Patrick O'Donovan (Limerick County, Fine Gael)

I move amendment No. 1:

To delete all words after "That" and substitute the following:

"Dáil Éireann declines to give a second reading to the Broadcasting (Oversight of RTÉ Accounts) (Amendment) Bill 2024, on the grounds that a general scheme achieving the same policy objective has been referred to the relevant Oireachtas Committee for pre-legislative scrutiny.".

Cuirim fáilte roimh an deis seo labhairt le Dáil Éireann ar an mBille seo. I dtosach báire ba mhaith liom aitheantas a thabhairt don méid oibre atá déanta ag an Teachta Ó Snodaigh ar an mBille. I acknowledge the work of Deputy Ó Snodaigh in preparing this Bill and of Deputy Byrne in proposing it today.

The reassignment of the Comptroller and Auditor General as auditor of RTÉ is something that has broad support across the House. It was one of the key recommendations made in the review of governance and culture in RTÉ prepared by the expert advisory committee chaired by Professor Niamh Brennan. In May last year, the Government decided to accept in principle all of the recommendations of that review. In October last year, the general scheme of the broadcasting (amendment) Bill was published so it is not the case that nothing was done. The general scheme gives effect to all of the legislative recommendations of the expert advisory committee, including the assignment of the Comptroller and Auditor General as auditor of RTÉ.

The programme for Government commits to enacting new legislation to ensure that the corporate governance model in RTÉ is open, transparent and appropriate to its public service mandate. In line with this commitment, last month, the Government approved the publication of a revised general scheme, which retains the totality of the initial general scheme while also providing for additional measures to ensure that the responsibilities of RTÉ as a public service media provider reflect the level of public funding provided to it. The general scheme represents the most comprehensive set of reforms to the governance and regulation of public service media since the Broadcasting Act 2009. It will enhance accountability, transparency and value for money not just in RTÉ but also in TG4, as our public service media providers, and establish a new statutory framework to support the provision of public service content by the wider media sector.

The assignment of the Comptroller and Auditor General is a key, but not the only, provision in reforming the legislative underpinning for corporate governance in RTÉ. In line with the recommendations of the expert advisory committee on governance and culture, the general scheme also strengthens the functions and duties of the boards of both RTÉ and TG4 and expands the functions, duties and accountability of both directors general. In particular, the boards of both public service media providers will be required to hold their respective directors general to account for their management of the organisations. This reflects the recommendations and findings of the expert committee on governance and culture in respect of the relationship between the board and executive in the lead-up to the payments scandal.

Earlier this month, I referred the general scheme for pre-legislative scrutiny to the Oireachtas committee with responsibility for media policy.

I understand that the matter was considered at the first meeting of the Oireachtas committee on 14 May and that officials from my Department briefed the committee yesterday on the general scheme. It will be entirely at the discretion of the committee to decide how long it spends on that. If there is any great sense of urgency, there is no reason it should take two years. It is entirely in the hands of the committee to deal with this. The committee can sit as many times a week as it wants. If it wants to discuss any issue, however many meetings it wants to hold, there will be no hindrance. It is unfair to my officials to suggest my Department will somehow hamper other investigations. That is not the case, as was spelled out to the committee yesterday.

Given that the general scheme, including the provisions relating to the Comptroller and Auditor General, is currently before the Oireachtas committee, I propose that this Private Members' Bill be declined a Second Reading by the House. I do not see the merit in bringing forward separate elements of the reforms contained in the general scheme in stand-alone Bills. Were this Private Members' Bill to pass Second Stage, it would be referred to the same Oireachtas committee now considering the general scheme for scrutiny before it could progress to Committee Stage. This would appear to be duplicative in the extreme.

There are two substantive differences between the Bill being considered today and the general scheme undergoing pre-legislative scrutiny. First, the Bill does not provide for the accountability of the director general of RTÉ to the Committee of Public Accounts for RTE’s accounts, value-for-money matters or any other matters that may be addressed in a special report prepared by the Comptroller and Auditor General. This is a standard but nonetheless necessary provision in legislation governing State bodies, as it identifies the officer in the body accountable to the Committee of Public Accounts and the nature of that accountability.

The general scheme also provides expressly for the accountability of the directors general of both RTÉ and TG4 to the Committee of Public Accounts. In doing so, it is extending that accountability to the director general of RTÉ and expanding the current provisions relating to the accountability of the director general of TG4.

