Ms Mary MacCormack:

We were suspicious for a few years and then from about 2016 or 2017 onwards, we may as well have been talking to the wall. It was not just one or two people. There were people in other counties as well. They were all a bit bamboozled by the whole approach. I have noticed in latter years that we have Ministers with an environmental portfolio who go all over the world every few years. They were in Scotland and they were here, there and everywhere. They will talk about the need for cleaner energy, cleaner transport and everything else. I read every blessed thing I can find in the newspapers when those world conferences are on. Not one Minister ever mentions forestry, its merits for carbon storage or its promotion. You could forget about it then. I do not know what has to happen. I suppose it could be the big fines Europe is going to impose. They are going to be in the multiple millions because we are so far away from the targets that are set and to which we signed up.

Then there is the record. It is mind-boggling how a Minister could be excited about a forestry programme. If I had €1.3 billion in the morning, which is the money that has been allocated, I would definitely be looking at the small guy first. It does not all have to go to the multinational investment funds or whatever they are. We would be keeping all that money in the local community. Where possible, it is more cost-effective to give local contractors the job of removing trees, thinnings or whatever. That money would be spent locally as well. I do not know where the money that will go to Gresham House is going to be spent. I have no idea. Maybe it will be wonderful for forestry but I cannot see it. There should not be two sectors. The Government cannot isolate one section, which is the big multinationals, and then abandon the small guy.

They hope we will fade away and stop giving out. They think we have no entitlements. We have an entitlement to earn a living from our land.