Government. It will require constitutional change. What is as important as having the discussion is that we do not underestimate the challenge constitutional change brings. One charge often raised in this debate is that we do not favour an extended electorate because we do not like the result it would deliver. I firmly believe, as I am sure all Deputies do, that approaching the matter with such a mindset would be undemocratic. I said this in the Seanad eight years ago in response to a similar Sinn Féin motion. I think it was the then Senator Ó Donnghaile who looked me square in the eyes and tell me to tell him what I thought. I have no hesitation saying, like my predecessor Ciarán Cannon, who was in ministerial chair in the Seanad, that I fundamentally believe in expanding the presidential franchise to all Irish citizens, regardless of where they live on this island or around the world, but we have to win that debate. This is the challenge before us this evening. How do we win that debate? To be frank, we have had two referendums in the past 12 to 14 months that most people in this Chamber backed, and we got a fair kicking on them. I am not looking to point fingers at any Deputy. I am just providing reflection.

This referendum was proposed in 2019 and then Covid hit. We have to be cognisant of what winning this referendum will require, as with a further referendum in due course that I look forward to campaign alongside Deputy O'Hara and others in. We have to be cognisant of what the electorate will be putting at us in the debate. I absolutely agree with the point Deputy Mitchell made about commentators and others in the media and possibly in these Houses who deliberately pursued a disinformation campaign about what Sinn Féin is trying to achieve with this motion and what the Government is trying to achieve with this policy, going back to the diaspora strategy launched by the then Minister of State, Ciarán Cannon. This is something that requires thoughtful and considered debate, and I am absolutely committed to working with every Member of this House to further this so that we can name a date for referendum.

Deputy McDonald asked me what conversations have been had with the Taoiseach and Tánaiste. I am not privy to the exact nature, as she will understand, but I know that conversation is ongoing, and there is a commitment at Cabinet level, as the Tánaiste has alluded to, to make sure this can be reflected on by Government so that we can put a question to the people. I hope people will agree, and take this at face value, that first and foremost it must be a question we could win, because we can all stand here and use this as an issue to bring up whatever we want. Deputy Kenny knows that I know the Border as well as anyone, as the proud son of a Cavan woman and a Cavan man. However, I want to win this debate. I want to win this debate because it is the right thing to do. We absolutely can win it, but much like a question on unification it is not simply about naming the date. It is about formulating a campaign. It is about presenting a very clear question to the people that will show what happens if they vote for this. It will show how people will be facilitated to vote and how we will capture the citizens abroad. I say to Deputy McDonald, trying to be collegiate and work in a positive agreement on this, that this is how we can work together to get this delivered. We are not opposing this motion and we are committing tonight to work with all Members of this House, of all parties and none, to deliver this.

See this speech in context