Oireachtas Joint and Select Committees
Wednesday, 18 January 2017
Joint Oireachtas Committee on European Union Affairs
EU-Funded Projects: Ecumenical Accompaniment Programme in Palestine and Israel
2:00 pm
Seán Haughey (Dublin Bay North, Fianna Fail)
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The next item is the Ecumenical Accompaniment Programme in Palestine and Israel, EAPPI. I welcome Mr. Alex Dunne and Ms Jenny Derbyshire who are representing the programme. The committee is interested in hearing from the EAPPI about its work with regard to projects funded by the EU, particularly in the context of the application of human rights in the region.
Before we begin, I will read out a note about privilege. Members are reminded again of the long-standing parliamentary practice to the effect that they should not comment on, criticise or make charges against a person outside the House or an official either by name or in such a way as to make him or her identifiable. By virtue of section 17(2)(l) of the Defamation Act 2009, witnesses are protected by absolute privilege in respect of their evidence to the committee. If they are directed by the committee to cease giving evidence on a particular matter and they continue to do so, they are entitled thereafter only to qualified privilege in respect of their evidence. They are directed that only evidence connected with the subject matter of these proceedings is to be given and they are asked to respect the parliamentary practice to the effect that, where possible, they should not criticise or make charges against any person or entity by name or in such a way as to make him, her or it identifiable.
I understand Mr. Costello will open proceedings on behalf of the Ecumenical Accompaniment Programme in Palestine and Israel, EAPPI. I invite him to make his opening remarks.
Seán Haughey (Dublin Bay North, Fianna Fail)
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I beg your pardon.
Seán Haughey (Dublin Bay North, Fianna Fail)
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Sorry, I realise that now.
Seán Haughey (Dublin Bay North, Fianna Fail)
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Is Ms Derbyshire going to lead off?
Seán Haughey (Dublin Bay North, Fianna Fail)
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I apologise.
Ms Jenny Derbyshire:
Mr. Costello has suddenly come down with something.
I thank the Chairman and members of the committee for giving us this opportunity to present before them today on an issue of direct relevance and concern to the committee, the European Union and the international community as a whole. I refer to the dramatic increase in the destruction and confiscation of Palestinian dwelling and livelihood structures by the Israeli army in the West Bank and Jerusalem in 2016. We will begin with an overview of all demolitions in Area C and East Jerusalem and will focus on the specific issue of the destruction and confiscation of EU-funded humanitarian aid by the Israeli army. We will also outline what positive steps the committee can take to pursue a cessation of and accountability for this destruction and confiscation of EU-funded assets.
To introduce myself, I am a returned ecumenical accompanier, or human rights monitor. I was based in the occupied West Bank as part of the EAPPI programme, which I will explain. I was there for three months in 2012 and another three months in 2013 in Bethlehem and I was back briefly in 2015. I am joined by a fellow ecumenical accompanier, EA, Mr. Alex Dunne, who has been based most recently in the West Bank. He served as a human rights monitor for two periods of three months in 2015 and 2016. Unfortunately, Patrick Costello is sick. He sends his apologies.
Principally, we recommend that the committee call on the Minister, Deputy Flanagan, to raise the issue of the dramatic increase in the destruction of EU-funded humanitarian aid at the next EU Foreign Affairs Council meeting and that the committee also request to be updated regularly on the efforts being made by Ireland to push for a cessation of such breaches of international law in the West Bank and East Jerusalem.
I will explain briefly the programme with which we have both worked and then Mr. Dunne will speak in more detail about the demolitions. Some members of the committee might already know, but some might not, that the ecumenical accompaniment programme in Palestine and Israel, EAPPI, was founded in 2002 after a call by the heads of the Christian churches in Jerusalem for support from the international community. In response, the World Council of Churches set up this worldwide programme which brings people of different backgrounds, professions, ages and faiths to Israel and Palestine to serve as EAs. EAs are human rights monitors. We form part of the United Nations protection cluster and monitor human rights violations. These include violations regarding access to land and livelihood for Palestinian farmers, access to education for children and access to movement for Palestinians across the numerous internal military checkpoints dotted throughout the West Bank. The vision of the programme is a future in which the occupation of the West Bank, East Jerusalem and Gaza has ended and both Palestinians and Israelis benefit from a just peace, with freedom and security, based on international law. Our mission is to witness life under occupation, engage with local Palestinians and Israelis pursuing a just peace and work to change the international community's involvement with the conflict, urging it to act against injustice in the region. Our philosophy is one of non-violence. We are not pro-Israeli or pro-Palestinian; we do not take sides in the conflict. However, we are pro-human rights and international humanitarian law. We do not discriminate against anyone and we stand faithfully with the poor, the oppressed and the marginalised. Since 2002, the programme has brought more than 1,500 EAs to the West Bank and East Jerusalem from all over the world. In the UK and Ireland, EAs are volunteers, and the programme is run by the Quakers in Britain and supported by Trócaire and Christian Aid in Ireland.
