Dr. Martha O'Hagan-Luff:

I thank the Senator for her question. According to Kate Raworth who wrote Doughnut Economics, the economy is a wholly-owned subsidiary of the natural world. We need a mindset change, that we do not see it that way. We think nature is a nice-to-have. That needs to shift and we need to turn that upside down. We are a subsidiary of the natural world and we need to consider the impact of everything we do. It is very concerning that it was not front and centre. Ideally, there would be legal and constitutional rights for nature and every citizen would have a deep respect and reverence for nature but in the meantime when we do not, we do have these cost-benefit analyses. What I am saying is that I do not think finance can fix it all but, by God, we need to be getting those values in to make them part of the conversation and to stop the continuing damage. Ignoring nature and ignoring the impact we are having on nature will ultimately put ourselves at risk, so let us get it in there. There should be no conversation where it is not discussed.

The last thing I would say is about intergenerational equity. Wales had a Minister for future generations where every government decision had to take into account, whether it would be good or bad for future generations. Sophie Howe came to speak to us in Trinity. She was amazing and it just made so much sense that when roads were being built, they had to talk about how it would impact our children. Should that be in cycle lanes, etc. Intergenerational equity is really important and again nature should be in there and future generations should be in every single conversation and decision.