Mr. Tom Parlon:

Well clearly, I came in at a different time, and this was like in 2006, 100% mortgages were the norm. So all of a sudden that changed, and, you know, the banks tightened up very much and then very shortly, within two years, the banks practically closed up in terms of lending to either construction or to house building. And it would have been very difficult at that time to make a case for building houses, when we had an oversupply of houses. But certainly, we began then a range of meetings with the banks to explain the situation on behalf of the industry and find out where they were coming from, and it was a bit of a cant, even lately. The banks always say, "Look, we're open for business, come in and talk to us", but in practice, this wasn't happening for a long, long time-----