My colleague, Alex Dunne, will now walk the committee through the reality on the ground concerning demolitions, including of EU-funded structures, by way of the latest statistics gathered by the United Nations, the European Union and our organisation.
Mr. Alex Dunne:
To understand the context in which these demolitions are taking place, we need to look at the map on page 2 of the opening statement circulated to the committee. The map is of the West Bank and it clearly marks out areas A, B and C as created under the Oslo Accords of the early 1990s. It is worth highlighting that these were only meant to be in existence for five years, ahead of the formation of an independent Palestinian state. However, more than 20 years later, this arrangement or agreement is still in place. In areas A and B, the Palestinian Authority has limited authority over policing and civic services. These are the areas in yellow and beige on the map. The blue area of the map, constituting 60% of the West Bank, is known as Area C. In Area C, Palestinians are subject to Israeli military law and need to apply to the Israeli military for a permit to build any structure, even on privately owned land. Area C is also the part of the West Bank where the majority of Israeli settlements and outposts can be found. Israeli settlers in Area C are not subject to military law but to Israeli civil law instead. These numerous settlements, illegal under international law, can be seen in purple on the map.
According to the preliminary data collected by the United Nations Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs, UN OCHA, and the EAPPI, as of 28 December 2016, the Israeli authorities have demolished or confiscated 1,089 Palestinian-owned structures in the West Bank, which has displaced 1,593 Palestinians and affected the livelihoods of another 7,101. I reaffirm this has happened in 2016. These structures were demolished or confiscated because they were deemed illegal as they had been built without permits from the Israeli army or the Israeli civil administration. It is important to note that this time last year, the former UN Secretary General, Ban Ki-moon, remarked that Israeli zoning and planning in the West Bank is "restrictive, discriminatory and incompatible with requirements under international law. The planning system favours Israeli settlement interests over the needs of the protected population and makes it practically impossible for Palestinians living in Area C ... to obtain building permits."
Official figures from the Israeli civil administration show that between 2010 and 2014, 1.5% of permits applied for by Palestinians to build anything in all of Area C were approved. Zero permits were approved in 2015. As the committee can see from the chart in the opening statement circulated to the committee, during roughly the same period, more than 30,000 settlement units were advanced by the Israeli authorities in the same area. Looking at the chart, we can see that 2016 was the year the highest number of demolitions in the occupied West Bank took place since the UN OCHA began formal records in this regard. These new figures from the UN OCHA show there has been an approximate 96% increase in demolitions by the Israeli military of Palestinian structures in 2016 against 2015's total. It is also important to note that the figures for the first week of 2017 show that the Israeli army has demolished more than 70 Palestinian structures in Area C since New Year's Day. This is 6.5% of 2016's total. If this weekly average continues throughout the year, demolitions in 2017 will be up 338% on 2016's historic total.
Under international law, Israel, as the occupying power, has the obligation to protect Palestinian civilians and administer the territory for its benefit. I will walk the committee through two parts of the Fourth Geneva Convention.
Article 49 of the Geneva Convention states, "Individual or mass forcible transfers, as well as deportations of protected persons ... are prohibited, regardless of their motive." Article 53 states, "Any destruction by the Occupying Power of real or personal property belonging individually or collectively to private persons ... is prohibited, except where such destruction is rendered absolutely necessary by military operations."
This trend has been highlighted many times throughout 2016 at international fora. United Nations Security Council Resolution 2334 of 23 December 2016 illustrates that the international community has reaffirmed its condemnation of "all measures aimed at altering the demographic composition, character and status of the Palestinian Territory occupied since 1967, including East Jerusalem, including, inter alia, the construction and expansion of settlements, transfer of Israeli settlers, confiscation of land, demolition of homes and displacement of Palestinian civilians, in violation of international humanitarian law and relevant resolutions".
