Tommy Broughan (Dublin North East, Labour)

Until five or six months ago, the Minister and his predecessor, Deputy Dermot Ahern, used to say in the various debates we had on this matter that very little could be done because few resources had been found. They used to refer to the record of exploration in this country. They would point out that over the previous two and a half decades, companies were not prepared to explore our waters year after year.

Yesterday, Deputy Cowley kindly e-mailed me an interesting report that was to be submitted to the conference in the Burlington Hotel this morning. The key point that seems to be made throughout the report is that technology has changed. It seems that bringing ashore significant gas resources from 70 km off our offshore shelf, through 3,000 feet of water, is not as daunting as it once was. It was once a nearly impossible prospect, but amazing engineering advances now allow sub-sea infrastructure to be placed in situ. It is now possible for a stream of oil and gas to be brought ashore over ten or 15 years.

I had been representing my party in this portfolio for a short time when I met representatives of Ramco. It was before the Minister's time in the portfolio. I was interested in the forms of technology the company used at that time to further explore tranches of sub-sea geological structures. I was told that the technologies in question had previously led to good oil and gas discoveries. The officials from Ramco told me their little company was prepared to try to extract such substances on a profitable basis. While it did not work out for Ramco, it was clear that significant deposits were available.

We know there has been much greater interest in the Slyne-Erris licensing round over recent years, particularly this year. An interesting case was made by an Irish oil company, Grianán, which has been established by a group of young men from County Donegal. Grianán was prepared to give 10% of reserves to the State, as a first gesture, to indicate that it hoped to reorganise how licensing business is done in this country. We have heard Mr. Gavin O'Reilly's exciting reports about the Dunquin prospect and the surrounding seas. Reference has been made to trillions of cubic feet of gas and substantial oil reserves.

I have told the Minister many times that we have to follow the example set in Norway by Statoil. In particular, we should consider the formula adopted by Statoil when it was trying to develop resources in the North Sea between 1968 and 1971. When Statoil was in this country trying to find a resolution to an earlier phase of the Corrib crisis in north Mayo, it explained that it had successfully adopted a strategy of demanding expertise and knowledge from the oil companies. It was prepared to proceed with licensing arrangements after it got what it wanted.

We have all read about the interesting history of DONG Energy, which is the exploration company in Denmark. It supervises the exploration of oil and gas in that territory and gives it self-sufficiency. We are also aware of the exciting developments in this regard in Canadian provinces like Newfoundland and Labrador, and more recently in the Faroe Islands. It seems that Ireland is one of the few countries with possible tremendous oil and gas reserves which has not been prepared to take the basic step of establishing a dedicated agency to search for such reserves. We have to follow the Norwegian and Danish examples.

The licensing and taxation arrangements for oil and gas around this country's coast have had an unfortunate history over the past 30 years, since the time of my great predecessor, Justin Keating. When he was the relevant Minister in this area, he established a regime that was very much in line with the regimes in place in countries like Norway and the Netherlands. If one considers the Corrib issue, particularly the controversy about the refinery in Erris, one will have to reflect on the immediate issue of the location of the refinery and the earlier problem of the location of the pipeline. The background problem that has to be considered is the failure to deal in a transparent and equitable way with the exploration that is necessary to find any gas and oil reserves which may benefit this country and its people.

The charge that is continuously made against the Minister, Deputy Noel Dempsey, and the Taoiseach is that they gave away Ireland's patrimony — gas, in this instance — without a penny or cent of return to this State, with the exception of corporation tax returns. There has been a scandalous abnegation of responsibility on the part of the Minister, his predecessor, Deputy Dermot Ahern, the former Minister, Deputy Fahey, and all the other Fianna Fáil Ministers in this area. I refer in particular to the performance of the Taoiseach and the former Minister, Bobby Molloy, in 1992. They totally dismantled the basic licensing regime that had been put in place to give our people a reasonable interest in the resources off our coast. That is the record.

In recent weeks, the Taoiseach has been talking about his legacy over the past ten years. The extraordinary decisions taken in this regard will form part of his legacy. It has been alleged that Enterprise Oil was significantly involved in trying to influence the Government's approach to the terms of the licences and the royalties. The former Minister, Ray Burke, and the Taoiseach dismantled our royalties and licensing regime, which resembled in a basic way the manner in which the Scandinavian countries and other normal democratic countries chose to administer their resources. The Minister, and the other two Ministers, Deputies Fahey and Dermot Ahern, have failed to pull back that ground. The Minister said on a number of occasions he would review the licensing terms, that he was preparing a review and that he feels there are reasons to take a more pro-active role on our oil and gas resources. Will there be any fruits of that review in the forthcoming budget or in anything the Minister does before the general election? The Minister is often referred to as a man who is prepared to address very difficult issues, but does he have the courage to look at the licensing and royalties regime again? Will he try to emulate the best and most transparent regimes in the world, such as those which exist in Denmark and Norway?

