Mr. Paul Perth:

I will just jump in really briefly. I thank the Senator very much. To go back to that incident earlier with the 18 or 19 young people in the park and the chaos, being able to go into the park and sit with young people in their space rather than forming a group or asking them to come in allows for an equal balance of power. We ask if there is any chance that we can come into their space. We ask them for permission. Two siblings aged ten and 11 were probably the main instigators of that chaos, bullying and violence. It sounds horrible. We had two artists with us. We restored order.

We got them going the same way up and down the track. We got them talking to each other. There was respect between genders and stuff like that. We did all the youth work process but these two boys, the two main instigators, followed us over. They wanted to show us this wall because the artists were doing spray painting. They said they would show us the wall. On the way over, through conversation, those two guys started telling us about collecting bottles. They had four or five bottles, which was verified after. They were not spoofing. They had four or five black bags of bottles out the back garden that they were collecting - and I am going to use their language - for the local druggies who cannot get off drugs and who were going on walks. That was their language. It was the local walk-and-talk group. What it exposed to us was the values within those two young people. Like Eddie - and I am not as old as Eddie - I am around a long enough time to know where those two young men are heading: criminal justice, youth justice, Oberstown and on and on. Those two guys need to be nurtured at source. The value systems they have, where they are collecting bottles, need to be nurtured and brought to the fore. That is the way we are going to save - not save, but direct and divert these young people. At source, go into the playground, sit with them and nurture them.