Damien English (Meath West, Fine Gael)
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The nature of the TBESS is to try to reach the majority of businesses that have been impacted. I think the majority would qualify for the scheme. The Deputy is correct to say that certain sectors are impacted in a greater way. That is why the combination of schemes, using TBESS and the loan guarantee as an option and the other supports that are there to reduce energy bills, will help. It is important that we track this sector by sector into the new year. There are specific sectors as well that have come to our attention - the Deputy mentioned a few of them – that might need greater intervention, but that needs to be monitored depending on where the cost of energy goes in the new year. Each Department is tracking that as well. There are sectors that are under pressure and we must find different ways of supporting them. TBESS is designed to have the most impact as quickly as possible to reach the high volume of businesses. Most businesses are under pressure with their costs.

Deputy Bruton is correct about the need to reduce energy. We are trying to work with companies in the various sectors to decarbonise their business and to be able to show their green credentials for two reasons, first, to reduce their own costs and, second, to fit in with our climate legislation and targets, which we are involved in setting for the industry at between 33% and 35% to achieve in the coming years. When they are exporting around the world, their own customers will demand this now. We have a journey to go. There are approximately 20 different schemes to support businesses. There is an issue with vetting companies because the drawdown is not where we would expect it to be. We constantly work with businesses to bring them through those schemes, and we look at whether we have to adjust them and make a better offering. One example from the recent budget, which we will discuss here again, is the additional €4 million given to the local enterprise offices to fund investment in infrastructure for businesses that have come through the green for micro initiative. They have done their audit and made up their plan and now they have access to funds to implement the plan as well. Likewise, we have the energy efficiency loan scheme, which is an attractive scheme worth up to €150,000 over ten years to invest in energy reduction infrastructure or decarbonisation. A number of schemes are available.

I am disappointed with the drawdown. That is something we might specifically look at as a committee some day and go through them all. We could bring in the relevant agencies that work with the Department as well. We do that too but there is not enough discussion around this. Industries and businesses have gone through four or five difficult years and they have just been trying to survive while trying to deal with Brexit, Covid and Ukraine. We must get them thinking of the long-term solutions, however. We can work with them and help them to invest in their own business through the various schemes. Even with the name change, the future growth loan scheme tries to encourage people to invest in infrastructure to reduce their use of carbon and energy. Several schemes are in place. It is a case of how appropriate they are and if businesses can navigate their way through them. Again, we are trying to do a lot of work in the Department to try to guide people through the schemes, point out where they are and what is relevant to them. The climate change toolkit brings people through that conversation as well and could point them in the right direction. We are launching a new mechanism – it is not on our website yet – to track the way through the schemes and try to find the one to suit each business. That will help. Deputy Bruton is correct. We will put more money into that as well.

The Deputy’s point on the name of schemes is a good one. It is hard for me too when they keep changing. It has to do with the legal situation when there are different funding streams and to allow for the various EU frameworks. There are various schemes. The credit guarantee scheme and the future growth loan scheme are linked to the EU frameworks, which changes the state aid rules, as outlined by Deputy O’Reilly earlier. The current one is a response to Ukraine. The previous framework was in response to Covid. They are set at a European level. We probably have to go the extra distance to make sure that our schemes are aligned under those frameworks. I agree with the Deputy that it is complicated. That is why I generally just refer to them as the future growth loan scheme or the loan schemes. There is an interest from businesses. Deputy Bruton asked me for the figures on the drawdown. It was fully subscribed. To date, there were 3,500 loans under the future growth loan scheme. To date, we are aware of only two loan defaults. Each time we change the name, there are feature changes as well; the schemes are not exactly the same. However, I do agree with Deputy Bruton that it would be easier if the names did not change. Businesses have said the same to us as well. The main point is that the schemes are available. The new growth loan scheme has a target of 30% investment in infrastructure to reduce energy usage and a company’s carbon footprint, which would be useful.

The other question the Deputy asked was whether we are looking at the various sectors and their journey. The White Paper on enterprise that is due out in December is trying to look into the future and to signal where we need to concentrate our efforts as a Department. It will confirm areas in which we have had great success as a country over the past 30 to 40 years, but it will point out what we need to do in future to strengthen the position of business, strengthen our competitiveness and the availability of skills and talent. Having read through the White Paper and had a lot of discussions on it, much of it is around decarbonisation, digitalisation, our green journey and energy production. It recognises that even before Ukraine, the cost and availability of energy has a major impact on business.

Naturally, that will play a major role. The White Paper will capture the various sectors we need to address. We need to target areas, which we do through the schemes, and work with sectors. Clustering programmes are coming through Enterprise Ireland, which is trying to share expertise with sectors.

Regarding retail, the Deputy asked about investing in putting doors on fridges and so on. There is a great deal of work being done in the retail sector and some of the larger multiples have been able to encourage that investment and assist with costs. Many other businesses have drawn down grants and supports through the Sustainable Energy Authority of Ireland, SEAI, Enterprise Ireland and their local enterprise offices, LEOs. However, they are still being hit with high energy bills, so we must ensure that the supports are worth their while and we work with them on continuous investment. Quick wins can be achieved in certain sectors, but this is a conversation that we need to have more often with our enterprise community. Everyone gains by doing this. We have targets under the Climate Action Plan on which we have to deliver. There is a great deal of work to do over the coming years.