Mr. Ed Farrell:

I think I have more or less said what I have to say. Deputy Coppinger suggested, in the context of the AIB sale, that funds are not the problem. It is not really for us to comment on that. The Government's position, or Europe's position, is that the Government is under an EU mandate to use the AIB proceeds for something other than capital spending. We will assist in the social housing area if we are asked to do so. We started this process in 2014. I suppose the 2020 document was the written request. We had been engaging for a few years before any documents were produced in this space. Interest rates were at a totally different level back then. In 2014, the rate was approximately 3.5%, which would have been the average in this area. It was at 2.5% in some of the material that was drafted by financial advisers more recently, including late last year. Obviously, interest rates have been decreasing even further. We are into negative interest rates at the European level for the foreseeable future. The latest proposal involved a 2.5% rate. We have not had detailed conversations because, as we understand it, the fund has not been opened and is not nearly up and running. We do not have details of the interest rate. If it is 2% or 2.5%, it will represent good value for the approved housing body. I know the current rates are going to be much lower if they are on the balance sheet than if they are off the balance sheet. If a rate of 2% or 2.5% is secured, that is much better than what is being achieved in Government bonds or in bank deposit accounts at the moment. It would then be a question of issues like prudence and credit assessment, about which we had a conversation earlier. Assuming that stacks up, a rate of 2% or 2.5% would be economically viable for us.

Deputy Coppinger's final point related to the risk to members' funds. We cannot speculate. No credit union will decide to put its members' funds at risk. Every credit decision, from a €500 loan for Christmas or a communion to a €5,000 loan for a car or a loan of €50,000, €75,000 or €100,000 for a house, is put through the wringer internally in every single credit union. Some credit unions even seek outside assessment from experts as well. It is certainly the case that the credit unions exist because their 3 million members trust them. If they tried to do anything that was too risky or not worthy of being approved, the Central Bank would not allow it. The boards of the credit unions would not want to do anything that was not within risk parameters or not appropriate.