Oireachtas Joint and Select Committees

Tuesday, 25 June 2024

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Disability Matters

An Inclusive Education for an Inclusive Society: Department of Education

6:00 pm

Photo of Tom ClonanTom Clonan (Independent)
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I did a rough estimate based on that. There are approximately 60,000 students in each year. Given that about 60,000 sit the leaving certificate every year, I extrapolated from that. From junior infants up to sixth class, there is a cohort of about 60,000 nationwide in each of those years. At primary level, that would give us a total of 480,000, almost half a million, pupils and at secondary level we have approximately 360,000 students. The World Health Organization estimates that between 4% and 15% of the population are neurodiverse. Taking the more conservative estimate of 4% gives us 33,600 children at primary level who are neurodiverse. The higher estimate, which I think is where the truth lies, would give us a figure of about 125,000. With 3,000 special education classes at primary level, based on the conservative 4% figure, my guesstimate is that we have a capacity to meet 50% of the need. If closer to 15% of the population is neurodiverse, with an overall total of 3,000 classes, there is a lot of capacity building to be done to meet that need.

I have a couple of questions, which will go from broad philosophical questions to more precise ones. Like many of my colleagues, I receive a huge volume of correspondence from families who are in crisis and at their wits' end. They do not know what is going to happen with their child. Very often, the recurring theme is that the child has a fundamental right to an education under the UN Charter of Human Rights but the parent cannot get a place for their child. The other thing I am told over and over is that children are being forced to go into a setting away from their siblings. I have had experience of that myself with my family where, due to a lack of supports in one setting, one of my children had to be educated in a completely different environment. That issue also arises.

How would the Minister of State characterise the Department's capacity to deal with this unmet need? Is this a crisis that requires more support from the Minister for Finance perhaps or Department of Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform? Would the Minister of State characterise the situation as crisis-like? Is she getting enough support from Cabinet colleagues for her officials here. I have had occasion to deal with officials from her Department and they have always been very positive interactions. I know they are working very hard in difficult circumstances. Is the Department getting enough supports? What is the ideal support-to-pupil ratio in one of those 3,000 classes? Would it be 1:10 or 1:5? What is it? Based on the figures I have here, the ratios are quite high. I apologise again if the Minister of State has already answered some of those questions.