The figures I have outlined are not descriptive of the number and value of the EU-funded humanitarian aid structures that have been demolished in the same period. According to the recently released report of the EU delegation in Jerusalem on demolitions and confiscations of EU-funded structures in area C, from January to 8 August 2016 the Israeli military has demolished or confiscated up to 115 EU-funded humanitarian aid structures. The most recent figures from the European External Action Service show that as of the end of 2016, 180 EU structures were demolished or confiscated. This represents a staggering 140% increase on the 2015 total and amounts to a material loss of €600,000, as the graph on the screen demonstrates. The summary of that report, a copy of which has been supplied to members as part of the briefing material, states:
The upsurge in demolitions in 2016 can be attributed to an overarching Israeli policy aimed at asserting control over strategic areas together with increased pressure from various Israeli settler groups on the Israeli Civil Administration. Demolitions are predicted to continue during the next six months...Of particular concern are developments related to Israeli plans for the relocation of Bedouins and herders in Area C...and the overall coercive environment in Area C that communities are facing.
In May 2016, the EU foreign affairs chief, Federica Mogherini, told members of the European Parliament that since 2009, EU-funded structures to the value of approximately €329,000 have been demolished or confiscated by the Israeli army and that approximately 600 structures, worth almost €2.4 million, have been subject to orders for demolition, cessation of work or eviction by the Israeli army and are, therefore, under threat.
The next pages in the presentation include examples of photographs we have taken. My colleagues and I have been on a programme out there. Committee members will see a mix of EU-funded structures from different parts of the West Bank. The first photographs are from an area called Khirbet Tana, an area in the north of the West Bank. The building was a boys school funded with European money. I took the photograph in February 2016. One month later, a colleague sent me a photograph of the same school and it had been demolished. The plaque on the top of the school is shown in detail in the photograph on the next page. It is clear that the school building was an EU-funded project and that money that went to an Italian NGO to undertake the project. The next photograph shows a school for a community in east Jerusalem. Again, the destruction of EU-funded aid is clear in the following two pages. The final photograph was taken in the Jordan Valley in the past week by a colleague.
On the basis of this data and the eyewitness testimony we have provided, I will outline a set of recommended steps that the committee could take to alleviate this destruction and, in line with international law, reaffirm Ireland's commitment to a just and lasting settlement of the conflict. The Ecumenical Accompaniment Programme in Palestine and Israel recommends that the committee should call on the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade, Deputy Flanagan, to attend a meeting of the Joint Committee on European Union Affairs ahead of the next meeting of the EU Foreign Affairs Council. We recommend that the committee makes the recommendation that the Minister raise the need to ensure accountability for the forcible transfer of protected persons and the destruction of EU-funded humanitarian aid in the West Bank and draws attention to the creeping annexation of area C. We recommend that the committee requests to be informed on the status of the destruction of EU humanitarian aid in the West Bank as well as the progress being made at the EU Foreign Affairs Council to counter this. This should be done on a regular basis by the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade and the Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade, Deputy Dara Murphy. We recommend that the joint committee request, as a matter of urgency, a debate in the Dáil on this issue ahead of the next meeting of the EU Foreign Affairs Council. We recommend that the members of the joint committee travel in an official capacity to the occupied West Bank to see the destruction and confiscation of this EU-funded humanitarian aid as it is being demolished.
I thank the members of the joint committee for their time and patience with our opening statement. We welcome any questions that committee members may wish to pose.
Seán Haughey (Dublin Bay North, Fianna Fail)
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I thank Mr. Dunne and Ms Derbyshire very much. We have some questions. Senator Craughwell is first.
Gerard Craughwell (Independent)
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I thank our guests for coming before us and for the time they, in a voluntary capacity, devote to this issue. I cannot imagine what it must be like to go to the West Bank and watch the wanton destruction that takes place. I cannot imagine what it must be like for someone who has an olive grove that is 1,000 years old, which is ripped out of the ground to put property in the area by force. I cannot begin to imagine the feelings of those little boys in the photograph as their school is being torn down.