Let us recall that the Committee of Public Accounts required a specific motion of Dáil Éireann in July 2023 to enable it to examine the presenter payment issues and related governance failings that arose in RTÉ. It is absolutely necessary that the director general of RTÉ be directly accountable to the Committee of Public Accounts. That is not part of the Deputy's Bill, however. While an audit by the Comptroller and Auditor General has significant teeth, accountability to the Committee of Public Accounts adds a further level of transparency and ensures that the people's elected representatives can scrutinise the chief executive officers of public bodies which are, after all, ultimately owned by the people.

The second substantive difference between the general scheme and this Bill is that the Bill will remove the discretion of RTÉ's board to appoint a regulated private sector auditor. In contrast, the general scheme provides the RTÉ board with the authority to appoint a regulated private sector audit firm to carry out an annual audit, in addition to the mandatory annual audit to be carried out by the Comptroller and Auditor General. This practice has been adopted in the university sector and in respect of the only other commercial State body subject to a Comptroller and Auditor General audit, Uisce Éireann. In this context, it is also important to note that, under the Companies Act 2014, at least one of RTÉ's active trading subsidiaries will continue to require an audit by a regulated private sector audit firm. In particular, it is highly likely that RTÉ's subsidiary which manages the transmission network, 2RN, will continue to require a regulated private sector auditor in the coming years given its size. The Bill throws up a clear anomaly in that this would not be allowed and there would be effectively no audit of 2RN.

The key similarity between the general scheme and the proposed Bill is that both appoint the Comptroller and Auditor General as auditor of RTÉ. This will have two effects. First, the Comptroller and Auditor General will carry out an audit of RTÉ’s annual accounts and, second, the Comptroller and Auditor General will have the discretion to carry out value-for-money examinations of RTÉ.

The expert advisory committee on governance and culture in RTÉ emphasised that the Comptroller and Auditor General has a more expansive role than a regulated private sector auditor. In particular, the expert advisory committee referred to value-for-money considerations. The special reports of the Comptroller and Auditor General have been vital in recent years in focusing on issues ranging from individual property transactions and procurement to financial governance and reporting standards. The reports continue to drive change and reform across in a number of public bodies.

The national counter-disinformation strategy, published last month, emphasised the importance of a trustworthy information environment in the context of growing disinformation, both in Ireland and internationally. In this context, trust in public service media as a reliable source of information is more important than ever. Trust, as we know, must be earned and maintained. While the assignment of the Comptroller and Auditor General is certainly one mechanism that will build trust, it will not in itself build and restore public trust in RTÉ. That is why I have brought forward a general scheme which contains a comprehensive set of reforms to improve transparency, accountability and value for money in the public service media providers.

I have already mentioned the changes to the legislative basis for corporate governance in RTÉ and TG4, including the strengthened role and duties of the board and accountability of the directors general to the board. These changes are not happening in a vacuum; they are designed to copper-fasten and underpin the reforms being implemented by the new leadership in RTÉ, both at board and executive level.

In terms of value for money, the assessment of the Comptroller and Auditor General is, as set out in law, ex postand focused primarily on financial procedures and the economy and efficiency of processes and procedures. That is why the general scheme also significantly strengthens the role of Coimisiún na Mean as the independent regulator of our public service media providers, something the Bill before the House does not do.

Currently, RTÉ and TG4 set their own performance commitments on an annual basis. To enhance accountability and ensure value for money can be assessed, the general scheme provides that Coimisiún na Mean will ultimately identify the performance commitments of RTÉ and TG4. This will augment and strengthen public trust in our public service media providers. This also is not covered by the Bill.

Coimisiún na Meán will also continue to assess the funding needs of RTÉ and TG4, but will do this every three years instead of every five. To enhance the transparency of this process, it will carry out its work in accordance with a published methodology. As part of this, the regulator will identify performance commitments and outputs and associated financial inputs. It will also ensure that state aid rules are observed to prevent overcompensation of our public service media providers. This means that any funding recommendation sent to Government by Coimisiún na Meán will set out the net cost to RTÉ and TG4 of fulfilling their public service remit but not more than this. As I said in the media, this is more far-reaching than the Bill before the House.

Ultimately, the objective of the general scheme is to create a public service media that is trusted and trustworthy, holds power to account and is accountable. The Bill features one important component of the measures necessary to achieve this. However, as I have set out, we must approach the reform of our public service media in a far more comprehensive and cohesive manner, not through piecemeal reform measures. The general scheme currently undergoing pre-legislative scrutiny in an Oireachtas committee will achieve that. I see no reason the Oireachtas committee would have to delay it. If the Deputy wishes to progress it further through pre-legislative scrutiny, we would welcome that. I look forward to working with the committee and the Deputies to bring the general scheme through that pre-legislative scrutiny.

For these reasons, I consider that this Private Members' Bill should be declined a Second Reading.

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