Aengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)

I dtús báire, gabhaim buíochas le mo chomhghleacaí, an Teachta Joanna Byrne, as an mBille seo agamsa a chur chun cinn. Is í a shínigh é agus atá ag tógáil ceisteanna chun tosaigh maidir leis na meáin chumarsáide thar cheann an pháirtí.

The Committee of Public Accounts stated it believed "decisions taken by RTÉ demonstrate a lack of rigorous financial controls, poor communication, little transparency and amount to a failure of governance which combined have damaged public trust in an organisation for which trust should be paramount." Some of that statement was reflected by the Minister earlier. The statement was made by the Committee of Public Accounts following its investigation into RTÉ which exposed the use of a secret barter account outside its regular financial control; the understatement of published earnings and underwriting of additional payments to presenters: scandal surrounding obscene salaries, allowances, junkets, resignations, exit packages, the use of contractors and bogus self-employment; significant financial losses; and a lack of scrutiny revolving around the shambles that was Toy Show The Musical.

Everyone in the Government was wringing their hands over these scandals but my colleagues in Sinn Féin and I got to work straight away, submitting the Broadcasting (Oversight of RTÉ Accounts) (Amendment) Bill to the Bills Office way back in July 2023, almost two years ago. If all that waste of money was not bad enough, things got worse. In the two years since, the Government has not produced its own legislation. RTÉ's director general, Kevin Bakhurst, is reported as telling people in private as far back as February of last year that the broadcaster would be bankrupt overnight if it fully compensated wronged workers for their bogus self-employment. This is a serious and incredible assertion that was not made known during the reviews, committee hearings and investigations at the time.

Only this month, we have learned about the €3.6 million write-off of a failed IT scheme which aimed to deliver a new HR system for RTÉ. This multimillion euro waste was not made known during the reviews or committee investigations either. In fact, RTÉ told the expert advisory committee review into contractors' fees, HR and other matters that a modern and fit-for-purpose HR system would begin to be rolled out from 2024. The board had already discussed the failed HR system in 2023. We now know that RTÉ did not ultimately proceed with the HR modules. I do not know whether RTÉ lied to the review. What else has been hidden?

In the midst of all this cloak and dagger stuff, these smokescreens and drip-feeding of information, there was no indication that the culture at RTÉ had changed. The Government then agreed to use €725 million of taxpayers' money to bail out RTÉ. The least the public could expect from us is that we would regulate for independent oversight of how that money is being spent and how money was spent in the past. The Comptroller and Auditor General's mission is "to provide independent assurance that public funds and resources are used in accordance with the law, managed to good effect and properly accounted for". The Comptroller and Auditor General used to have this role in respect of RTÉ but the former Fianna Fáil Minister, Ray Burke, who was convicted of tax fraud, removed that oversight power with the Broadcasting Act 1990, leaving RTÉ free to arrange its own auditing through private contractors, who have consistently failed to spot the unjustifiable waste of public moneys. Ahead of the changes he made through the Broadcasting Act, Ray Burke is reported to have said "I'm going to fucking screw RTÉ". That was at a time when he felt aggrieved by RTÉ election coverage as it related to him. This shows why politicians should not have control over the funding of a national broadcaster. He continued on and RTÉ was screwed over but the Act also forced habits to form within RTÉ that were probably reflected in recent years because of a cap on the funding that could be raised through advertising. When RTÉ breached that advertising cap, it put the money into an escrow account, hiding it away from the Minister of the time. I believe this led to people setting about some of the scandals we have seen since.

This Bill aims to correct all that by making it so that RTÉ is not in charge of its own auditing. Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael have opposed the Bill. We know that from today. The then Minister for public expenditure, Deputy Donohoe, said in 2024 that the Comptroller and Auditor General should not have power to audit RTÉ. We introduced this Bill on First Stage. The Committee of Public Accounts recommended on a cross-party basis that RTÉ should come under the remit of the Comptroller and Auditor General. The chairperson of the RTÉ board, Siún Ní Raghallaigh, also recommended that RTÉ be audited by the Comptroller and Auditor General before she was effectively and unceremoniously sacked on live television by the Minister for media during the term of the previous Dáil, Catherine Martin. The expert advisory committee review into governance and culture at RTÉ then recommended that RTÉ should come under the remit of the Comptroller and Auditor General. The Minister for media, Catherine Martin, then announced that RTÉ would come under the remit of the Comptroller and Auditor General. With all of this flip-flopping, the Government must have got some free flip-flops from RTÉ.

Two weeks ago, the new Minister, Deputy O'Donovan, who was here earlier, said in respect of this legislation "We have beaten the Deputy to it because RTÉ has been put under the remit of the Comptroller and Auditor General". He obviously did not understand that producing the heads of a Bill is not the same thing as enacting law. I do not know whether he meant to mislead or if he just does not understand how this works. The Government's excuse is that there is no point in passing this Bill because the Bill whose general scheme has been produced will achieve the same objective and go further. As others have mentioned, this general scheme is 93 pages long. I have read it. I dealt with it yesterday. I thank the officials who came before the committee yesterday to explain some of the details. It is quite wide-ranging.

I do not expect it to be passed as quickly as the Minister seems to think it will be. It has already taken six months to get to this point because it is so wide-ranging. This is the second general scheme and we do not know whether there will be a third. The committee has been given an extension of time up to the first week in September to scrutinise the general scheme. The Minister seems to be indicating that the committee should have all the time in the world. Although we do not want to act according to the timetable he has set out, we would like an additional fortnight to get through the work and to liaise and consult those who will be affected by the general scheme. That is an ask of the Minister. Even that would delay the production of the legislation until October. That does not include passage on Second, Third, Fourth and Fifth Stages in this Chamber and in the Seanad. Deputy Byrne mentioned earlier that this could be a long time coming and that RTÉ would not fall under the remit of the Comptroller and Auditor General for a number of years. That is a possibility. I looked over at the Minister when Deputy Byrne said that and he smirked, but it is a possibility. That is what happens when you have an omnibus Bill - timetables move.

We want to make sure that, come next year, RTÉ will be under the remit of the Comptroller and Auditor General. The other points the Government has flagged in its general scheme are welcome. We do not oppose those changes. We are saying we should pass this simple legislation to make sure that, from its enactment, RTÉ will come under the remit of the Comptroller and Auditor General. This Bill, as presented, is simple and we should pass it as quickly as possible. As I have said, we can address this in a simple way and quickly.

Faoin mBille seo, beidh na rialacha céanna i gceist do RTÉ agus atá ann cheana féin do TG4. D'fhéadfadh RTÉ a lán rudaí a fhoghlaim ó TG4, a dhéanann cláir d'ardchaighdeán a chraoladh go rialta in ainneoin nach bhfuil ach pinginí caite ina threo i gcomparáid le RTÉ agus in ainneoin go ndéanann sé ár dteanga náisiúnta mionlaigh a chur chun tosaigh i gcónaí. Ní raibh aon fhadhb riamh ag TG4 i dtaobh airgeadais toisc go dtagann sé faoin Comptroller and Auditor General cheana féin. Bhí an tuiscint sin ann nuair a bunaíodh é ag an tús. Tá gá leis an reachtaíocht seo a reáchtáil chomh tapa agus is féidir chun a dhéanamh cinnte de go bhfuil na fadhbanna atá ann faoi láthair, agus a bheidh ann amach anseo mura tarlaíonn sé seo go tapa, leigheasta. Tá an deis ag an Rialtas bogadh de réir seo agus an leasú atá aige a tharraingt siar ag an staid seo.

See this speech in context