I admire the fact that the deputation is neither pro-Palestinian nor pro-Israeli. The more I see of what goes on out there, the stronger my views become. I wrote to the members of the Israeli Government at one stage. I told them that the only thing they had learned from the treatment they received under the jackboot was that they learned how to wear a jackboot far better than those who had caused the holocaust. Perhaps they are not sending people to gas chambers, but, by God, they are destroying lives. I support everything the deputation has asked for, and more besides. I will not ask the deputation to comment on anything I have to say. I feel disgust and anger at what is the most blatant example of man's inhumanity to man. This is supported by some of the greatest powers in the world. If, for once, some of those powerful people decided they were not going to support this anymore, things might improve. They are being supported for political reasons. There are no other reasons.
I admire the work of the members of the deputation and I congratulate them for what they have done. I congratulate them on coming before the committee in an even-handed and non-partisan role. I will do everything in my power. I will raise this matter in Seanad Éireann. I support the call of the deputation for the committee to go there, although following some of the things I have said I would probably be locked up the moment I arrived in Jerusalem. They do not take kindly to people who criticise them. I think they should be bloody well ashamed of themselves. I thank the deputation for their time. I hope they get some time at home before going back out there for a while.
Seán Haughey (Dublin Bay North, Fianna Fail)
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Are there any other comments or questions?
Eamon Scanlon (Sligo-Leitrim, Fianna Fail)
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I am not a member of the committee but I was notified of the presentation today. I have met Mr. Dunne previously although I have not met Ms Derbyshire. I wish to follow on from what has been said already. I simply cannot understand it. The situation in America is going to make things even worse if we are to believe what we read in the newspapers and what we hear. The wanton destruction of schools and property is dreadful. In some cases, the homes, businesses and livelihoods of people are blown away overnight. I cannot understand it. As Senator Craughwell said, some of the greatest powers in the world have supported this for years. I wonder how focused the UN is on this question. I know the UN is spending €2.4 million on facilities under threat after €1 million worth of facilities have been wiped out already. I am unsure whether the UN is taking a strong enough line on it.
It is easy to say what should be done. I do not have the answers but I feel disgusted at what is going on there. It is wrong. All I can say is that I support the four recommendations. I have spoken to Deputy O'Rourke on the matter. I gather we will make a joint request for a debate on the matter in the Dáil. I congratulate the members of the group on the work they are doing and I wish them every success.
Seán Haughey (Dublin Bay North, Fianna Fail)
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I now call on Deputy O'Rourke.
Frank O'Rourke (Kildare North, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the witnesses for their presentation and what they have outlined. I congratulate them on the work they have done and the very measured presentation they have given here today without any agenda. They have just told it as it is. Far too often we have different groupings and individuals stating a position or giving a presentation with a particular agenda and sometimes that can negatively affect getting the message through. That is certainly not the case here so I compliment the witnesses.
When one looks through the presentations and sees what has been outlined, one thinks of the saying that a picture paints a thousand words. The witnesses did that very well in their presentation. It is absolutely horrifying to see what is going on. My colleague, Deputy Scanlon, and others will support their proposals in this and do whatever has to be done. We need to increase focus, heighten awareness and continue to profile what is happening to bring attention to the fact that something needs to be done. It is not acceptable. One sees the school for example. We have seen this far too often on different scales and spectrums in different countries where buildings and people's lives are destroyed by this type of action. That is not acceptable or good enough any day in any country for anybody. People are trying to build a life, progress themselves and then all of a sudden everything comes down around them. It is absolutely shocking and horrible stuff. If somebody gave Mr. Alex Dunne a blank sheet of paper and asked him what he feels needs to be done to assist in preventing what is happening at the moment and trying to get some level of normality back to the West Bank, what would he propose?
I echo what Deputy Scanlon said. We completely support Mr. Dunne and we will do everything we can to bring forward a debate in the Dáil Chamber and assist Mr. Dunne in any other way we can. I thank the Chair.
Seán Haughey (Dublin Bay North, Fianna Fail)
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I apologise to Deputy Crowe. I should have called him earlier.
