Ossian Smyth (Dún Laoghaire, Green Party)
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The Deputy's first question was on the number of homes being upgraded. This is one of those meetings where another meeting is taking place at the same time at which the numbers will be changed. I think it will be a dramatic change. I will not guess what the Cabinet will approve today but I understand it is possible the increase in those numbers will be significant and dramatic.

The Deputy asked about deeper and more shallow retrofits and how one accounts for them. That is a very good question. To say we will retrofit 20,000 homes without saying if those will be deep or shallow retrofits is not clear. We need a way to account for them. As the information note puts it, a reduction in the number of homes retrofitted could still lead to an overall increase in the amount of carbon dioxide saved. We need to be clear to each other in explaining what is being done.

I expect there will be increased funding for shallow retrofits this year. This will be for people who are unwilling to embark on a whole deep retrofit, even with a large grant or loan, but are prepared to do it in steps. They might be prepared to do their attic and walls and might be prepared to install a heat pump later. That would be done step by step with a smaller total budget for each step of the way. It is a matter of responding to that kind of demand from the public since not everyone is willing to take on a €50,000 retrofit, even where €25,000 of the cost is covered by a grant. There are those for whom even €3,000 would be a more reasonable amount. This will result in a larger number of smaller steps to achieve an outcome.