Ms Susanne Rogers:

It was 2021. We can see clearly there is a spectrum there but Indecon managed to put some numbers on it. The research has been done and we know what needs to be done. That report lays out very clearly an extra payment needs to be put in place that is, as the Deputy said, nothing to do with the increased cost of living we have seen in the past year or so but with the fact that, purely by virtue of having a disability, people incur extra costs. It is about who bears the brunt of those costs. We should be able to put some sort of supports in place.

When we are talking about the move from social protection into work, there are two arguments. If somebody is on welfare and in poverty, that is a welfare issue. If somebody is working and in poverty, that is about low wages and poor job quality. We also must have the discussion about reskilling and upskilling. I think of the jobs I had when I left school. You had to have good handwriting. Nobody needs good handwriting now as a skill. Good computer skills are needed. At the time the construction industry disappeared, highly skilled craftsmen lost their jobs. They were in their late 50s and early 60s. It was not that they did not have skills but they had skills that were no longer required at the time. We need to keep up with the world of work, and it has been said that as well as the expansion of the labour force, the understanding of what work means has broadened. We need to be keeping up. It is probably beyond the scope but we need to be looking at constantly reskilling and upskilling and allowing people to work for longer. The idea that a person left school, went to college, got a job, stayed in it for 40 years and retired on a good pension is long gone. People are having to pivot much more. Some have four or five careers now. A person who is in education for longer may be working well into his or her 70s and constantly learning and changing. The conversation about making work pay is about ensuring quality jobs are available. I read during the week that Ireland is second to the US when it comes to low-paid, poor quality jobs.