Seán Crowe (Dublin South West, Sinn Fein)
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I welcome the group. I am aware of some of the work the witnesses are involved in and I am impressed by the group's pro-human rights and international law philosophy. The group does not take sides and also has a philosophy of non-violence. It is putting itself and its volunteers out there in the work it is doing. I have no doubt they comes across some difficult stories and they bring those images back home. That is part of the difficulty but there are also friendships and other things.
One of the difficulties we have as a committee is that people will want to look at the slides of Palestine and what has happened over the years. It is unfortunate that people watching proceedings at home cannot see the slides. At some stage we need to come up with mechanism through which viewers at home can see the presentations. Many people follow these meetings and it is difficult to do so because if one is not looking at the slides, one does not see the information contained in them. I do not know if that is something we can do.
The witnesses suggested a number of points for the committee to propose. It is probably unusual that they have asked the committee to do something. I support the group. What do the witnesses think the EU can do? We had the Commissioner in and one of the questions I wanted to ask was about Israel's favourable trading status with the EU. At the same time, EU property and taxpayers' money is being destroyed by this. One of the speakers said they do not understand how the world can agree to this. I do not think anyone agrees to it. I do not think people are aware of what is happening and what the Israeli army is doing on the ground. That is part of it. In some countries the difficulty is that as a result of war guilt, people do not want to be seen to raise this issue. A country might be progressive on certain issues but will not raise what is happening to Palestine and will not make any criticism of what the Israelis are doing. That is a difficulty. That must be part of the discussion in the future. How do we convince these people that these things are going on? They are not going on in our name but they are going on and we are allowing these things to happen.
I am aware there is a worrying crackdown by Israeli Government on NGOs and civil society groups. Have EAPPI and its volunteers been affected by this crackdown? Has it become more difficult for EAPPI to operate? Will the witnesses walk us through their own experience of demolition? What actually happens? What happens if there is an illegal Israeli settlement established in an area? If it is established in a city, for example, in a block of flats or one apartment, what happens after that? What does the Israeli army do to protect the settlers? Does it make the area around it sterile and so on? There are certain roads that Palestinians can travel which others cannot. Were the witnesses allowed to travel on the international roads? The witnesses are there to observe but they are not Palestinians and are not suffering the way Palestinians are so they probably would not go through the same difficulties such as checkpoints and so on. That does not take away from the work they are doing.
Last year, the UN reported that many structures, funded partly or fully by international donors, were demolished in the West Bank in 2016. The witnesses said there was a 96% increase. Why is that? Do the witnesses have a view on why that happened in 2016? The witnesses must have a view on that even if it is not their group's official view. In June 2016, the Israeli military demolished €74 million-worth of EU-funded structures and projects in the West Bank. How do we recoup those funds? They are taxpayers' funds. That money could do a lot of good. People look at this and ask why we are sending more money. How can that be recouped? Is it a case of court cases? How do we do it? Will it happen through the trade sanctions that some people will suggest? I have asked a question about what specific actions the witnesses would like to see coming from the EU.
Seán Haughey (Dublin Bay North, Fianna Fail)
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I thank Deputy Crowe. I ask the witnesses to be as concise as possible in their replies.
Ms Jenny Derbyshire:
I will very quickly reply to Deputy Crowe's question about how the EAPPI has been affected. I could describe a demolition but others have probably seen one as well. Like all NGOs, it has become more difficult to get into the West Bank. There have been people stopped at the airport and a number of EAs have not been allowed in. Does Mr. Dunne have anything to add?
Mr. Alex Dunne:
A high profile member of staff of the World Council of Churches was deported a number of months ago from the airport for supporting boycott, divestment and sanctions, BDF. EAPPI, as a programme, does not have a view on that and has not made a statement on whether it is for or against it. What was remarkable about it was that it was the first time someone had been deported directly from Tel Aviv explicitly as a result of BDFs, which is a worrying trend because we do not have a stance on it. To be deported for an ideology is worrying and challenging.
Some of the current legal steps that are going through the Israeli Knesset at the moment are seeking to advance Bills that could do the very same thing for Jewish people, Israelis and anyone around the world, that is, denying them entry into the country because of their report for BDS because that is essentially against Government policy.
