Mr. Christy Mannion:

I can understand the frustration being expressed by members of the committee this morning. Indeed, we share some of that frustration. The Department has discussed the issues just outlined by Mr. Brownlee with the HEA with a view to bringing all the various governance pieces together into an accountability framework, a financial framework and an updating of the code of governance. We have been working on that to drive better accountability and better governance. When one takes out some of the issues and examines them in the manner in which this committee has done, it is quite disconcerting. We have been working with the people to whom committee members referred, namely, the whistleblowers. I have been meeting them individually, talking to them and trying to get to a situation where we can address their issues. We do not want them to be in limbo, looking in all directions in an effort to have their concerns addressed. As recently as two weeks ago I spent three hours with some of them. We are moving to address particular issues and have been discussing them with the University of Limerick and the HEA to try to find a mechanism to move forward.

I accept the Chairman's frustration but from our perspective, we are dealing with these issues. As Mr. Brownlee said, some of these issues go back to 2013-2014. We have been working on it. Over the past year, there has been much more liaison and discussion with the Comptroller and Auditor General than before so the situation has improved greatly. There have been a number of meetings between the Comptroller and Auditor General and the Secretary General, the Comptroller and Auditor General and the HEA, the Comptroller and Auditor General, ourselves and the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform. We have been doing all this to address the issues that are there. These things are unacceptable and need to be addressed but I assure the committee we have been addressing them. We are working on them and we are trying to put better systems in place to ensure the committee is not in this position and will not be addressing these issues in the time to come.