If the Minister is not prepared to do it in this Bill, he should publish another Bill to establish an agency with the skills and the experience needed. In the past, I commended my constituency colleague, Deputy Woods, when he was Minister and established the Marine Institute. That institute gave us some kind of basic information on fisheries stocks and the ecology of the seas off our coasts for the first time. Prior to that we had practically no information worth debating, although much more still needs to be done on fisheries. I hope the Marine Institute and the new agency to be established after Christmas will make up for that. I urge the Minister to set up a centre of expertise before the next election which could ensure the dearth of information on our coastal resources will never cause problems again as it did in north Mayo. An exploration agency can be set up like that which exists in Denmark and Norway.

Last Monday morning, I walked some of the road with the people of Rossport and Erris. Of the 100 people who showed up every morning from 6.00 a.m. to 7.00 a.m., many of them were ordinary people of the district such as farmers, fishermen — including salmon fishermen upset about last week's decision — teachers and women on home duties doing their bit for their community before they took their kids to school. It seems the people want face-to-face negotiations between themselves and Shell and its partners, without preconditions. Efforts to remedy the situation failed before in that respect, perhaps due to the position of both sides. There should be face-to-face meetings to try to look for a resolution. Various polls have been carried out by TG4 and others, while I read into the record a poll carried out by Shell and which was sent to me by the CEO of Shell, Mr. Andy Pyle. Whatever poll we examine, it seems a significant part of the population of Mayo is still very unhappy about the location of the refinery and about the process in which this development took place. Dr. Mark Garavan and his colleagues put forward a proposal for a commission as a starting point which could lead to a face-to-face meeting between the two sides and which might bring about a resolution.

We have spoken about the slow nature of energy development, but ten years have passed since the Corrib deposits were discovered. Mr. Egan told me recently that with the best scoping possible, the gas will come ashore by autumn 2009, but it would be best if we could get past the scenes witnessed on the haulage road from Belmullet last Monday morning and if we could bring the resource home by agreement. We had lengthy discussions on Committee Stage about ensuring the towns of Connaught would enjoy the benefits of gas. The Minister must be commended for the decision to extend gas supply to a large number of towns, although I have been told to remind him about Belmullet and Ballinrobe which should be added to the list. Bord Gáis Éireann was not prepared to use criteria which would have permitted a cost-benefit analysis to enable the development of the pipelines across north and central Connaught. Deputy Durkan, Senator McSharry and I argued that Bord Gáis Éireann's point of view was nonsense and that we should ensure the people most affected by this infrastructure should absolutely get the benefit. I warmly welcome the decision that has been made, but we need to go a step further.

People were very unhappy with the Minister when he made references to the dispute in the context of the dispute in Northern Ireland. He should withdraw those remarks and should take a central role in trying to resolve this matter, because this is a key transitional fuel. Most of us suspect that we have far greater resources off our coast and we may well even be like the Norwegians or Russians and this will be a huge asset for our country in the next few decades. We may be well placed to help the rest of Europe and the world in this area, but we can only do that if we get past this stage. There is goodwill among the people of north-west Mayo. The Labour Party representative in the area, Councillor Harry Barrett, indicates that a resolution of this matter can be brought about if there is good will.

We must not be kept in the dark about the resources of this country off its coast. We owe it to the Irish people to make sure we get that information. We should take a very pro-active role and not leave it to two or three civil servants. We should set up an agency to carry this out. I urge the Minister to try to prevent the necessity for the kind of scenes I witnessed last Monday morning. I urge him to try to get the two sides to come together for face-to-face discussions and to bring about a resolution. That resolution could be easier than he thinks. This energy is for our people and not for any multinational company. Fintan O'Toole made the point last year that the children of Norway will benefit more from our resources in north-west Mayo than our own children. That is a diabolical state of affairs and the Minister should be prepared to address it.

I urge the Minister to set up this agency or at least to give us a commitment that he will bring forward a Bill to do that. I also urge him to bring forward a review on the licensing terms and not to close his mind to this straight away. Deputy Cowley and I were at a press conference at 2.00 p.m. We received a note from the Minister at approximately 3 p.m. stating he had rejected the proposal made by the protestors on behalf of the people of north-west Mayo out of hand. He should instead have worked to resolve the issue, something that is possible and in which he should play a central role.

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