Members raised a few other points. How do we explain the current spike in demolitions and why now? Since 2002 when the programme was established, what we as observers witnessed on the ground has been a successful Israeli Government policy of de facto annexation of huge parts of the West Bank and Area C, but we have not heard it as loudly and as clearly from different Israeli Governments as we hear it now. We are now at a point where what we see on the ground is in tandem with the political discourse taking place within this coalition Government. In practice and as outlined in the EU delegation's biannual report, of which the committee has a copy, discourse within the Israeli coalition at the moment has contributed to the creation of a coercive environment in the West Bank that aims to forcibly displace Palestinians from areas intended for settlement expansion. Perhaps most alarming is that the rate of these demolitions and displacement practices has grown at a time when international opinion has been clearly stated in the Middle East Quartet report and the latest United Nations Security Council resolution and at the Paris peace conference that was held last Sunday and which our Minister attended. In the background to all that, these demolitions have been increasing and that is worrying.
A structured dialogue between the European Union and Israel that was initiated in 2015 to look at this issue of demolitions is taking place. In December 2014, the EU and its member states committed to taking certain concrete actions on the demolition of EU-funded structures if the situation on the ground continued to deteriorate. This action included asking for compensation and calling for all demolished EU-funded structures to be listed publicly. Further, in May 2016, the EU called on Israel for an immediate moratorium on the adverse developments in Area C. According to press reports, the European ambassador has warned Israel that the continued demolitions were liable to harm EU-Israel relations. So far, a group of member states are very supportive of the move forward with compensation claims but no concrete action on the issue has been made or taken by the Commission or the European External Action Service yet.
Members asked what can be done now, how the UN fits into this and how we can advance other international diplomatic efforts.First, we welcome the international efforts and the latest UN Security Council resolution of December. We welcome the statements of Secretary of State John Kerry on Middle East peace. We welcome the joint declaration in Paris on Sunday. However, all of these international documents and fora are non-binding. In reality they are recommendations. We would like to see progress being made at European level and member state level on implementing some of these calls. To further that aim, Ireland alone or with like-minded European states could call on the European Commission to audit the full scope of European-Israeli relations.
On the level of implementation of a differentiation of commitments and reporting back to the council, let us have a look at where the relationship between the EU and Israel stands at the moment and the agreements that are in place. There was a freeze since 2009 on this going any further, but perhaps we can call on the Commission to examine it and see what parts need to be examined now in light of the deteriorating situation on the ground which, as we can see from the opening statement, the detail from the European Union, the United Nations and pretty much every international body in the world, is going in the wrong direction and away from a two-state solution.
Why the spike and what steps could be taken? It is important to note that we fund these projects. We pay for the buildings that are destroyed. We pay for them in a centralised pot. The EU's operational budget for last year was approximately €141 billion. We contribute approximately €1.6 billion to it. Of the total pot, approximately €2 billion is used on humanitarian aid globally. A fraction of our contribution - €23 million - goes into that pot. We can look at the demolition of these structures and ask if any Irish structure has been demolished outside the direct funding of two projects in the West Bank by Irish Aid. Not one structure funded by Irish Aid has been demolished. However, we can take the view that every single EU funded structure that is confiscated or demolished is ours. Our taxpayers' money is going into it. Ireland, with its significant historical background and experience of peace and conflict mediation, has a strong and powerful voice at a European level to push for claims for compensation for these assets and to draw a line in the sand and show that it is unacceptable for the structures to be demolished.
The reason the humanitarian assistance is in place is that Israel is not living up to its obligations under international law. Under the fourth Geneva convention, Israel is supposed to provide for security, housing and access to education and water for the population in those areas it occupies. When Israel in Area C does not live up to this obligation, the international community steps in. In this situation, the European Union steps in and puts these assets on the ground. That these assets are confiscated before they get to the ground or demolished when they get there is quite staggering.
To add one final point, I will quote from the minutes of a meeting of the Knesset Foreign Affairs and Defense Committee which took place in the middle of last year. I will send these minutes to the committee. In speaking on the destruction of European aid and the establishment of firing zones in Area C, it should be known that Colonel Einav Shalev, who was the operations officer of the central command of the Israeli army, is on record as admitting that the establishment of firing zones in this same area in the West Bank is used to expel Palestinian communities. In addressing a sub-committee of the Knesset Foreign Affairs and Defense Committee that was discussing illegal Palestinian construction in Area C, he told it that military training in live fire zones in the West Bank is used as a way of reducing the number of Palestinians living nearby and was one of the main reasons the Israeli army has increased its training in the Jordan valley. He stated that, "in places where we [the Israeli army] significantly reduced the amount of training, weeds have grown". He then spoke about the confiscation of international humanitarian aid before it reached its destination and stated that it serves as:
a [blow] in the right places. When you confiscate 10 large, white and expensive tents, it’s not easy. It’s not simple to recover.
