Roderic O'Gorman (Dublin West, Green Party)
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First, I have no problem with answering questions, which is why I am here, and I am happy to engage with members and to continue to do so.

On the co-location of Ukrainian or other accommodation with educational facilities, that has happened in a number of instances, so we have some experience of it. I think it would be best if the Deputy engaged with us and we can take the matter offline after the meeting concludes, if that is okay with him.

Where properties are being renovated or repurposed for either international protection or Ukrainian accommodation, we now have the benefit of a planning exemption. When a planning exemption is used, there is not a planning process and it is quite black and white. We either go through a planning process or have an exemption. The saving grace, perhaps, is that a planning exemption lasts for a maximum of three years, after which, if the use is to persist, a normal planning application to the local authority, followed by one to An Bord Pleanála, has to be undertaken. It is not forever, and while I recognise that three years is not an insignificant period, that is the balance we have sought to achieve in being able to accommodate people in a crisis situation in existing buildings, even if they might not be residential buildings, that are deemed safe from a health and safety and fire protection point of view.

The modular programme for Ukrainians is being conducted between my Department and the Office of Public Works, and the Minister of State with responsibility for that agency, Deputy O'Donovan, has given significant support in that regard. We will be on-site at five locations by the first week in December. We are currently on-site at two and the remaining three will be on-site by the first week of December. That will deliver the first 200 units, comprising about 800 beds given they contain four beds each. The modular units are high quality, with an A2 energy rating, which is higher than that for many houses.