Mr. Jerry MacEvilly:

I will come in briefly. I thank the Senator for the question. I have a few different points. On the issue of data, obviously the CSO and the EPA do great work in this area. I do not see why it would not be appropriate to task one of them. What would be interesting, given section 15 of the climate Act and the need for public bodies to align with and support the national transition objective, is whether more of an explicit obligation could be raised with these bodies, be they airport authorities or other public bodies, that it should really be a requirement for them to collect this data. That is just a thought.

The Senator asked a really excellent question on the broader issue of lobbying. I have information from colleagues in Friends of the Earth International that at COP27, more than 630 fossil fuel lobbyists registered to attend and the UAE had more fossil fuel lobbyists in its delegation than any other country. Members probably saw in yesterday’s news that there is an investigation which found the UAE was planning on using the COP to try to progress deals on the fossil fuel side with other states. This goes back to a previous question we really have to appreciate, namely, when the public hears information like that, how are they supposed to take the COP seriously? Some people might argue the extent to which it matters given it fundamentally comes back to national law and national interests, but the whole driving force behind national law is what happens at the COPs. As I said, if individuals are increasingly being tasked to take climate action we firmly believe is important from a climate justice perspective and from a quality of life perspective then they will be asked this, yet there is that contradiction at UN level, so it is not a free lunch. The other way in which it is not a free lunch is many indigenous groups, human rights defenders and other groups really struggle to get access to the COP. That is another comparison worth making and a real issue that should be addressed.

On fossil fuel lobbying in Ireland and what can be done on that side, I am interested in the Senator’s experience. I am not 100% sure of this, but perhaps the analysis and debate around access of lobbyists may be more progressed or more research may have been done on the EU side. I would be interested in how that could be brought back to the Irish context.

I will finish with three points. The first is that it is not simply the fossil fuel companies themselves that do this lobbying. In many cases in the Irish context it is very well known PR companies, consultancies and communication companies that undertake it. That is important to bear in mind with respect to how we might bring greater transparency in the Irish context. Also, it is not simply focused on the interest of fossil fuel companies themselves. What I mean by that is often, the lobbying that takes place is undertaken by industries or large energy users that are very dependent on fossil fuel use. Last of all, as a related side point, we should take into account that we equally need proper regulation of advertising when we look at the role of fossil fuel companies. We fundamentally believe the self-regulating model in place at the moment is not fit for purpose and we are interested in returning to the possible need for legislation on that front too.