I can send on those minutes to the committee. For us, that these structures are being demolished to make way for the settlement enterprise in the West Bank, which is what we have been witnessing since 2002, shows a clear determination of policy.
Seán Haughey (Dublin Bay North, Fianna Fail)
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I am reluctant to open up the discussion again, but I will allow a brief question.
Neale Richmond (Fine Gael)
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Unfortunately I had to substitute in another committee. I apologise. I was trying to watch the proceedings on a screen but obviously there was no sound. As someone who spent seven years in a local authority, did all the structures have planning permission?
Neale Richmond (Fine Gael)
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I want to go back to the administrative aspect and I am approaching this as a legislator who is coming through the Government. Did they have planning permission? Was it solely structures built by Palestine and the EU or were Israeli structures built as well? From a practical point of view and removing the military side of it, when we are dealing with enforcement orders-----
Neale Richmond (Fine Gael)
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I want to know if they had planning permission.
Neale Richmond (Fine Gael)
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If we can park the military side of it------
Ms Jenny Derbyshire:
-----in order to get planning permission the Palestinians have to apply to the Israeli military authority. Mr. Dunne noted that between 2010 and 2014 approximately 1.5% of applications for planning permission were approved. In 2015, no permissions were granted. People then build without planning permission - the Senator is right - and that is the reason the Israeli authorities give for the demolitions. However, people are building without planning permission because basically it is not given.
Mr. Alex Dunne:
On the issue of Palestinians being required to apply to the Israeli military for planning permission, the military occupation should not be confused with normal practice because it is not a normal practice. International law supersedes military law on the ground. Since 2009, which is roughly the period we have been discussing, the number of Israeli settlers living illegally in the occupied West Bank has increased by approximately 100,000. Since the Oslo Accords were signed, the number of settlers has increased by 270,000.
As we noted in our opening statement, one of the challenges, according to former UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon, is that the planning process is “restrictive, discriminatory and incompatible with requirements under international law [...] favours Israeli settlement interests over the needs of the protected population and makes it practically impossible for Palestinians living in Area [...] to obtain building permits".
Ms Jenny Derbyshire:
The reason given for demolitions is that there is no planning permission. The problem is that planning permission is not given because it is a military occupation. In a military occupation, however, the occupying power is supposed to give protection to the residents of the occupied area. We would expect this to include housing, schooling and so on. It is for this reason that people take matters into their own hands. We must look beneath the reasons that are given for these cases. We must also consider that settlers are given permission to build very big houses in areas where Palestinians have no water or electricity.
Mr. Alex Dunne:
I reiterate that the idea of this being a normal planning process is a misnomer. The body that takes care of planning and zoning in the West Bank is the Coordination of Government Activities in the Territory unit, or COGAT, which is part of the Israeli military. On its website, the group is described as a military authority that serves the needs of the settlements while overseeing the planning and zoning of Palestinian communities. That is a fundamental conflict of interest. Settlement communities in the West Bank under COGAT jurisdiction have representation on planning and zoning matters, while Palestinians do not. This is not consistent with Israel's obligation under international law - the Fourth Geneva Convention - to administer the territory it occupies for the benefit of the protected persons it occupies, in other words, the Palestinians living in the area. This is clearly a misnomer as it is not a normal planning process.
Seán Haughey (Dublin Bay North, Fianna Fail)
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It is important to get that clarification. I thank Mr. Dunne and Ms Derbyshire for taking time to appear before the joint committee.
Seán Crowe (Dublin South West, Sinn Fein)
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There is another recommendation.
Seán Haughey (Dublin Bay North, Fianna Fail)
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We will discuss that matter in private session.
Seán Crowe (Dublin South West, Sinn Fein)
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Will the committee vote on the issue?
Seán Haughey (Dublin Bay North, Fianna Fail)
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We will discuss Deputy Crowe's submission in private session. I thank the witnesses for briefing the committee on this important and sensitive issue.