Mr. Tony Donohoe:

The pinch point here is the payment for off-the-job training because under craft apprenticeships the off-the-job training costs are handled by the State, which is the big difference. That has been a pinch point, particularly for SMEs. Deputy Kelleher made two other points I would like to pick up on. He used the example of a block-layer. I think there has been acknowledgement within the traditional craft apprenticeships that they did not focus enough on what we call the transversal skills, that is, the employability skills, the softer skills. Therefore, there were very few opportunities to move out of such apprenticeships. It should be a broader education experience. I was taken by Deputy Kelleher's use of the word "anchor" and his point that the apprenticeship is the anchor. I agree 100%, and what characterises the new apprenticeships are the progression opportunities. I will bring in my two colleagues here because we have examples of being able to provide a pathway into apprenticeships and then, particularly in the high-tech sector, progression opportunities through to higher degree level. Not everyone might want to go that far, but that progression opportunity should at least be available. The reason this is so critical is that if one is competing, as I said in my opening remarks, with the CAO system, those progression opportunities need to be available within the apprenticeship model. That is the power of the model. As I said, with the Chairman's permission, I will introduce an example first of progression into apprenticeship and then of progression to the higher levels.