Timmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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I largely support what Deputy Sherlock said. It is not that I am in disagreement with Deputy Eamon Ryan in where he is coming from. In terms of behavioural change, for me, what we need to try to do is get the carbon emitters off the roads. We are still going to need roads for public transport vehicles and so on. We really need to focus on having people switch from fossil fuel generated carbon spewing vehicles to electric vehicles. There are significant road blocks, the removal of which needs investment. We would be burying our heads in the sand if we were to suggest they should somehow go away. The ratio of 2:1 is a nice one, but what would it mean in effect? We have rightly identified the necessity to look at the carbon emissions impact of projects in the plan to 2040 to see whether they make sense in that respect. On putting another limiter on it that does not look into the detail, it is overarching and I do not know how it necessarily deals with the issues that arise, but it should not be seen as not wanting to invest in public transport. We need to invest aggressively in public transport, but I do not know if setting it against what we spend on roads on a ratio of 2:1 would benefit anyone or if it is necessarily the right thing to do. We should develop a comprehensive framework for what we need to do with public transport.

We can have a misty-eyed view of the past and expect everybody to toddle onto trains, but that is not going to happen either. We cannot expect people to somehow wait for the bus that comes every two hours, even if we were to increase provision massively and provide a service where there was none heretofore. In the rural constituency I know best we would need to put a lot of money into the roads to service the buses that would need to be put in place to provide a comprehensive service to meet the needs of a society that has largely become dependent on the just-in-time service provided by their own personal vehicles. We have seen an evolution away from crowds walking the roads together when they wanted to go to wherever they wanted to go. That does not happen anymore. Sadly, we are in a situation where there are three or four cars in many homes throughout rural Ireland, where sons and daughters still live at home. The first stage is to reduce emissions from the vehicles in which people travel. Over time we need to enhance and increase public transport in densely populated areas. That involves dealing with issues in planning and how we will develop cities into the future. We talked about this issue in the past of urban and suburban planning. I agree with the vast majority of what came from the Citizens' Assembly and would not like to fall out with it over this, but the 2:1 ratio is somewhat crude in meeting the objective we are trying to achieve.